2005 STI DIY Install (shinjohn)

[shinjohn]

Hi Gang,
Well, I'm fairly new to this forum, but have been soaking up alot of info as of recent, and participating a little more in discussions here too! Thought I'd start to give a little back with some pictures. :p Rick's (STi<>GTO) install as well as many others, have inspired me to get going on my latest car audio project: an '05 Impreza WRX STI. It's been slow going, but I've at least finished the subwoofer enclosure (or mostly), and have made some progress on sound damping, and speaker baffle fabrication....

Please browse my PBASE gallery directly for all the details/description, but here are a couple of shots of the sub:

http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/57499048/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/57499052/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/57803116/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/59476159/medium.jpg

links for:
Overall gallery for the STI Install (http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/stevesti&page=all)
Subwoofer Picture Gallery (http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/sti_sub&page=all)
Start of the Sound Deadening Install - Thanks Rick!! (http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/sound_deaden&page=all)

The system architecture is still under flux, but here's what we have so far:
- RaamMAT and Ensolite foam for sound damping
- (3) Arc Audio 10D4 subs
- Alpine MRD-M1005 bass amp
- LPG 25NFA tweeters
- Seas CA18RLY
- Pioneer head unit (temporary solution to be replaced with Alpine IVA-W200/701 combo)
- mulling over front amps, etc...

When I finally get some sound going in there, I'll be sure to report/write a review.

Also, feel free to click on my sig to check out my Accord system, and other install work and projects I've done.

Questions, comments, suggestions are always welcome!!!!

[cam2Xrunner]

Wow great looking work so far!

[couchflambeau]

Not bad...... for the grills though, I'd have used a couple of these......

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=260-367

[STI<>GTO]

Lookin' good. Regarding your baffles, are they laminated 1/2" or 3/4"? I think we talked about them before, and I don't think you'll need 1 1/2" worth of spacer... I would think the driver would be hitting the door panel. At least in my car they would be... I hope I'm wrong though, because the baffles look good. Make sure you at least hit 'em with a couple of coats of primer, or just use some cheap undercoating.

Rick

[shinjohn]

Hey guys, thanks for the compliments.

for the grills though, I'd have used a couple of these......

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=260-367

Yep. That was originally what I intended on using. I've got a set of those, as well as magnets in one of my parts bins. After talking it over with the car owner, and thinking about how loud this guy likes to play his system, we decided to go with threaded fasteners for the most secure hold. I'm pretty positive the ball/socket fasteners would have held just fine, but with screws, nothing will move or rattle at all. Also, that grill is pretty much never coming off.


Lookin' good. Regarding your baffles, are they laminated 1/2" or 3/4"? I think we talked about them before, and I don't think you'll need 1 1/2" worth of spacer... I would think the driver would be hitting the door panel. At least in my car they would be... I hope I'm wrong though, because the baffles look good. Make sure you at least hit 'em with a couple of coats of primer, or just use some cheap undercoating.

Hey Rick, thanks for the feedback here, and also for your help over PM. You are correct sir, those baffles are 1.5" thick (2 x 3/4"). I already cut them out prior to getting your input, which was invaluable. I purposely made them thick, and planned to plane them down to get them to fit optimally. Since I didn't have the car this weekend, I didn't get a chance to work on getting them refined.

At present, I am very seriously thinking of remaking them too (note the v1.0 annotation). The speaker cutout is currently centered about where the old speaker used to be wrt the baffle. After a quick fit to the doors, it's clear that your suggestion of shifting the cutout up and towards the front of the car will allow me to make the spacer significantly thinner. Right now, that window mount/screw on the bottom edge of the glass limits the depth at which the speaker can be installed. I measured the clearance with the current spacer and I'd still need ~1.25" thickness the clear everything behind (in its current in-plane location). Shifting it, as you suggested, should get me down to about 1" thickness, which I think would be about as thin as I can get it. The STI door is really constrained on a depth perspective!

Oh yeah, and yep, plan to coat them prior to final install too. Thanks!

