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Old 01-08-2017   #76
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alrojoca View Post
As mentioned, different recordings, different speaker set ups, mike positioning etc, unless all were recorded in the same studio by the same engineer, even then, it is just not not a good a idea.



Here is what I heard, with iPad mini

1. Too far lacks too much midrange

2. Flat no character, the worst

3. Too close, too much midrange and upper midrange

4. A bit far, but better than all, the cello is barried deep in the stage, the best of them.
Thank you for posting your findings, and your opinion. It shows perspective. I was surprised by your findings.

My fiance' and I found:

1. Too tinny sounding, worst of all.

2. A little better than 1, but more flat. No depth.

3. By far the best by leaps and bounds. Speakers were gone as if live musicians were playing. Huge stage. Deep and wide. Perfect tonality.

4. Not bad as far as the stage they threw, but the bass was so muddy which made them unlistenable IMHO.

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Old 01-08-2017   #77
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkizeR View Post
now heres something that gerald doesnt get.. those speakers are placed in different locations than the ones in the other videos, as well as the recording device. that alone completely invalidates it from the rest
You could test the 4 pairs of speakers 1000 ways from Sunday in person, and the third set of speakers would outshine the rest by leaps and bounds. I'm so surprised that you cannot recognize this?

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Old 01-08-2017   #78
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

Quote:
Originally Posted by dcfis View Post
You can never get a total idea of the actual sound because you arent listening to the actual speakers but if you have an excellent Headphone/Dac amp combo listen to some of the Kenrick youtubes- of JBL and others playing music and you can definitely get a sense of the different speakers attributes as well as the Kenrick demo rooms character. After a while you will even begin to tell some of the customers homes characters as you know the speakers themselves well from KEnricks

The Kenrick JBLs, yes! He does an awesome job restoring those speakers. Man, I love his work. There is nothing that sounds more warm than 15" woofers filling the room with that pleasing bass, IMHO.

They have a sound that 12" woofers just cannot reproduce!

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Old 01-08-2017   #79
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

Quote:
Originally Posted by sqnut View Post
Gerald, everyone hears the difference between the four videos, even on cheap laptop speakers, BUT there are just too many variables that could account for it including the recordings themselves. It's just not possible to qualify those differences as one speaker being better than an another.
I disagree with you 100%. In my experience, I have auditioned speakers via internet videos and then confirmed my findings in person. What I hear over the videos is very close to what I hear in real life. A good sounding speaker or system, will sound good in person or on a video. As long as the recording device is of good quality.

With that said, there will be differences that can be only heard in person. As far as tonality, and stage. But my point is, and I can't stress this enough.

A Great sounding system or speakers is going to sound great when recorded from a decent quality recording device. Period.

There is no way you will find that if one records a system or speakers with a decent recording devise and it sounds shitty on the recording that its going to sound good in person.

But the opposite is true. A system or speakers that sound great via a recording are going to sound great in person.

Why people cannot recognize this is beyond me.

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Old 01-08-2017   #80
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

[QUOTE=Niebur3;4383882]I find it interesting that I pointed out all the real issues/differences with the videos and you won't acknowledge what I pointed out. I pointed out all facts.



I did on post #20

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Old 01-08-2017   #81
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

Quote:
Originally Posted by sqnut View Post
Agreed that HRA is a nice guy and an audio fanatic. He has some fixed but fallacious opinions, he often ignores logic and reason, but at least he doesn't brag about his $4K amps and $7K speakers and $13K cables....and just for that I don't like to bag on him.....well most of the time.
That's because I do not find that spending more $$$ Equates to better sound quality.

Sometimes it does.

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Old 01-08-2017   #82
 
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

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Originally Posted by Niebur3 View Post
May I test you hearing ability? Later, I will go to my car, and make 2 videos. I will make changes and I want you to tell me what I changed. If you are right, I will give you props and never challenge you on the topic again.

New Thread.......Gerald vs Gerald (Jerry)
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Old 01-08-2017   #83
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

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Originally Posted by RRizz View Post
You Gotta make this happen!
Yes, I agree. I've been waiting for the challenge.

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Old 01-08-2017   #84
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

Slow down champ and just answer my questions, don't wander off in telling us what you heard stuff. I'm asking logical questions, please try and answer them. For a moment, just forget what you heard.

