rear fill and 6 x 9's?

[Jcube69]

searching various older posts about 6 x 9's i found that many find rear fill unessesary or would rather downgrade/upgrade to a smaller component woofer in the 6 x 9 location.

i have also found that rear speakers tend to distort due to the subs interaction with the 6 x 9 cones.

any ways before i go into any further details im am currently running

oem components up front (upgrading to the pioneer 720prs curently planing on running the tweets passive untill i can get another 2ch amp)
oem rear 6 x 9s
2 dayton MK III's both 4Ohm 500rms each running in parallel powered by a kenwood excelon x1200m sub-amp
deck is a sony xplod (upgrading to pio 800prs)

and finally the compoent set above and rear fill (what ever it may/will be) will be powered by a kenwood KAC-X4R 4ch amp rated 75rms@4ohms and 100rms@2ohms

i am not quite sure what to do with the rear fill i believe i i would like to keep it as the few times i haven't had them it felt like it wasn't balanced or something was missing

my current plan was to find some decent 6x9s and use something like XTC 6"x9" Foam Baffle Pair to keep them separate from subs

i am not sure if how well that would work or not i suppsoe i can experiment but id like some other suggestions/ opinions from you guys first

and my car is a 1996 Pontiac Bonneville

[sqshoestring]

I don't think the foam will work for sub protection.

[Jcube69]

Originally Posted by sqshoestring

I don't think the foam will work for sub protection.

any thing u might suggest that would help? mabye if i coated the outside of the baffle with some form of resin? mabye fiber glass or somthing else........looking through a few things i belive i might go with
SOUNDSTREAM® SST6.9 6x9s

but suggestions are still welcome as well as any way to help seperate these from the subs

[60ndown]

spence?

[Jcube69]

Originally Posted by 60ndown

spence?

hmm?

[sqshoestring]

VBA!!!!!

The foam acts like a bag; it will fill but the other way it collapses. They are more for protection but will aperiodic the driver and cutting holes in them is great to adjust response. But that is not what you are after. Yes you could resin it sure, but pretty small for much bass. I used to build a larger flat box that fit the car and stuffed it 75% full of poly. That worked ok, though often not as good as IB they are designed to run in. You could look for something else, like a storage box at wallyworld or something, if you don't want to fab them up.

(vba=violent bass air, search for it here if you want)

[couchflambeau]

Originally Posted by sqshoestring

The foam acts like a bag; it will fill but the other way it collapses. They are more for protection but will aperiodic the driver and cutting holes in them is great to adjust response. But that is not what you are after. Yes you could resin it sure, but pretty small for much bass. I used to build a larger flat box that fit the car and stuffed it 75% full of poly. That worked ok, though often not as good as IB they are designed to run in. You could look for something else, like a storage box at wallyworld or something, if you don't want to fab them up.

+1 They'll be way over-damped in something that tiny.

[Austin]

Maybe he can vent it into the cabin...? Cut a hole in it and run a tube whatever size and run it back into the cabin and resin it up. Might be worth a try.

[couchflambeau]

Vent the subs I assume you mean? Venting the 6x9"s would be counterproductive...

[Jcube69]

Originally Posted by Austin

Maybe he can vent it into the cabin...? Cut a hole in it and run a tube whatever size and run it back into the cabin and resin it up. Might be worth a try.

Originally Posted by couchflambeau

Vent the subs I assume you mean? Venting the 6x9"s would be counterproductive...

o its couch ^.^ havnt seen you in awhile =p when i transfer up to UND we should together somtime...

yea i was confused too...the subs are already ported at 25 hz......i you ment venting them in the cabin still wouldnt help unless i sealed up my rear 6 x 9s since either way i get VBA distorting the subs.

i'm planing on making a custome fiberglass sset up for my trunk eventually after i finish upgrading (and building 2 more tests boxes for my subs)
when i do that i could test the whole seperate eclouser thing but if im going that far mabye it owuld be better modifying my rear deck and installing some smaller powered 8" woofers.
i was looking at the soundstream tarantula brand 6x9s i mainly want rear "mid-bass" fill but if its going to sound like shit i think i may concentrate on my front stage and wehn i have time/money screw around with seom rear fill options.