[couchflambeau]

BTW, your box is very similar to the one in my STi.... I reused it from my old 02' WRX. Since I only use (2) 10" ers I was able to build it smaller.... so much that it fits flush to the back seat and fits completely within the "arch" saving a bit of space....

http://members.cox.net/couchflambeau/Picture%20013.jpg
This is a shot from when it was installed in the 02'

Great minds think alike.... ;)

[shinjohn]

BTW, your box is very similar to the one in my STi.... I reused it from my old 02' WRX. Since I only use (2) 10" ers I was able to build it smaller.... so much that it fits flush to the back seat and fits completely within the "arch" saving a bit of space....

Great minds think alike.... ;)

Oh definitely!! :D ;)

Take a look at the cardboard template of the enclosure I was originally planning. It's pretty darn close to what you have:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/57499056/medium.jpg
Right down to the assymetry of the top angles.... (isn't that a *itch?)

I backed off a little and made the enclosure a little bit smaller to make sure there were no fit issues, since I noticed a bit more taper (when measuring the 5th time) than I originally accounted for. I should have just gone all the way, seeing your enclosure. :D

BTW, prior to building the enclosure, we demo'd the car with the sub from my Accord, pointed both forward and backward, and felt the output and low end extension were slightly better with the subs firing back. The difference in SPL was definitely noticable and measurable. How do you like the subs firing forward?

[niceguy]

The noticeable difference in output is the only thing that has prevented me from having permanent front firing setups...I've done enclosures similar to those shown here but missed the extra 'oomph' that rear firing setups gave...

Front firing sure are easier on the trunk space though....I've run a ported PG Ti10 and have gone back to a sealed Memphis MClass 12" but am looking at ways to save more trunk space still....

Good work BTW :)

Jeremy

[couchflambeau]

Funny thing is the tolerances almost killed me.... I cut the box to fit perfectly... almost couldn't get the stupid thing to fit once I carpeted it....

The front-firing woofers on mine are actually coupled to the passenger compartment.... also helps isolate some of the noise from the rear of the car.... anyhow, for my purposes 2 10's with about 200+ watts each in a frontfire config is more than enough for me. Perhaps firing rearward would probably net a few extra dB, no big loss. Besides, my amps are mounted to a baffle behind my sub enclosure.....

http://members.cox.net/couchflambeau/underseatmat.jpg

[alphakenny1]

wow shinjohn. didn't see this. nice work! shoot wanna help me design my trunk? lol.

[strong*I*bumpin]

Wanna save trunk space?...go IB! :D

[STI<>GTO]

Wanna save trunk space?...go IB! :D

Did I read on Nasioc that you are doing two 18's?

[shinjohn]

wow shinjohn. didn't see this. nice work! shoot wanna help me design my trunk? lol.
Hey Peter,
We can definitely take a look at your system. When you get out of class we can hook up sometime. When is school out?

For me, I had some momentum going on this STI system, but I've slowed down because my buddy went out of town, and then weekends have been packed solid with soccer games, kids stuff, etc...

Hoping to pick back up this weekend.... We'll see how it goes. :p


Wanna save trunk space?...go IB!

That was an option, but to be honest, I've never heard an IB subwoofer setup that was really to my liking.

Having tried all different types of sub designs in a car, I like the tradeoffs of a sealed enclosure the best. The Arc's low Q allow for a small enclosure with a nice alignment, and going with 3 10s gives way more than enough oompf. Power handling will also be great. The big downside in my mind is more the weight issue in a car like an STI. Most everything you do to improve the sound quality of the vehicle diminishes what it was originally meant to be: a fast, light, and nimble car. Hmmmm.... maybe I shoulda made the enclosure out of carbon fiber! ;)

[alphakenny1]

Hey Peter,
We can definitely take a look at your system. When you get out of class we can hook up sometime. When is school out?

For me, I had some momentum going on this STI system, but I've slowed down because my buddy went out of town, and then weekends have been packed solid with soccer games, kids stuff, etc...

Hoping to pick back up this weekend.... We'll see how it goes. :p


school is out next Tuesday! i'll definately give you a call. i need a box done for the DIYMA sub as well :D. well anyways good work and we'll be in touch.

[FoxPro5]

Looks very nice! Keep up the good work :)

[AzGrower]

you would be surprised at the holding strength of the rare earth magnets, there are some that can hold 250 lbs per square inch. Use a few of those for the grill and not even an elephant can get them off ...