Quote:
Originally Posted by High Resolution Audio View Post
I disagree with you 100%. In my experience, I have auditioned speakers via internet videos and then confirmed my findings in person. What I hear over the videos is very close to what I hear in real life. A good sounding speaker or system, will sound good in person or on a video. As long as the recording device is of good quality.
1. Gerald, apart from all the other issues that have already been mentioned, has it crossed your mind that most of these recordings are with a cell phone, i.e. one mic recording stereo information.....you're essentially hearing a mono recording. How is a mono recording throwing a stage?

2. Since you listen with cans / buds, you must know that cans and buds CANT throw a stage, period. A stage comes from cross talk from hard boundaries. There is no cross talk with cans and buds and hence no stage. The room here is the space between your ears, in your head. Describing a stage through cans is like saying you can see the big dipper during the day, an oxymoron for sure.

3. You're saying the speakers on the net vids sound very close to the speakers in real life? Really? The fact is that even the crappiest speaker will sound 100x better in real life than on a vid. First of all, how can you discount all the the signal degradation possibilities from the speaker to the vid and secondly, have you even considered the fact that, if you're not hearing the real speakers as much, much better, it's simply because you're not hearing that difference? You're listening to it but you're not hearing it.

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Last edited by sqnut; 01-08-2017 at 08:15 AM..
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Old 01-08-2017   #85
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

Let alone the fact that YouTube audio is also heavily compressed

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Old 01-08-2017   #86
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

Where's Ashton Kutcher and the film crew


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Old 01-08-2017   #87
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

Quote:
Originally Posted by sqnut View Post
Slow down champ and just answer my questions, don't wander off in telling us what you heard stuff. I'm asking logical questions, please try and answer them. For a moment, just forget what you heard.



1. Gerald, apart from all the other issues that have already been mentioned, has it crossed your mind that most of these recordings are with a cell phone, i.e. one mic recording stereo information.....you're essentially hearing a mono recording. How is a mono recording throwing a stage?

2. Since you listen with cans / buds, you must know that cans and buds CANT throw a stage, period. A stage comes from cross talk from hard boundaries. There is no cross talk with cans and buds and hence no stage. The room here is the space between your ears, in your head. Describing a stage through cans is like saying you can see the big dipper during the day, an oxymoron for sure.

3. You're saying the speakers on the net vids sound very close to the speakers in real life? Really? The fact is that even the crappiest speaker will sound 100x better in real life than on a vid. First of all, how can you discount all the the signal degradation possibilities from the speaker to the vid and secondly, have you even considered the fact that, if you're not hearing the real speakers as much, much better, it's simply because you can't hear that difference?
1. In my opinion, I can hear sound stage depth through the recorded reflections ( i guess) , even be it mono. There is no possible way for me to determine if a center image was in center or off center. That would be impossible.

But for me, I can hear a general type of stage. Open and expansive (deep and wide) vs shallow and two dimensional. I don't know how to explain using words the differences I hear, but I hear them.

2. I understand that, but if there is a deep wide stage present during a recording, I can hear differences verses a recording of a shallow two dimensional stage. Even though the recording be in mono.

3. All speakers are going to sound better in person. But like I stated earlier, if it sounds shitty over a recording its not going to sound great no matter what. If one sounds great in a recording, it will sound phenomenal in person.

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Old 01-08-2017   #88
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

The results so far of this thread lead me to believe that listening skills vary from person to person.

Harmon did research on this. When consumer reports rated their speakers lower on the list than others, they couldn't understand why.

After doing extensive research using control groups and such, they found that people most people cannot recognize SQ without being trained first.

After training, and testing their results showed that recognizing sound quality is a learned trait.

It is obvious to me that the speakers in video 3 are some of the best sounding speakers that I have ever heard. ( not yet in person )

They are made by Aerial Acoustics and are called the 5T.

If one takes further initiative and searches Youtube for that model and listens to as many videos as possible, one may come up with the same findings as I have.

This speaker sounds amazing on almost all videos because it is an amazing sounding speaker. If I were in the market for a set of home speakers, these would be my choice. Of course, I would have to demo them in person to confirm, but I'm 90+% sure that I wouldn't change my mind.

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Old 01-08-2017   #89
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

Quote:
Originally Posted by High Resolution Audio View Post
1. In my opinion, I can hear sound stage depth through the recorded reflections ( i guess) , even be it mono. There is no possible way for me to determine if a center image was in center or off center. That would be impossible.

But for me, I can hear a general type of stage. Open and expansive (deep and wide) vs shallow and two dimensional. I don't know how to explain using words the differences I hear, but I hear them.

2. I understand that, but if there is a deep wide stage present during a recording, I can hear differences verses a recording of a shallow two dimensional stage. Even though the recording be in mono.

