VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build - Car Audio | DiyMobileAudio.com | Car Stereo Forum

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Old 03-04-2013   #1
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Default VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Here's my first build thread on this site. Hope you'll enjoy it. I'm very interested in acoustics and tuning so I'm gonna experiment with that when the build is closer to completion.

The car is a red VW Passat B5 -00 and I'm mostly into SQ but I also like to have some output, I listen to lots of EDM/EDM music and I'm kinda picky with my subs. This car's build has been updated/revamped two times already, so this is the third and hopefully final build in this car. Dampening and such things are already completed in an earlier stage. I'm posting pictures later...

Here's a quick overview on my equipment in any case;


# In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act # (George Orwell)

- Build Thread 1, Mercedes-Benz E 320T (2000) -

- Build Thread 2, VW Passat 1.8T (2000) -

Last edited by Hanatsu; 03-04-2013 at 03:57 PM..
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Old 03-04-2013   #2
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Here's the theory:

I find acoustics, installation and tuning to most important aspects in car audio. No matter how good equipment we use, the environment will 'always' be the bottleneck. We are pretty limited to the 'space' we got and this is a problem. I'm gonna experiment by using different techniques to tame the frequency response and decay by physical treatment before I apply processing. I'm using stock locations for midbass drivers (in doors), however all other locations will be custom. I'm doing a semi-stealthy build, not too flashy, neither entirely stock looking. Since I'm using more than 8 channels, I'm going to use both the P99 and the P-DSP for processing. I gonna stack time delay to reach 20ms+ for rear ambiance, this will also give me tuning control from the P99 over the rear ambiance speakers.

I find efficiency to be very important. I would have used Class D amps if I were buying amps today. Not gonna change my DLS amps though, they are great. The PDX amps are issue free, very pleased with them. I like the output and the small build size.


P99RS:

*Ch1/2 - DSP Passthrough (Fullrange)
*Ch3/4 - DSP Passthrough (With applied Time Delay for rear ambiance)
*Ch5/6 - Alpine PDX 2.150 (Rear Midbass)
*Ch7/8 - DLS A4 (Tweeters)

Helix P-DSP:

*Ch1/2 - PDX 4.150 (Midbass)
*Ch3/4 - DLS A4 (Midrange)
*Ch5/6 - PDX 4.150 (Stacked time delay, Rear Ambiance)
*Ch7/8 - DLS A6 (Subwoofer)

Equipment = As seen from the picture above, I'm using the following gear:

Amps:

*DLS Ultimate A4 - Midrange, Tweeters (4ch)
*DLS Ultimate A6 - Subwoofer (1ch)
*Alpine PDX 4.150 - Front Midbass, Rear Ambiance (4ch)
*Alpine PDX 2.150 - Rear Midbass (2ch)

Speakers:

*DLS Iridium 8i - 8" 'High end' dedicated midbass driver, made for IB setups.
*Fountek FR88EX - 3" Fullrange driver, used as midrange driver.
*Vifa XT25-SC90 - 1" Ring-Radiator Tweeter
*Seas L18/H1224-8 - 7" Midbass/Midrange driver
*Dayton RS125-8 - 4" Midrange driver
*Scan-Speak 30W - 12" Subwoofer.

Source:

*Pioneer DEX-P99RS (8ch active units)
*iPod Gen5 32GB or iPad Mini 32GB via USB

DSP/Processing:

*Pioneer DEX-P99RS (Built-in DSP)
*Helix P-DSP (8ch external DSP)

Power:

*2x Banner Running Bull AGM 95Ah
*0 gauge OFC power cable (Front - Rear)
*4 gauge OFC cable from distribution blocks - Amps
*10 gauge OFC cable from rear battery - Headunit.
*11 gauge OFC cable from rear battery - DSP.
*Filter capacitors 2x 0,047F 'DIY'
*Stock alternator (well, an upgraded stock 90A --> 120A)
*Battery charger; A large C-TEK unit will be installed somewhere together with a battery "switch".
*A Stinger 2x AWG0 --> 4x AWG4 fuse distribution block
*Autoleads 3x AWG0 --> 4x AWG4 ground distribution block
*Some no-name AWG4 --> 4x AWG10 distribution block (AUX power)
*AWG8 ground cables HU --> AMPS --> Multiple ground points.