[shinjohn]

you would be surprised at the holding strength of the rare earth magnets, there are some that can hold 250 lbs per square inch. Use a few of those for the grill and not even an elephant can get them off ...
Yep. I used to work as a disk drive mechanical engineer early in my career, so I've lots of experience with neodymium magnets. You do not want to mess around with those puppies! :p

[shinjohn]

Whew! I've been traveling, and then just plain busy this month, so I just now (finally) got around to working some more on the STI. The door deadening was complete (sans ensolite foam), as of the first post date, but I forgot to take pictures then, so here is what it looks like:

(Foam to be coming soon!)
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/60948844/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/60948854/medium.jpg

Installed the LPG 25NFAs and Seas CA18RLYs in the doors:

http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/60948853/medium.jpg
Yes, that's a passive crossover there, and OMG, run off head unit power too! :o

http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/60948852/medium.jpg
Full range run to these bad boys...

Please feel free to browse this gallery for more detailed pictures of the door speaker install:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/sti_door_speaks&page=all

I have lots of comments/review, which I'll post very soon in the review section. Questions, comments, suggestions are always welcome.

[shinjohn]

Long commentary/review over here, if interested:

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3889

I'll keep this thread's focus on install details....

[strong*I*bumpin]

Did I read on Nasioc that you are doing two 18's?
not me sir,but was going to do 2-15's IB.BTW good job on the doors

[shinjohn]

Quick update on this install....
Turns out that bass was the bigger priority (at least for my buddy :D) over completing the sound deadening, so here you have it....

Battery terminals and wiring upgrade:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/62053478/medium.jpg

Fuse holder/voltage gauge @ battery:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/62053479/medium.jpg

Power distribution:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/62053473/medium.jpg

Ground distribution:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/62053475/medium.jpg

(all hidden nice and stealth, BTW)
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/62053477/medium.jpg

the bass amp:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/62053476/medium.jpg

sub enclosure in the trunk (three Arc 10D4s):
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/62053483/medium.jpg

with plenty of trunk space to spare:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/62053482/medium.jpg

It's coming along, slowly, but surely. Questions, comments, suggestions always welcome.... :D

[jay]

is that just grill cloth covering the subs? if so, is there anything behind the cloth protecting the subs from stuff flying around in the trunk?

[shinjohn]

is that just grill cloth covering the subs? if so, is there anything behind the cloth protecting the subs from stuff flying around in the trunk?
Go directly here to see more detailed descriptions and pictures:

http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/stevesti

[shinjohn]

Short update:
- sealed up the rear doors with Raamat
- deaden'd door panels with Raamat
- added ensolite foam to door panels
- installed IVA-W200 to replace cheapie Pioneer Deck....

Alpine PDX-4.150 on deck for install, and then H701 processor.....

As always, feel free to just browse PBASE for more details and annotation/commentary.....
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/stevesti

Here are some pics....

One of the rear doors sealed up:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/63734415/medium.jpg

Matt applied to door panel:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/63734420/medium.jpg

Ensolite foam on door panel:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/63734435/medium.jpg

IVA-W200 really looks like it belongs in this dash:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/64284766/medium.jpg

A couple of comments:
- Rick is dead right about ensolite and how effective it is. Having done just the doors so far, and having done deadening, sealing, and foam in separate stages, I'm a believer in the foam. It's a great barrier method for rejecting exterior noise. I was skeptical, but it really works, and adds almost no weight!
- The W200, even though (at the present) is running its internal amp to a passive front stage, is quite alot better from an SQ standpoint than the Pioneer. The top end is alot more open and detailed. Also the sub sounds better as the pre-out signal is both stronger and cleaner. Can't wait to get the amp and other gear in!
- The Peripheral PTR7 is a great little device.... :D

[shinjohn]

OK, the system is getting close.... Here's an update on last weekend's progress.....

Sound deadened the rear of the vehicle with Raammat and Ensolite:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/66671017/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/66671024/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/66671038/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/66671036/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/66671045/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/66671048/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/66671049/medium.jpg

Installed the Alpine PDX4.150 and H701 BOTH under the driver's seat in a stacked configuration:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/66671035/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/66671039/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/66671042/medium.jpg

And finally, moved the tweeters (at least temporarily) to the kick panel location to let my bud try out different locations to see what he likes (please excuse the temporary mounting... i.e.- ghetto)
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/66671054/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/66671055/medium.jpg

As always, more detailed annotation and more pictures in my pbase galleries direct:

http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/stevesti

More detailed reviews coming up in the review section!

