Door Panel Deadening

[bikinpunk]

I got about 16sq ft from Ant of Damplifier Pro to do my door panels with. Curious if most of you guys are getting away with doing one layer, or if you do multiple first off? I'd planned to do at least one and then re-install the door to see what happens. Just wondering how many layers you guys are using?

Also, I'm swinging by Home Depot and picking up some extra weather stripping to co on the edges. Hoping to kill my doors by the time this is all said and done.

[AzGrower]

16 feet wont get you far on those doors

[bikinpunk]

16 feet wont get you far on those doors

I dunno. That's enough for 2 layers. I figured I wouldn't need more than that.

[tcguy85]

are you talking about the plastic door skins or the metal panels themselves? i think you're talkin about the plastic door skins.

[kappa546]

i used liquid deadener then glued ensolite on mine. did the job

[demon2091tb]

Did 2 layers on the outside skin, 2 layers on the inside metal and used spray adhesive from Rick back a few yrs ago for a layer of ensolite on both inside and inside metal. 1 layer deadener and ensolite on the plastic panel, i need more on the panels. 1 layer of 1.5" acoustic eggshell foam directly behind driver in the door, high enough off the bottom of the door as to not soak up any water, they stay dry. Also a layer of acoustic eggshell foam in all existing panel voids in the door panels.

The rattles open up when its above 70. :(

[IamWho?]

I am in the middle of deadening my doors now. I have used 14 sq ft of dam pro on each door. This was enough for them to be solid using the thump test. However, I could see that I was not going to have enough to use when I seal the holes with plexiglass. I figured that I needed about 4 more sq feet per door for that.

I ended up buying a half roll of BXT (which is more than I need for the doors) so I have been pretty liberal with applying extra layers. I am pretty sure that I have reached diminishing returns (with the 18' per door) but the fact that I have no intention of going back in the doors once I get the panels back on has lead me to keep applying more.

Just for kicks I applied 1 layer on one of the doors. I thought that was enough to get pretty solid. However, I really would not want to leave it that way considering all the work I went through to get to that point.

[lostdaytomorrow]

He's talking about the plastic panel. He's got the actual sheet metal part done well.

[bikinpunk]

He's talking about the plastic panel. He's got the actual sheet metal part done well.

Correct. I"m talking about the door card, panel, whatever you want to call it. The plastic part. I have about 5 layers of deadener on the sheet metal and 2 layers of ensolite. ;)

[Thumper26]

I think the obvious thing is to do half on each door. ;)

It seems that people put more types of closed cell foams than mass loaders on the door card.

[bikinpunk]

I think the obvious thing is to do half on each door. ;)

It seems that people put more types of closed cell foams than mass loaders on the door card.

haha, thanks Captain Obvious! ;)

I'm gonna pick up some wal-mart closed cell. :D

[Thumper26]

go for it. I'd think a memory foam pillow would work as well...

[bobditts]

You dont need closed cell foam for your door panels unless you are 100% sure water travels between your plastic panel and the metal door.

I would say 2 layers of deadener and 1 or 2 layers of foam would be fine (depending on how much space you have between the panel and the door)

[Abaddon]

You dont need closed cell foam for your door panels unless you are 100% sure water travels between your plastic panel and the metal door.

Are there vehicles where this isn't the case? I thought it was designed like that on pretty much all vehicles... I know my Mazda 3 flows a tremendous amount of watter through the doors...




and what about just for humidity and other sources of moisture?

[bobditts]

youre tellim me that the plastic door panel that is attatched to your door has water flowing DIRECTLY behind it? In my car, the water flows throught the door itself, not the plastic panel.

I suppose if you live in an area that is very humid, you wont want to use open celled foam. Didnt think about that.

[lostdaytomorrow]

Are there vehicles where this isn't the case? I thought it was designed like that on pretty much all vehicles... I know my Mazda 3 flows a tremendous amount of watter through the doors...




and what about just for humidity and other sources of moisture?
He's talking about the actual plastic panel that goes on the door, not the actual sheet-metal part of the door.

No car I know of has water come in contact with the inside of the plastic door panel.

[MadMaxSE-L]

youre tellim me that the plastic door panel that is attatched to your door has water flowing DIRECTLY behind it? In my car, the water flows throught the door itself, not the plastic panel.