Cables:

*Audison ST (Between HU - DSP and HU - DLS A4 rear channel (Tweeters)
*RG75x with Neutrik RCA-plugs DIY cable (Between DSP - Amps)
*OFC Speaker cables, AWG10-15 depending on speakers. "Slightly better than standard stuff" (I don't care that much for expensive cabling really...)

Install = I'm gonna use a 3-way front + rear midbass drivers + rear ambiance + sub. This equals 11 channels (Front Midbass, Midrange, Tweeter - Rear Midbass, Rear Ambiance, Sub = 11ch). I got both my Pioneer P99RS and my Helix P-DSP for processing, everything will therefore the build will be fully active.

Midbass, front = Installed in doors, these needs to be modified to fit the bigger drivers. The stock mounting hole is 6,5".

Midbass, rear = The 7" drivers will fit in the stock mounting hole, no modifications are needed here. Will be placed in rear doors.

Midrange = The small 3" drivers will be placed in sail panels. I've tried kicks and A-pillars before and sail panels were absolutely the best location. I've made custom aperiodic enclosures for them. The drivers are aimed on-axis towards listening position.

Tweeter = Will be placed very close to the midrange drivers, mounted in A-pillars. These will be aimed on-axis.

Rear Midrange (Ambiance) = These will be used to create a "larger room" by adding delay. They will used to enhance the front stage.

Subwoofer = The sub is mounted in a large vented enclosure tuned very low (26-27Hz). Tested eight different enclosures (3 sealed enclosures, various sizes - 3 vented, various sizes and Fb - one 4th order bandpass and an Aperiodic box). Went with the large vented, sounded best, best efficiency and great output. I'm using a 4" semi-external port.


And uhh.. pictures are coming!

# In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act # (George Orwell)

- Build Thread 1, Mercedes-Benz E 320T (2000) -

- Build Thread 2, VW Passat 1.8T (2000) -

Last edited by Hanatsu; 03-04-2013 at 05:27 PM..
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Old 03-04-2013   #3
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Some pictures:

Here's the car, nothing fancy really. It's in decent condition though. It's a VW Passat 1.8T -00. Chipped stage1 (210Hp). Wonderful car to install audio gear in. I might change spoilers and some minor stuff later this summer to remove the stock look a bit, don't want it to look too flashy though.

Note, some pictures are badly taken, from the phone I suppose...



My OLD build (which is removed now). I actually was in the process of removing stuff when I took the picture.



Everything removed, basically how the trunk looks right now. I've put the new sub enclosure in here.



Here's some DSPs, went with the Helix...



The old DLS Iridium 12i sub. Quite big.



The new Scan-Speak 30W sub, during burn-in for 4 days or so...



Building the midrange pods...



Pods completed. Well almost, I need to build the speaker grill as well. These will be placed in the sail panels.



Removed the cable mess behind the headunit and replaced it with my own. In the box there's a power filter.



Currently building this, should be completed and installed soon.


# In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act # (George Orwell)

- Build Thread 1, Mercedes-Benz E 320T (2000) -

- Build Thread 2, VW Passat 1.8T (2000) -
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Old 03-04-2013   #4
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

11 channels in an average-sized sedan? Crazy!
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Old 03-04-2013   #5
 
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

looks like this will be interesting!
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Old 03-04-2013   #6
 
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

interested to hear your comments and to see your build, looks great so far

here we go again, changes coming....why not!!!! YOLO
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Old 03-04-2013   #7
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

You have the exact same size midbass drivers in the front and rear doors. You have much more depth in the rear, but the same diameter drivers will fit front and rear. It's a 7" all around.