[ocuriel]

Love your work. Very neat & done right. Good job.

& I agree, the w200 looks awesome in your dash. Looks like it came from the manufacturer like that.

[alphakenny1]

looks awesome man!

[vwtoby]

where did you end up placing the LPGs?

[pontiacbird]

Hey, so how did the deadening job help with the road noise. My brother has a subaru, and honestly, i hate riding in it because it is extremely noisy.....everything is noisy, the engine, exhaust, but the road noise is just out of line, especially on rough roads.....

i'd just like to see a before and after comparison with this noise box :P

[shinjohn]

where did you end up placing the LPGs?

Actually, the LPGs are no longer in the install. They've been replaced with a pair of Hiquphon OWIIs, which are (I know, abhorrence that it is) masking-taped to the dash corners. I'll post some new pictures soon, I just haven't had a chance to take some and upload them. :p

If you read my tweeter review thread, I mentioned some of my experience with the LPGs. You can read there for some more info, but the short of it was that we experimented with a number of different tweeter locations in the STI, and they stayed the longest at the "sail panel" location on the doors. That seemed to be the best compromise we found for stage height, tonal balance, and coherency with the LPG 25s. It's funny because I liked the kick location the best (I will admit I am biased to that because I've had alot of success with kicks), but Steve (the car owner) really wanted a "higher" soundstage. We fought over this one a bit, but the customer (owner) is always right. :D ;) The A-pillar IMO, sounded terrible with this tweeter, even with alot of EQ and playing endlessly with crossover slopes. (and also time aligning all speakers to the driver's seat) I even tried putting ensolite foam on the dash as an experiment, and that helped, but isn't practical. I just couldn't get it to blend seamlessly, and the tweeters just plain sounded bad there. The sail location was a bit better, because we didn't have as severe of a reflection problem, but IMO it still was not optimal. I just didn't like having these LPGs too close to my ears.

Moving on to the OWII, I was really surprised that placing those suckers (as large as they are) on the dash was actually quite effective. These tweeters IMO are quite glorious to listen to in home, and they did work well in this car. I was able to quickly tune the system by ear to get very pleasing results. Not perfect (or up to my standards to leave them), but pretty darn good. They are a bit aggressive for my tastes mounted where they are, so next weekend Steve and I plan to move the tweeters to the kicks to try that awhile. I'm convinced that it will make a marked improvement in stage depth, tonal balance, and coherence.

I'll report back more later.

[shinjohn]

Hey, so how did the deadening job help with the road noise. My brother has a subaru, and honestly, i hate riding in it because it is extremely noisy.....everything is noisy, the engine, exhaust, but the road noise is just out of line, especially on rough roads.....

i'd just like to see a before and after comparison with this noise box :P

I felt that it made quite a large difference. Since I also did things in stages, I do have an opinion on what helps the most too.

But first, let me say this: the STI (and other Subarus) are noisy vehicles. The difference relatively speaking (compared to stock) was quite enormous IMO after doing the deadening. However, don't think that a basic deadening job will make an econo-box (which these basically are) sound like a luxury car. It would take ALOT more work than I did to do that. (and IMO, you'd have to make alot of other mods to the vehicle besides deadening)

Having said that some comments:
1) deadening the outer metal in the front doors and sealing them up did wonders for the mid-bass response, and reduction of rattles. (no surprise here)
2) ensolite foam is the real winner in my book for high frequency noise reduction from the road, engine, wind, etc... Putting this in after the door sealing and basic deadening did way more to drop the perceived noise floor than anything.
3) with the STI and probably other Subarus, the rear of the car is one of the biggest culprits (as Rick from Raamaudio notes). Thus, sealing the rear deck, etc... helps enormously with noise.
4) Rick's detailed tips and general advice really were dead on. His experience and customer service are as good as it gets in just about any industry, IMO. He's the reason I was able to do minimal sound deadening, with maximum results. Very good guy, and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend doing business with him to anyone and everyone. He's really that good.

Hope this helps.