3. All speakers are going to sound better in person. But like I stated earlier, if it sounds shitty over a recording its not going to sound great no matter what. If one sounds great in a recording, it will sound phenomenal in person.
I won't argue facts with you.

I will leave you with one thought, your real issue is that the TM is your ref sound, but it's only a WIP. How will you improve the TM if that already is your ref? The TM cannot be a world class experience unless you allow yourself to have a ref sound, that is at least a couple of levels above, where the TM is now. You have to hear the difference between the TM and something better, so that you can then come back and improve the TM. Step by step by step.

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Old 01-08-2017   #90
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

gerald, were all here because we all know at least the basics of what to listen for. otherwise we would all have deck and 4 installs. you are just delusional. im sorry to put it so bluntly, but there really is no other way to put it.

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Old 01-08-2017   #91
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

If my claims are not true, then how does one explain away post #26?

No one has yet commented on that post, or given a reasonable explanation:

Me listening to a video of said system,

and Benny Zs first hand description of said system

and how the two are congruent.

I have no idea of who the person is, to whom this system belongs. I just listened and gave my impressions.

What say you?

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Old 01-08-2017   #92
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

Quote:
Originally Posted by High Resolution Audio View Post
If my claims are not true, then how does one explain away post #26?

No one has yet commented on that post, or given a reasonable explanation:

Me listening to a video of said system,

and Benny Zs first hand description of said system

and how the two are congruent.

I have no idea of who the person is, to whom this system belongs. I just listened and gave my impressions.

What say you?
jerry has already said it. guesses at best.

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Old 01-08-2017   #93
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkizeR View Post
gerald, were all here because we all know at least the basics of what to listen for. otherwise we would all have deck and 4 installs. you are just delusional. im sorry to put it so bluntly, but there really is no other way to put it.

You have learned how to place center where it suppose to be and tune for tonality. You may have learned how to strive to make the stage high and horizontal. You may even know the theory behind making a system to have depth and width. And proper image and focus.......

But obviously, you do not have the skills to recognize a great sounding pair of speakers when you listen to one.

But knowing you, and how lazy you are, and how you like to post opinions without doing research just to make yourself feel like an authority, I bet you haven't even listened to the 4 videos to begin with.

Your comments indicate that there is no point anyway. And even if you did listen to the 4 videos and could recognize that the Aerials are the best sounding of the bunch, you would not admit it.

Your college education has made programmed to not accept fact for fact, but yet challenge everything. You're the type of person who if I put your hand in a fire, and you got burned, you wouldn't believe it was the fire that burned you. You would make up excuses and come up with a thousand different ways to try and disprove that it not actually the fire, but some other variable or coincidence. That is the type of person you are.

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Old 01-08-2017   #94
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

Quote:
Originally Posted by High Resolution Audio View Post


3. By far the best by leaps and bounds. Speakers were gone as if live musicians were playing. Huge stage. Deep and wide. Perfect tonality.
How can you hear a stage from a set of cans?
How can you hear depth and width from a set of cans?
How can you hear PERFECT TONALITY from an iphone recording played thru Youtube to a set of cans?
How can you not be trolling?

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Old 01-08-2017   #95
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

Quote:
Originally Posted by High Resolution Audio View Post
You have learned how to place center where it suppose to be and tune for tonality. You may have learned how to strive to make the stage high and horizontal. You may even know the theory behind making a system to have depth and width. And proper image and focus.......

But obviously, you do not have the skills to recognize a great sounding pair of speakers when you listen to one.
so your saying i know how to make a car sound good and the theory behind it, but i dont know good sound? interesting


Quote:
Originally Posted by High Resolution Audio View Post
But knowing you, and how lazy you are, and how you like to post opinions without doing research just to make yourself feel like an authority, I bet you haven't even listened to the 4 videos to begin with.
i actually did before i even posted anything. then again a few different times after various posts. how would you know if im lazy or not? here are a couple of my posts that should have indicated otherwise..