The install in my B5.5 variant was a lot flashier in the wayback, but was stealth up front.

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Old 03-05-2013   #8
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

A small update, pulled some old pictures off photobucket (about 2 years old) on how I did the wiring/dampening. I've replaced the cables now but the cable tags around the 'flex-tex' remain the same. You get the idea...



Incoming power for the headunit.



Replacement of the old antenna.



Dampening the outer layer of the door. Dual layers or something (can't remember exactly). It's on the verge of overkill really



Open cell foam on top of the dampening-mat. (Before you ask, I did this two years ago and I have NO issues with moisure, mold, rust, oxides or such. The OC foam improve stuff 'slightly'. It killed a few minor resonances I had but overall it didn't do that much good (other than improving midrange, which I don't care about. Not running my 8's that high). If I would've done the dampening part today I wouldn't have bothered with it.



The Stinger distribution block, still using it. It's great!




The entire roof is dampened with STP with added 0,5" (12mm) CC foam on top of it IIRC. It was really annoying removing the stock dampening, some special butyl rubber impossible to remove with both ethanol and thinner. Had to use an industrial degreaser with -Tetrachloroethylene- (poisonous stuff, however it does remove about anything...)

Can't find any pictures on photobucket right now, but I probably have the pic's saved somewhere. I'll have to go through all my 200k stored pictures lol...

# In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act # (George Orwell)

- Build Thread 1, Mercedes-Benz E 320T (2000) -

- Build Thread 2, VW Passat 1.8T (2000) -
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Old 03-07-2013   #9
 
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Very interesting project. I'd like to see how you managed to install those 8" DLS woofers to your doors. I have B5.5 Passat and have HAT L8V2 in my front doors, but the install was a real pain and involved some cutting, and the doorcards still need some filler and sanding before vinyl. I'm running L4SEs in the sails full range but the sweet spot is just too small to my liking. If I move my head I loose alot of detail in the upper register. I actually ordered the same Founteks and Vifa Tweeters to test if those would be better. The L4SE might be better than the Fountek, but installing 4"+ a tweeter is alot harder than a 3" mid.
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Old 03-07-2013   #10
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

I'll update and post more pictures this weekend... Working too much atm =/

Fitting 8"s is a bit tricky yes, but it can be done. I will do it slightly different this time since I also will rebuild the inner door panel. I bought another Passat -00 for $300 a few months back, experimenting and scrapping it for parts as I build (the engine was blown).

# In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act # (George Orwell)

- Build Thread 1, Mercedes-Benz E 320T (2000) -

- Build Thread 2, VW Passat 1.8T (2000) -
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Old 03-07-2013   #11
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Quote:
Originally Posted by hatemi View Post
I actually ordered the same Founteks and Vifa Tweeters to test if those would be better. The L4SE might be better than the Fountek, but installing 4"+ a tweeter is alot harder than a 3" mid.
Never heard the L4SE, I'm sure they're great though.

I will have the Founteks in sail panels and Vifas in A-pillars, mounted very close to each other. From listening and based on measurements I'll probably use these drivers from;

HPF: 250Hz/24dB L-R (Founteks)
LPF: 3800Hz/24dB L-R (Founteks)

HPF: 3800Hz/24dB L-R (Vifas)

I wouldn't go higher than 4kHz with the Founteks, they have their sweet spot in the 500-2500Hz area imo

# In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act # (George Orwell)

- Build Thread 1, Mercedes-Benz E 320T (2000) -

- Build Thread 2, VW Passat 1.8T (2000) -
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Old 03-07-2013   #12
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Looking sweet!

Subbed!

Never say Ooops... Always say, Aahh Interesting....
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Old 03-08-2013   #13
 
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hanatsu View Post
Some pictures:
Currently building this, should be completed and installed soon.
Clever, very clever.

I especially love to see European builds as compare/contrast with stuff in the states and what I'm starting to see here in China.