8" wouldnt be such a bad idea since i planed on running two more subs focusing more on the middle end anyway....hmm interesting thought


keep in mind my sub box measures like 5.3cubic feet of air space so ill quote MvM "i have a trunk the size of the alantic ocean"

[Austin]

Originally Posted by couchflambeau

Vent the subs I assume you mean? Venting the 6x9"s would be counterproductive...

true...haha i did mean the 6X9s but now that i think about it your right.

[sqshoestring]

IMO the 6x9 will be the same thing as many 8s, though more of a woofer not a sub as they can play higher. I prefer them for rear fill because they are the simplest one shot deal and I don't find that putting comps back there matters; the larger size of the 6x9 gives more midbass than 6.5s. I've used them for midbass before with good results.

[Jcube69]

Originally Posted by sqshoestring

IMO the 6x9 will be the same thing as many 8s, though more of a woofer not a sub as they can play higher. I prefer them for rear fill because they are the simplest one shot deal and I don't find that putting comps back there matters; the larger size of the 6x9 gives more midbass than 6.5s. I've used them for midbass before with good results.

assuming i decided to build some form of enclouser under my rear deck however how would the 6 x 9's really perform over other woofers such as a 6" or mabye an 8"
i understand they have a cone are of ~ an 8" yet they are also designd to work through IB.

if they, that is the 6 x 9's, had a sealed enclouser how well would they work? wouldnt they lsoe some mid-bass? .....if i used say 8" subs/woofers instead wouldnt i get some decent out put in the 80-200,250 hz range

dont think i really need any "rear fill" higher than 250hz it may be nice to add some tweets back there but i doubt id even try that untill i heard another system that had it implemented that would be over kill on the high frequencies in my limited in experience opinion (aka shitty opinion)

[na_rsx]

from what i heard 2 doors cars/hatchbacks do not need rearfill

[sqshoestring]

I would think to get 80Hz you should not need that big of a box on a 6x9, but those foam baffles barely fit more than the speaker inside. Best way to see it is to model an IB 8 against a low Q smallbox 8, and change the box size. You can go smaller with an IB type speaker you just lose the bottom end. As some point you start to lose a lot though, and you can't go that small. IIRC it is under vas you lose a lot of bass. (I would guess 1cf would be plenty, without looking some stuff up) The boxes I made were around shoe box size and worked fine.

[Jcube69]

Originally Posted by sqshoestring

I would think to get 80Hz you should not need that big of a box on a 6x9, but those foam baffles barely fit more than the speaker inside. Best way to see it is to model an IB 8 against a low Q smallbox 8, and change the box size. You can go smaller with an IB type speaker you just lose the bottom end. As some point you start to lose a lot though, and you can't go that small. IIRC it is under vas you lose a lot of bass. (I would guess 1cf would be plenty, without looking some stuff up) The boxes I made were around shoe box size and worked fine.

all i have to model is winISD if i could find all the t/s specs from a 6x9 id be surprised....6 x 9 iwas looking at was the top of the 6x9 shoot out if you google it you can find a pdf of the results but soem soundstream tarantual brands won..forgot the model but if i am going to get any 6 x 9s theyd be them (not because they won the whole thing but had the hiqest sq value with the power handeling i need)

Originally Posted by sqshoestring

.....against a low Q smallbox 8,....

by that do you mean low qtc, quality or somthing else? still not familiar with all the tearms that fly around here =\

[Jcube69]

Originally Posted by na_rsx

from what i heard 2 doors cars/hatchbacks do not need rearfill

my car is a 4 door and it is a VERY long car...i have a VERY big cab if i just use components with curent place ment...way at the bottom of my door panels any one who sat in back would most likly just get the massage from my subs and hear shit form front (im guessing may be wrong)

but because of VBA ill agree with everyone here pointless unless i build an enclosuer for them wont be hard just need to get all my stuff first and im more conserned about dampening before i start my fiberglass install