Quote:
Originally Posted by SkizeR View Post
now heres something that gerald doesnt get.. those speakers are placed in different locations than the ones in the other videos, as well as the recording device. that alone completely invalidates it from the rest
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkizeR View Post
and again.. different songs = different stages. 100% invalid


Quote:
Originally Posted by High Resolution Audio View Post
Your comments indicate that there is no point anyway. And even if you did listen to the 4 videos and could recognize that the Aerials are the best sounding of the bunch, you would not admit it.
your right, i wouldnt. i havent heard them in person. even if the videos did play the same song with the same positions and same recording position, i would just say "this VIDEO sounds better" (not "these speakers sound better")

Quote:
Originally Posted by High Resolution Audio View Post
Your college education has made programmed to not accept fact for fact, but yet challenge everything. You're the type of person who if I put your hand in a fire, and you got burned, you wouldn't believe it was the fire that burned you. You would make up excuses and come up with a thousand different ways to try and disprove that it not actually the fire, but some other variable or coincidence. That is the type of person you are.
interesting, i never went to college so idk what programming your talking about. and the only fact that came out of this thread is that you really are delusional. truly 100% delusional. your last analogy also doesnt make much sense.

ps, i would say the fire burned me then say fuck you for forcing my hand in it.. just like any other rational person

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Old 01-08-2017   #96
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

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How can you not be trolling?
because hes delusional and actually believes himself.

he reminds me of a guy i met on the chairlift at the local mountain the other day.. guy was spouting off about how all computers and devices are one "being" named samantha and she wants us to obey her wishes. and also there are giant heads in the sky that can shape shift back into planes when "non messengers" look at them. pure. fucking. insanity... just like this thread

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Old 01-08-2017   #97
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

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I won't argue facts with you.

I will leave you with one thought, your real issue is that the TM is your ref sound, but it's only a WIP. How will you improve the TM if that already is your ref? The TM cannot be a world class experience unless you allow yourself to have a ref sound, that is at least a couple of levels above, where the TM is now. You have to hear the difference between the TM and something better, so that you can then come back and improve the TM. Step by step by step.
I have listened to hundreds of reference systems. As I said before, I have flown across my country to California to listen to the Magic Bus and over a hundred two channel systems at one of the biggest home audio shows in the United States, T.H.E. Show in Newport Beach. I went in every room and listened to every system. One particular system cost about $750,000. ( not that price is a determining factor in all cases )

I went to the New York Audio show and heard many many more systems. I've listened to speakers from other countries. My experience with good sounding two channels is enough. I have demoed the best sounding two channel systems on the planet.

And I can remember what they sound like and the experiences. There are a few stand outs in my mind that I cannot forget.

Cabasse La Sphere which featured concentric time aligned three way with a time aligned sub-woofer enclosed behind.

and Quad ESL electrostatic system which sound stage went down my left and right sides like I was in the middle of a hallway and the sound was the left and right walls.

Some Gamut Audio speakers that featured Scan drivers.

and of course some Wilson Audio Sasha Series 2

and Vivid Giya whose designer worked for Bowers and Wilkins and designed the famous Nautilus speakers

and of course Bowers and Wilkins Diamond series speakers whose stage was the furthest away out of any system I have ever heard. The stage was about 12-13' away from where the speakers were placed. A very disturbing system to listen to. It was hard to wrap my brain around it.

And some small bookshelf speakers made by Focus Audio a manufacturer in Canada. The stage that these two little speakers threw filled up a whole motel room. I was dumbfounded as my eyes and ears did not paint the same picture. Still scratching my head to this day.

But the most incredible sounding speakers I have ever heard in my life were the Aerial Acoustics 20T. They feature a ribbon tweeter and Scanspeak 7" custom mid range. They design their enclosures with a box inside of a box with vibration dampers in between. Some of the best sounding speakers in the world. They are not well known, because they do no advertising and the factory is here in my home state of Massachusetts.

So I do have many references to refer back to. And my goal is to make the TM sound as close to, as good, or better than those reference systems if possible but not probable due to the room limitations.


Last edited by High Resolution Audio; 01-08-2017 at 10:03 AM..
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Old 01-08-2017   #98
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

I think "Samantha" wants Gerald to buy some ariels......
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Old 01-08-2017   #99
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

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Originally Posted by chefhow View Post
How can you hear a stage from a set of cans?
How can you hear depth and width from a set of cans?
How can you hear PERFECT TONALITY from an iphone recording played thru Youtube to a set of cans?
How can you not be trolling?
Want to be blown away? Find a set of the Aerial Acoustics 5T speakers and demo them. I have not heard them in person, but I bet you will agree with me that they sound incredible.

I can hear how well they sound on videos. Maybe you should open your mind up to the possibility.

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Old 01-08-2017   #100
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Default Re: Determining SQ via Internet Videos

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Originally Posted by claydo View Post
I think "Samantha" wants Gerald to buy some ariels......
lol Gotta love your humor and perspective on everything. You have some of the most reasonable posts on this forum. You and ErinH. Gotta love ya!

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