[alphakenny1]

It's funny because I liked the kick location the best (I will admit I am biased to that because I've had alot of success with kicks), but Steve (the car owner) really wanted a "higher" soundstage.

i'm starting to become biased as well ;).

[JMichaels]

John are there any vents in the rear deck to let the bass back into the cab?

[Daishi]

There are no real vents, but there are plenty of huge openings in the sheetmetal. The problem is if you don't seal those up well you get tons of road noise from the trunk. If you want a fun experience drive around without the rear deck or seats in...it's like riding in the bed of a pickup it's so loud.

[shinjohn]

John are there any vents in the rear deck to let the bass back into the cab?
No rear deck holes; it's sealed up tight. The rear seat opening, however, wasn't sealed up. Just ensolite foam on the seat back. The idea is that the foam kills the HF noise, but let's the bass through. It's OK, but I want to redo the sub setup; it's just not where I want it to be.

[Gregor]

No rear deck holes; it's sealed up tight.

Did you leave any air holes for the rear vents? I was looking at this last weekend and with the vent fan on high there's quite a bit of air that comes out of the two large holes in the parcel shelf. As we see alot of wet weather in the Puget Sound I want to try and keep as much of the original air flow as possible. Plus with this heavy breathing kids in the back seats, the fog will never clear :)

When I spoke to Rick about matting the car he mentioned this issue and hadn't really come up with a good solution. He recommended building an air channel with some pieces of thin metal lined with Ensolite. I'll be looking into that when I do the rear deck ina week or two.

[JMichaels]

I never had bad road noise from the rear when the whole thing was matted and foamed along with the wood on the floor etc... but yeah that would definitely be a problem. I have just never heard real good results from a sub fired into a trunk that doesn't vent back into the cab.

What is your next idea?

[shinjohn]

Did you leave any air holes for the rear vents? I was looking at this last weekend and with the vent fan on high there's quite a bit of air that comes out of the two large holes in the parcel shelf. As we see alot of wet weather in the Puget Sound I want to try and keep as much of the original air flow as possible. Plus with this heavy breathing kids in the back seats, the fog will never clear :)

When I spoke to Rick about matting the car he mentioned this issue and hadn't really come up with a good solution. He recommended building an air channel with some pieces of thin metal lined with Ensolite. I'll be looking into that when I do the rear deck ina week or two.
There's very little open area for the vents, but I guess we did leave some. Look closely again at the pics and you'll see like a couple of small holes open, but for the most part it's sealed. Here in CA, it seems to be just fine.....
Out where you live, I can see your concern.

[shinjohn]

I never had bad road noise from the rear when the whole thing was matted and foamed along with the wood on the floor etc... but yeah that would definitely be a problem. I have just never heard real good results from a sub fired into a trunk that doesn't vent back into the cab.

What is your next idea?
I hear ya. The deadening was done in a more "minimal" manner, so we didn't go all out. Used basically one roll of matt + a few yards of foam. Didn't do the floor or the trunk. Because of this, I wouldn't even say that the rear is anywhere near "closed off".....

About the subs: we did some testing on sub configuration before building this first enclosure. Based on sheer SPL alone, the rear firing enclosure was the most efficient overall, and my buddy was looking for maximum slam so we went with it. I'm not at all satisfied with the sound quality though. It gets plenty darn loud though, which he enjoys. :D

I'm thinking one of two options now: partitioning off the entire trunk and sealing through the rear seat pass through in a front firing config (could be IB or small sealed, depending but the main thing is sealing off the trunk as completely as possible), or going out to the corners of the trunk with two separate enclosures. Each I think have their own difficulties and issues. The problem I'm trying to solve is getting bass response at 60 Hz acceptable. Through some quick and dirty measurements, I found that we're getting severe cancellation right at 60 Hz. There's plenty of low end grunt, but no real kick at 60. The resultant sound to me is sloppy, and EQing it back is futile. One might say that the sub would be OK playing just the very lowest notes, but I'm also changing the front stage to improve midrange performance (and keeping with 2-way up front) so it's imperative that I get the sub to blend a little higher with the new (smaller) mids I'm trying.

We'll see. I need to toy around some more and try some more experiments before I start cutting more wood.