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Old 03-08-2013   #14
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Getting in for this one, can't wait to see what you do with that much channels.
I'm only using 5 speakers myself . I played with ambience for a while but had no means to delay it enough for it to work.
Do you plan on using L-R for that or some other signal.

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Old 03-08-2013   #15
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wesayso View Post
Getting in for this one, can't wait to see what you do with that much channels.
I'm only using 5 speakers myself . I played with ambience for a while but had no means to delay it enough for it to work.
Do you plan on using L-R for that or some other signal.
Using L-R for those too :P

# In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act # (George Orwell)

- Build Thread 1, Mercedes-Benz E 320T (2000) -

- Build Thread 2, VW Passat 1.8T (2000) -
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Old 03-08-2013   #16
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Good stuff so far...it's going to be a very nice system. Gotta love 11 channels of processing.

Looking forward to seeing more.
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Old 03-08-2013   #17
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Here's the other car I bought. Nice to have a car to experiment with :P



More wiring... Done with both PDX amps at least.



A blurry overview picture... It's far from finished though, looks like a mess atm.



My little relay/filter box. Inside there's a protective diode for the incoming remote turn-on. There's also 2x22000uF/25v caps in parallel with the outgoing power line to the DSP. Also a relay to turn on all 4 amps, fans, LED lighting etc etc. Installed a volt meter inside it as well. The cables are removable, used a pair of standard ISO/DIN headunit connectors. Looks a little messy up close, but I'll clean that up later... ^^





Going to use UV-sensitive 'flex-tex' together with some UV LEDs. Looks pretty neat. The colors looks weird in the picture, my phone didn't like the UV light or something lol.



Found another thing from the old install. Rebuilt sail panels for the DLS Nobelium1 tweeters I used before. Not gonna use these anymore... too bad, it was hard work getting those to look good. Seems like the paint got scratched while storing them too, now they look ugly instead =/


# In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act # (George Orwell)

- Build Thread 1, Mercedes-Benz E 320T (2000) -

- Build Thread 2, VW Passat 1.8T (2000) -
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Old 03-09-2013   #18
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Can't wait to see what you did with the XT25, is it still in some sort of waveguide?

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Old 03-09-2013   #19
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

I've removed the flange and I probably will make an "egg" shaped micro enclosure for it and "coax" it on top of the Fountek. I'm sort of aiming for a low diffraction construction. With the dispersion pattern of the XT25, I'm expecting great things

When I'm finished in the trunk I'll get right on it... kinda backwards from what people usually do but whatever

# In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act # (George Orwell)

- Build Thread 1, Mercedes-Benz E 320T (2000) -

- Build Thread 2, VW Passat 1.8T (2000) -
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Old 03-14-2013   #20
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Small update, not done much. Gonna do some work this weekend




# In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act # (George Orwell)

- Build Thread 1, Mercedes-Benz E 320T (2000) -

- Build Thread 2, VW Passat 1.8T (2000) -
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Old 03-14-2013   #21
 
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Crazy install.... Very clean
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Old 03-15-2013   #22
 
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Nice work!
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Old 03-16-2013   #23
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Small update again, painted the bottom layer of the MDF. Wrapped cloth over the top layer.

A small part of the connections will be visible on purpose. Will have UV-LEDs below which will light up the UV-sensitive 'Tex-flex', the shrink tube is also UV sensitive.

Not done with the wiring yet, so don't mind the loose cables








And starting tomorrow I'll skip the phone camera. The images look like crap =/

# In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act # (George Orwell)

- Build Thread 1, Mercedes-Benz E 320T (2000) -

- Build Thread 2, VW Passat 1.8T (2000) -
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Old 03-16-2013   #24
 
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Looks great bud! Well done so far!

Keep Calm and Chive On!
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Old 03-18-2013   #25
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Default Re: VW Passat B5 (2000) SQL Build

Double post...

# In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act # (George Orwell)

- Build Thread 1, Mercedes-Benz E 320T (2000) -

- Build Thread 2, VW Passat 1.8T (2000) -
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