What active XO?

[southbanner]

I've searched exstensively, but i've yet to come up with any solid options. Here's the dilemmia. Rockford Fosgate 8250 balanced to a pair of IDQ-31 EQ's, to a crossover (?), through to. Tru Tech T4.65 to CD-2 horns and 4 or 5 inch mids, Tru Tech t2.100 to IDQ-8 midbass most likely, and a pair of IDMax 12's on the bottom run off some sort of amp, undecided at this point. The question is, what XO could fit into this situation? any and all suggestions are appreciated.

[npdang]

Well, my top choice has always been the Behringer dcx2496. The price is absurdly low at $250 shipped now. It will do xover, time alignment, phase adjustment, eq, and more ... also has a nifty computer hookup so you can control the thing with a laptop, or a nice jog dial if you have to use manual controls.

I'm just curious though, aren't you going to have a big sensitivity mismatch between the horns and 4-5" mids?

And, if you can't tell I'm all in favor of ditching the analog eq's for a digital all in one solution :)

[southbanner]

well, i HOPING that since the horns will be 8ohm, i'll be able to squeak by using 4ohm mids...we'll see. yeh, i've considered the all digital route, i might just have to ditch those IDQ's, but since i have them...plus i can run balanced ...oh and they're really nice :D again, i'm open to whatever i can go with. does that piece require a 12 volt mod?

[npdang]

It does need a 12 conversion, which you can get here:

http://never.net/powersupply/

It's really the most comprehensive piece I've ever used. The best in terms of flexibility and power. Outputs are 9Vrms so that's pretty nice too.

Other than that I think whatever from Audiocontrol would work, or you could even use the Tru analog xover. You just wouldn't have the flexibility of adjustable slopes, accuracy, and points like a digital unit.

[southbanner]

my thoughts exactly on tru, or other analog pieces. i've heard the 4xs from audiocontrol has noise issues, so i don't even want to go there. it seems that a lot of competitors like to use the PXA-700 or 701 from alpine. would that be something worth looking into? my initial look at it gives me favorable impressions.

[npdang]

That (Alpine) would definitely be worthwhile as well, although the cost would be quite a bit higher for less performance than the Behringer. The remote face control and smaller size/convenience is a big plus though.

[joms]

and if you have an IVA-D300, you can use its touch screen ability to control the equalizer. It makes it damn easy to adjust any settings. =)

[slickone]

I can't really vouch for the behringer gear, but i can the h-700.. I am using it with cd-2 mylar's, morel mids and max subs so i am kinda familiar with what your doing...I have to say though, there is no way possible that a 4 or 5 will keep up with the horns unless you can 10x the power....10w to horn and 100w to mid..seriously....although I am doing a 2 way front and not 3, and the morel's are somewhat inefficient, unless you do a pro mid like phl, b&c or the sorts, audax has a nice one i hear, you will have a hard time with running 30+ watts to the horns. I am still debating on running a 3 way front myself, but if you are going 3 way, I would do a 8-6-horn...keep your 8's at 150-200 and lower and mids from 150-200 on low side and and 1k-1.4k if mini's or 600ish to 1k if full...

another thing you have to look in to, not too many processors out there that will do a true 4 way setup...dual bandpass abilities I mean...if you do find that, by the time you get everything that the h-700 can do, your in the same boat $ wise...I don't hear these noise issues that people are talking about but I am running ainet from a 9815 too and not running rca's to the brain like some are with a different brand source...if you use another brand head, I would find one with a digital out and use the controller for volume....your head will be dead (transport only) if you don't use alpine..

good luck in your quest though man...once you go the horn route, it opens a whole new can of worms imo personally....staging is out of this world

[kappa546]

the behr site doesnt have much useful info on the eq section of the dcx2496... i had no idea it even had any, always thought u had to pair it with the deq2496 which is what i was considering for a while and still might do. wanna tell us more about that?

[kappa546]

btw i was contemplating this setup for my moms car running digital from an ecd415 and i saw soemthing about a remote for the dcx? is this a volume control also?

[Eastcoast]

If i had it all to do over again I would go with the alpine h-700 and a compatible deck. Why fuss with extra peices, I would do the deck and processor and be done with it.

I run the p9 combo now and don't even think about anything else....but I also have a convenient way around the 250hz lpf for the midbass, which some people may not have.

A friend of mine uses that behringer unit and likes it alot.

[southbanner]

i'm also considering the p9 combo. i've heard about this freq problem on the midbass bandpass....can you elaborate for me, and explain what the problem is and how you fixed it?

[cam2Xrunner]

the behr site doesnt have much useful info on the eq section of the dcx2496... i had no idea it even had any, always thought u had to pair it with the deq2496 which is what i was considering for a while and still might do. wanna tell us more about that?

Bump, I'd like to know more info on the EQ as well.

[npdang]

The behringer works more or less like a computer. It has a set amount of "processing power" that gets used up as you do things. So nothing is set in stone, you can have 100 bands of eq on 1 channel, 10 on each channel, 5 on 1 channel, 2 on another anyway you like until the processing power is all gone. Likewise, you could also do 72db slopes on your crossover, but it will use up more power. You can set crossovers, time alignment, level adjustment, equalization independently over each input (3 of them) and each output (6 of them). You can also reroute or tie together any of the input/outputs as you like.... so you can group output 1 and 2 together so that any change you make on one goes to the other.

The eq on the behringer is also selectable into 3 types. Bandpass, lowpass, and highpass. Highpass and lowpass are much like your typical crossover, and "bandpass" is your typical parametric eq. You select your center frequency(anywhere from 20-20khz) and a q(1-10), and boost or cut +/- 15db. It's extremely flexible and you can shape any kind of response you want... unlike your standard 31 band eq where the 'q' is fixed as well as the center frequency.

For example here is my right mid/bass equalization which uses 5 bands of eq:

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/example5.jpg

Try getting that kind of funky eq response from a regular eq...

[DS-21]

How easy is the EQ on that thing to adjust directly on the unit? Behringer does not seem to have Mac-compatible software.

[10K2HVN]

When NpDang showed me how to use it, it seemed fairly (really) easy.. Simply push a numbered botton (one of each channel) and turn the knob to change the frequency (frequency steps were in small increments). im sure changing the slopes wouldnt be much harder then that..

[MIAaron]

npdang,
Are you running analog or digital into that unit? What source unit are you using?

[vibrator]

When NpDang showed me how to use it, it seemed fairly (really) easy.. Simply push a numbered botton (one of each channel) and turn the knob to change the frequency (frequency steps were in small increments). im sure changing the slopes wouldnt be much harder then that..

you can also tune it with a PC or laptop via a serial connection. you can download the software here: http://www.behringer.com/DCX2496/DCX2496_remote_1_16a.zip you can play around with it. seems like its pretty easy to use.

[npdang]

Both the front panel and the software are easy and intuitive to use. I was up and fully running without ever looking at the manual... and in fact I'd say the front panel controls are the easiest, most efficient controls I've ever used in a digital processor. The Alto drive 30, pioneer p9, alpine h701 completely suck compared to it in terms of ease of use.... mainly in the fact that you have to scroll through so many menus to do anything whereas the Behringer is pretty much push one button and you're there.

I'm also using the analog inputs with a Pioneer 860mp source... since there's no digital volume control on the unit or remote control it would just suck to use the digital input.

[DS-21]

you can also tune it with a PC or laptop via a serial connection. you can download the software here: http://www.behringer.com/DCX2496/DCX2496_remote_1_16a.zip you can play around with it. seems like its pretty easy to use.

But that would require subjecting myself to a PC....just a couple months ago I cleansed my company of them entirely, so it's only well-designed computers for me!

Cool that the on-unit adjustments work pretty well, though.

[FaintReality]

How many bands of EQ does the behringer unit have for ea. input / output? I could not find this in the manual, in which I downloaded the software to play with, and it looks like ea input/output has up to 9 bands?

Thanks, Dave

[npdang]

Hi Dave... there are no preset number of "bands" for each input/output. They are dynamically allocated from the available processing power available on the unit. Feel free to assign as many or as few bands as you want to each input/output until you run out of processing power.

[FaintReality]

Hi Dave... there are no preset number of "bands" for each input/output. They are dynamically allocated from the available processing power available on the unit. Feel free to assign as many or as few bands as you want to each input/output until you run out of processing power.

Not quite understanding the "until you run out of processing power". After playing with the Behringer software a little, I noticed ea. input/output is capable of having up to 9 bands of eq. With this in mind, I am assuming there is a limited number of bands available as a whole, say 70 for example. If this was the case, and say I used 9 bands on ea. input (27 total) as well as 9 bands on 4 of the 6 outputs (36 total). At this point, I would have used 63 of the 70 total bands available, so I would only have 7 bands left to use how ever I like on the last 2 channels before running out of processig power? Sorry, just a little unsure and trying to understand.

I'll go plan with the software more, and see how many total EQ bands I can get out of it.

Thanks, Dave

[dual700]

Both the front panel and the software are easy and intuitive to use. I was up and fully running without ever looking at the manual... and in fact I'd say the front panel controls are the easiest, most efficient controls I've ever used in a digital processor.

That's because you are such a smart individual :wink:

[npdang]

It really depends what kind of crossover you are using, time alignment, and other things. But I would say in the most EXTREME case... you wouldn't need more than 15-20 bands total. And you probably wouldn't need any eq on the inputs.

My car's pretty bad and I only use about 10 bands total with 20%+ processing leftover. You have to remember that you can set the center frequency and q anywhere you like... so with only a few bands you can make rather large and drastic changes... something you wouldn't be able to do with a regular 31band eq.

[epifant]

I'm also using the analog inputs with a Pioneer 860mp source... since there's no digital volume control on the unit or remote control it would just suck to use the digital input.

Am I just blind, or has the DCX2496 changed? I cant find any digital inputs on the rear of it, at least not in the image (http://www.behringer.com//DCX2496/DCX2496_rv.jpg) on the Behringer website.. I only see three analog inputs.. Wich excludes the 2496 if Im going to connect it to my G3 Powerbook via optical out (external soundcard, the ESI Waveterminal U24, to avoid grounding loops/-noise :(

[newtitan]

man where in the world are you guys mounting these things?


got pics??? trunks dash where they seem so large??


I want to try one simply becuase its cheaper than my h701 sittin in the closet.

and after reading the manuals for my 9860, its seems that scrolling through all the menus will be a real pain in the arse if you are a tweeaker like I am

and I REALLY dont want to have to go buy a d310 just to have adequate, user friendly eq/crossover control

Im not looking into buying a touchscreen alpine TME... as alpine told me that while id still have to scroll trough the menus on the deck, I could at least get a visual representation off the monitor if installed/wired correctly

if that makes sense

[mk1982]

wow that behringer processor is amazing. npdang, electrical noise has always been an issue because the behringer is not a '12v' device. has this problem now been overcome ?

by the way.

i was reading on another forum that EQs are great for correcting the in-car frequency response .. however i heard that the best sounding cars are not really flat at all ... as flat turns out quite 'boring' .. opinions ?

[mikemcus]

Wow that thing is huge. Another downside is the fact that all outputs on the back are XLR.

This would be an interesting X-over for those wanting to do a carputer system.

[npdang]

Noise problem has been overcome, there's a good thread on it somewhere.. although not inexpensively yet.

Flat is actually how you'd want it to sound, but the debate is how to measure a flat response. Mic location, window times, averaging, etc. will give you much different measured response.

[Derek]

they really aren't that big without the case on them :)

[tokyofist]

Am I just blind, or has the DCX2496 changed? I cant find any digital inputs on the rear of it, at least not in the image (http://www.behringer.com//DCX2496/DCX2496_rv.jpg) on the Behringer website.. I only see three analog inputs.. Wich excludes the 2496 if Im going to connect it to my G3 Powerbook via optical out (external soundcard, the ESI Waveterminal U24, to avoid grounding loops/-noise :(

check the manual. one of the three xlr inputs doubles as a digital IIRC.