BTW, any nuggets of wisdom and advice are always welcome. I just keep learning every time I tackle a new system with different constraints!

[JMichaels]

One of the best results I ever had was doing a large box in a deep spare well firing up at the trunk with the seats down. But I had to raise the floor with wood which took away pretty much all of my trunk. I know for most people that's not practical and it sure wasn't stealth.

For most cars I have seen I have never been happy with the size of the sub box that you get into the rear corners. I could never get mine any where near 1.cu let alone bigger but if you can I would think firing them from there with a pass through would be real good.

I'd like to hear it!

[02bluesuperroo]

I'm thinking of taking my pass through door off and putting up some kind of security screen over the hole like one of those black sun visors for cars or something. This should vent nicely into the cabin without looking too bad. In my WRX, if I have the pass through up, and with only one 12", I don't get very good bass response at all. It sounds great with the pass through open.

[Gregor]

Originally I was looking at these enclosures from Audio Integrations (http://www.audiointegrations.citymax.com/page/page/3182186.htm). They have enclosures for both rear corners of the car. On the passenger side, in the STI you'd need to remove or relocate the intercooler water tank.

At this point I'm leaning toward an IB setup for space savings and so I can close off the trunk at the back seat except for the hole for the sub.

[shinjohn]

Originally I was looking at these enclosures from Audio Integrations (http://www.audiointegrations.citymax.com/page/page/3182186.htm).
:o
Man, I gotta get into the enclosure manufacturing business. If these guys are actually selling qty at those prices, wow!

[02bluesuperroo]

:o
Man, I gotta get into the enclosure manufacturing business. If these guys are actually selling qty at those prices, wow!

They sell quite a few but the profit margin is not as large as it may seem. It's still cheaper than having a shop custom make one or you can always get the JL one that comes with a W6 in it for $750

[Gregor]

:o
prices, wow!

Ya, forgot to mention the other reason I was thinking about going IB is cost. With money, I'd save on the enclosure and extra deadening, I could put it toward some some high quality drivers and amp, or just lower the overall buget. What I had in mind would be lighter smaller, cheaper and hopefully sound better.

I'm hoping you can blaze the IB trail with Steve's so we can hear how well it works ;)

[bobditts]

you would still need the extra deadening. IB still creates rattles, especially if your trunk isnt allowing enough airspace for your IB woofers (approx 10 times the VAS).

[shinjohn]

you would still need the extra deadening. IB still creates rattles, especially if your trunk isnt allowing enough airspace for your IB woofers (approx 10 times the VAS).

Good point. So it's added weight for a box vs. added weight in deadening material. I gotta play around and experiment a bit.

I keep hearing that IDQs are great for IB, and the Arc 10s in this system are very close siblings.... Has anyone tried Arc series subs in IB? I still feel inclined to make an enclosure for them. Opinions?

[shinjohn]

This weekend was a busy weekend for me. Aside from home projects and family obligations, I squeezed in an afternoon to do a couple of things on this install.

New Door Speakers
Swapped out the CA18RLYs (already sold :D) for Peerless Exclusive 830882 5.75" mid-basses. I banged out a couple of 0.75" spacers rings, primed them up and popped them in. Since the STI is so limited in mounting depth in the doors, the Peerless fits MUCH better, with absolutely no intererence issues at all. With the CA18s, the door panels barely fit back on.

The reason to swap them out was for better midrange performance and integration with the Hiquphon OWIIs. Although we lost a HUGE amount of midbass response, the midrange and overall integration is MUCH better. I plan to redo the sub next to get get mid-bass back that way.

Pics of the Peerless:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/73328761/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/73328762/medium.jpg

Tweeter Locations
So we played around with tweeter locations too. First tried them on the dash, and then moved them to the kicks. IMO, the kicks are the only way to go, esp. with the Hiquphons. The positioning in the pictures below was temporary (obviously), and I plan to mount/integrate the tweeters into the stock kick panels, but keep them on axis as much as possible. Will update more later. I think this combination for the front stage is pretty darn good. The only improvement I potentially see is to swap the tweets for ribbons, or to go three way with a tweet/mid combo in the kicks. However, I think this is good enough, so long as I solve the mid-bass issue with the subs.....

As much as I'd like to put 8s, or even high excursion 7s in the doors, there's simply no room unless I rebuild the panel, and I don't have time for that. :D
Anyway, here are some pictures for you:

http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/73328827/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/73328830/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/73328833/medium.jpg
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/image/73328835/medium.jpg

A usual, you can go directly to my pbase gallery for more detail and commentary:
http://www.pbase.com/shinjohn/stevesti

[ocuriel]

Sweet pics. Nice gear.

[unpredictableacts]

great looking kickpanels the blue really sets the car off!

[chad]

What about your dead-pedal? I could not live without mine!

Chad

[shinjohn]

What about your dead-pedal? I could not live without mine!

Chad

Yeah, since the Hiqs are so big, taping them up in the position I want them in was not an option. To reasonably position them, we just stuck them as far back and "in the corner" of the carpet as possible.

The plan is to rebuild (modify) the factory kicks to get the tweeters as wide as possible. Hopefully sooner than later, as they are not it the best position now. :D

This isn't my car, but I couldn't live without a dead pedal myself, so I'm in complete agreement!

[shinjohn]

great looking kickpanels the blue really sets the car off!
It's a theme.
:o :p

[rcurley55]

I see you use the painter's tape as much as i do :)

I'll have the ow1fs's in my car for next weekend - I'd like to do the in car comparo :)

[shinjohn]

I see you use the painter's tape as much as i do :)

I'll have the ow1fs's in my car for next weekend - I'd like to do the in car comparo :)

Sounds good!

[Whiterabbit]

I may have missed this one, but Id like to know. We have heard the off axis performance of the hiquphons. We are aware of the uneven pathlengths between driver and passenger, even in kickpanels. And we figure maximizing footspace on the deadpedal is of great importance for driving functionality.

so why do you want to get those tweets as on-axis as possible in the STi kicks?

[shinjohn]

I may have missed this one, but Id like to know. We have heard the off axis performance of the hiquphons. We are aware of the uneven pathlengths between driver and passenger, even in kickpanels. And we figure maximizing footspace on the deadpedal is of great importance for driving functionality.

so why do you want to get those tweets as on-axis as possible in the STi kicks?
You're right above and didn't missing anything in my thread. No plans are really set in stone, but the direction is based on the (selfish) :D needs/wants of the driver (owner) who really wants the tweeters on axis. This is basically his listening preference: getting the most detailed and extended top end response possible from the tweeters.

Having said that, when it comes time to start getting the tweeters more permanently mounted, there's going to be alot more experimenting that needs to be done before this is locked down. I only had a short session (about 3 hours total) with the car last weekend to do the door mid install (spacers inclusive) and play with the tweeters. :D

[Gregor]

Just catching up on the pbase gallery and had a few questions. What voltmeter did you use on front of the battery? Is it fused? Which distrubution blocks did you use? Is nessesary to use a grounding distribution block?

[shinjohn]

Just catching up on the pbase gallery and had a few questions. What voltmeter did you use on front of the battery? Is it fused? Which distrubution blocks did you use? Is nessesary to use a grounding distribution block?
All of the accessories were from Stinger. They were all part of a wiring, distribution, and capacitor kit, though the cap never got installed. :D (got the kit for a pretty good bargain, about $150 shipped IIRC) I don't think they sell the exact same thing now, but its similar to the Stinger SWCKH44 kit currently available.

With a multi-amp system, I highly recommend using distribution blocks for both power and ground. There's a 100 amp fuse at the battery/LED voltage/fuse block, and then the power distribution block uses fuses appropriately sized for each amp.

Now about ground distribution: the block not only makes things cleaner from a routing perspective, but is also good practice to help avoid ground loops/noise issues. Once I found a nice, good, solid ground, everything got hooked up to that point through the block. Some guys go as far as to run 1/0 cable for both power and ground to distribution blocks.... which isn't a bad idea if you are drawing serious power for your amps.... But for most of us guys with more "modest" systems, using a good chassis ground and beefing up the ground under the hood (as part of the "big 3") should be plenty fine.

[Sephiroth619]

Shinjohn, not sure if you've addressed this already but why didn't you mount the 5.5" exclusives in the kicks and on-axis? Did you try it before mounting them on the doors? How do you like them being in the doors?