I suppose if you live in an area that is very humid, you wont want to use open celled foam. Didnt think about that.

I hope what he means is that the actual doors have water in them, between the inner and outter skin - hopefully he has NO water between the inner door skin and the door panel; as this would be very bad and I don't think his door panels would last very long...

-Matt

[drocpsu]

Are there vehicles where this isn't the case? I thought it was designed like that on pretty much all vehicles... I know my Mazda 3 flows a tremendous amount of watter through the doors...




and what about just for humidity and other sources of moisture?

I think you're misunderstanding. The door panel/card is completely on the interior of the car. It hink You'd have a big problem if you had water travelling behind it...your interior door trim would be getting soaked.

[bikinpunk]

Use your noggin's here fellas. ;)

[avaxis]

how about rubberized undercoating spray for the door panels? stuff is cheap and according to the label works for sound proofing too. anyone tried?

[bobditts]

how about rubberized undercoating spray for the door panels? stuff is cheap and according to the label works for sound proofing too. anyone tried?

it really doesnt add much weight. Weight is the name of the game in deadening.

[bikinpunk]

youre tellim me that the plastic door panel that is attatched to your door has water flowing DIRECTLY behind it? In my car, the water flows throught the door itself, not the plastic panel.

I suppose if you live in an area that is very humid, you wont want to use open celled foam. Didnt think about that.

it really doesnt add much weight. Weight is the name of the game in deadening.

word. Mass loading is what lowers resonant frequency. Lowering resonant frequency (outside of the range that causes vibration) is the main method used to stop vibration.

[IamWho?]

Now I just have to decide whether I am going to say enough is enough or just continue to go ape shit with this stuff.

[bobditts]

Now I just have to decide whether I am going to say enough is enough or just continue to go ape shit with this stuff.


:confused: :confused: :confused: WTF are you talking about?

[tcguy85]

i vote for a layer of deadener(two layers if you have enough), and a whole bunch of foam. that should do the trick. i used a layer of deadener and then a can of expanding foam for both as well. the only time i have any buzzing is when the panel is ice cold.

i still need to get me some ensolite though!

[IamWho?]

:confused: :confused: :confused: WTF are you talking about?

Oh, I guess it would make more sense if you read my prior post in this thread. I take it you have not.

[bobditts]

Oh, I guess it would make more sense if you read my prior post in this thread. I take it you have not.


ah right you are. Makes more sense now. Sorry. You mentioned that you added one layer in the doors for the kicks.

Just for kicks I applied 1 layer on one of the doors


How does apply deadener to the doors help the kicks at all?

[FoxPro5]

word. Mass loading is what lowers resonant frequency. Lowering resonant frequency (outside of the range that causes vibration) is the main method used to stop vibration.

I don't mean it nitpick here, but that's not necessarily true. Some of the best of damping materials don't achieve their superiority due to their weight. They do so by the materials used and by being applied correctly. High quality damping products are used where weight is an extremely important factor such as aircraft.

This has been discussed many times on this forum (i feel like, anyway) but what you want is an effective damping material that will maintain its viscoelasticity over the life of your car. It also must maintain a semi-permanant bond to the vibrating surface as well. If the product fails to do this, it's not going to do it's job.

So, if you use multi-layering "deadener" then you have to understand those rules and apply the product accordingly. More is not always better and a multi-product approach can work great.

Your foil backed butyl mats are probably going to be the best choice on the plastic door card because they are technically constrained-layer damping systems. CLD is designed to turn shear forces into harmless heat. The constraining layer helps improve heretic nature of the butyl by both protecting it and keeping it "constrained."

You can also use an extensional damper such as the liquid deadener, but the problem is they don't stick to plastic very well and would fail the aforementioned requirements for proper damping. ED works by helping the resonant surface maintain its shape as the door card extends and recoils.

[DonovanM]

Now I just have to decide whether I am going to say enough is enough or just continue to go ape shit with this stuff.

Going ape shit FTW! :D

My doors tend to no longer stay open by themselves because they're so heavy. They're not sagging though, so all is well :D

[IamWho?]

ah right you are. Makes more sense now. Sorry. You mentioned that you added one layer in the doors for the kicks.