[shinjohn]

Shinjohn, not sure if you've addressed this already but why didn't you mount the 5.5" exclusives in the kicks and on-axis? Did you try it before mounting them on the doors? How do you like them being in the doors?
Did not try the mids in the kicks at all, due to space constraints. As it is, the tweeters alone in the kicks will take up some good space and require some nice fabrication work. The space is esp. tight on the left side, where the dead pedal is located, and it's not OK to cover that up for this install. Of course it's possible to get the mids and tweets in the kicks, it's just not the preferred approach by the owner. (I'm installing for a lifelong pal of mine)

This speaker selection was a progression from a larger 7" mid, with the full intent to keep this install as stock looking as possible too. The only way to get what I deemed to be acceptable midrange performance while keeping this system as simple as possible (i.e.-2 way, stock looking) was to move to a smaller size mid. (this because the doors are extremely shallow in the STI) In that regard, I'm pretty satisfied with the performance of the Peerless. They are worlds better in midrange performance to the CA18, but don't deliver hardly as much midbass response. I'm OK with this tradeoff though, given new plans for the sub and some recent testing in the car. I'd definitely recommend the Peerless Exclusives for their midrange capability. We'll see how long they last in this install though. :D :p

On the other hand, if I had my way, I'd really like to have put some Revelator 12Ms in the kicks with either the Hiqs or some Scan tweeters, and then a dedicated midbass in the doors. However, given that I'm NOT planning to rebuild door panels in this car; it's a moot point, again because I can't fit anything larger or deeper behind the stock panel.

Feel free to ask any more questions if you have them.

[Whiterabbit]

which means at one point a 7" mid DID fit in the doors.

and surely there must be a midbass driver that is 7" diameter or less but less than 3" deep. (3" being what I've been able to fit in a WRX door without doorcard modification)

letting you run a 4' or 3" in the kick along with its larger counterpart, the hiquphon tweet :)

[khail19]

But the owner of the car doesn't want kicks, and being a Impreza owner I don't blame him. Even if you're OK with losing the dead pedal, there's still very little footspace down there.

[shinjohn]

which means at one point a 7" mid DID fit in the doors.

and surely there must be a midbass driver that is 7" diameter or less but less than 3" deep. (3" being what I've been able to fit in a WRX door without doorcard modification)

letting you run a 4' or 3" in the kick along with its larger counterpart, the hiquphon tweet :)

You crack me up dude! I'll let you talk to Steve (STI owner, Steve, that is) about that one. ;) :p

I hear ya, but I say a 7" isn't big enough!!!!!!

Remember, we're gonna be testing 8s soon. Who wants a puny little 7" dedicated midbass? :o :p (just kidding)

[Gregor]

Thanks for the info the distribution blocks. Regarding the new Peerless, what do you have cross over set at?

[Whiterabbit]

You crack me up dude! I'll let you talk to Steve (STI owner, Steve, that is) about that one. ;) :p

I hear ya, but I say a 7" isn't big enough!!!!!!

Remember, we're gonna be testing 8s soon. Who wants a puny little 7" dedicated midbass? :o :p (just kidding)

it just so happens that MY 8" driver comes in its own box ready for testing right next to its 4 ohm counterpart. remind me to get that to you before I leave for Japan on the 21st for the test.

8" midbass nothing. how about 8" driver capable of playing 20 Hz with ease :)

I think 7" is PLENTY for midbass in a wrx.

and you could easily make alphakenny1 vifa 3" style kickpanels, with a 2.5 inch hole cut in plastic and the driver mounted to it ;)

[shinjohn]

Thanks for the info the distribution blocks. Regarding the new Peerless, what do you have cross over set at?
I recall during initial setup that I had it crossed a little higher (~3KHz) with a fairly steep slope, but wasn't satisfied with that, so I think right now it's crossed somewhere about 2,600Hz, 18db/oct. That's what I recall. I think I may have bumped the frequency slightly lower (or gone steeper slope) for the right mid since it is a bit more on axis. I'll have to double check and report back. The tweets are crossed at about ~3.2KHz, slightly underlapped with the mids.

[shinjohn]

it just so happens that MY 8" driver comes in its own box ready for testing right next to its 4 ohm counterpart. remind me to get that to you before I leave for Japan on the 21st for the test.

Sounds good, will do.