How does apply deadener to the doors help the kicks at all?

LOL, I guess what I said is open to more than one interpretaion. I didn't even think about kicks for drivers when I wrote that. I meant "for kicks" as in for shits and giggles. I knew I was going to put more on but I was just curious as to how one layer would do -- at least with respect to whether it "seemed" more solid.

[daesonn]

Did 2 layers on the outside skin, 2 layers on the inside metal and used spray adhesive from Rick back a few yrs ago for a layer of ensolite on both inside and inside metal. 1 layer deadener and ensolite on the plastic panel, i need more on the panels. 1 layer of 1.5" acoustic eggshell foam directly behind driver in the door, high enough off the bottom of the door as to not soak up any water, they stay dry. Also a layer of acoustic eggshell foam in all existing panel voids in the door panels.

The rattles open up when its above 70. :(

what does putting eggshell foam behind the driver do?

[bobditts]

what does putting eggshell foam behind the driver do?


have you ever been in an anechoic chamber? They are filled with egg crate. Basically the angles absorb and reflect the sound waves in such a way that there is no echo whatsoever.

http://theremin.music.uiowa.edu/Fac.Anechoic.html

[daesonn]

ah, i see. not much use in putting them anywhere other than behind mid/midbass or highs though huh?

Never heard a sub echo i don't think haha

[tcguy85]

ah, i see. not much use in putting them anywhere other than behind mid/midbass or highs though huh?

Never heard a sub echo i don't think haha

it belongs behind mids/mid-basses, to absorb the back waves of the driver.

[mattldm]

Ok, so I need some help in getting rid of the rattles and vibrations in my door panels.

Vehicle - 2002 Toyota Tacoma
Speakers - DLS UP6i

The speakers barely fit, in fact I had to trim out some of the plastic around the grill on the door panel so that the panel would go back in place. I have installed deadener on most of the metal parts of the doors, but I did not put anything on the plastic door panels.

The problem is that the door panels (the plastic interior panels) rattle and vibrate badly. I think that most of the bad rattles are comming from the window and door switch plates. But I can really feel the vibrations throughout the whole door panel wherever I touch it.

What should I do?
Deadener on the plastic panels?
Or what about foam? I was thinking of gluing some 1" thick foam to various areas of the plastic panels so when I snap them back on they will be pressed against the metal of the door, will this help or make it worse?

any pointers you can give me would be great!

[rockondon]

Ok, so I need some help in getting rid of the rattles and vibrations in my door panels.

Vehicle - 2002 Toyota Tacoma
Speakers - DLS UP6i

The speakers barely fit, in fact I had to trim out some of the plastic around the grill on the door panel so that the panel would go back in place. I have installed deadener on most of the metal parts of the doors, but I did not put anything on the plastic door panels.

The problem is that the door panels (the plastic interior panels) rattle and vibrate badly. I think that most of the bad rattles are comming from the window and door switch plates. But I can really feel the vibrations throughout the whole door panel wherever I touch it.

What should I do?
Deadener on the plastic panels?
Or what about foam? I was thinking of gluing some 1" thick foam to various areas of the plastic panels so when I snap them back on they will be pressed against the metal of the door, will this help or make it worse?

any pointers you can give me would be great!

Mainly do like suggested here in this thread.
Start be removing everything on the inside of the plastic panel.
Look it over well for anything that might rattle. Fix these problems first.
Then scuff the panel with 60-100grit. Clean well. Apply deadner [CLD is best]
Pay attention to the seams where pieces are joined. Pushing it into them.
I started by using 1.5in strips over the seams first ,then the whole panel.
And i like to use a roller.

The extra foam between the card and inner door cant hurt. Unless you haven't completely covered your inner door [plugged all the holes]. Otherwise the foam should be a closed cell. As to not absorb water.

[el_chupo_]

If its rattling do a layer of deadening, a layer or 2 of foam/ensolite material (not over the speaker:p) and then over /arround anything you know is moving, like the switches, door release against metal, etc.

[Bluto Blutarsky]

Plug all the holes. :o

1 layer of deadener. :)

Makes a better door panel instead of transducer?:rolleyes: