Simple SQ build, 2000 Toyota Tacoma Xtra-Cab

[simplicityinsound]

Well, after 3 grueling weeks building the Acura TL, it was a nice change of pace to do a very very simple SQ build in a Toyota Tacoma. On top of that, the customer, a fellow DIYMA member, helped me for two days doing some of the wiring and HU related work. So thanks David!

the gaols:

1. Achieve a high degree of SQ within a limited budget (he will be going to a few comps here and there)

2. Install the gear in a manner that is stealthy, durable and take up little usable space

3. utlize the existing equipment the customer already had on hand (HU, Sub, Stealthbox, one of the amps)

So here goes.

The signal starts with a pioneer Premier 800PRS headunit the customer provided, along wtih the ipod adapter, it is installed in the stock location. the cracked stock bezel was from a previous theft attempt.



the processing for the system is via a Zapco DSP6, and the USB tuning cable comes out of the glovebox for front seat tuning via laptop:



front stage is a set of Seas Lotus Reference 6.5" component set. the tweeters were molded into the A pillars, firing on axis with the opposite listener. I did on axis becuase i have realized from past experience, that trucks, seem to benefit from on axis a bit more, perhaps from the more upright windshield and the seating position.

after discussing it with the customer, we did the pillars in premium grade grille cloth, it puts less strain on the glue than vinyl and more durable than texture coat being the interior is black and grey anyway.









quick pics of the pillar process:

[simplicityinsound]

rings aimed and attached, mold cloth pulled, resin applied, and duraglass resin mix poured into the inside walls for reinforcement:



sanded smooth and blended in:



covered:





and termination of the tweeter:





the midbass are housed in fiberglass kick panels, again aimed on axis at opposite listener. carpted was used for its durabiltiy as this is a semi-work truck afterall

[simplicityinsound]

build up pics of the kicks:

the mold taken, allowed to dry over night, vent hole cut, and covered in sound proofing:



ring baffles aimed and attached:



mold cloth pulled, resin applied, and reinforced form the inside:



as usual, a layer of modeling clay and then another layer of sound proofing went over it, on the inside of hte kick, making for a very solid and "dead" kick enclosure. here the left one has the clay, and the right one is done with both clay and soundproofing:



the kicks trimmed in carpet:



speake termination of the midbass:



midbass attached to the baffle:



finally, grille secured and the baffle secured to the stock kick panel:

[simplicityinsound]

wires were run to the back, ziped every 6":





the DSP6 is under the passenger seat, secured to a MDF board under the carpet.



here is the jl stealth box the customer provided, he loaded it with a 10" dayton subwoofer:



termination of the sub and subbox

[simplicityinsound]

the amp rack is built to blend into the interior, and be almost invisible in normal view. while not hindering the ability to carry backseat passengers, (though its hard to imagine anyone squeezing back there for any long periods of time to being with hehe)

here are the two racks with the cover panel on:





lift the front cover off, and you see two Arc audio KX amps, he provided a 300.4 whcih sends 90 watts to each tweeter, and 350 watts to the sub, while i got him a 300.2 whcih sends 180 wats to each midbass.





again, very simple and straight forward.

and two quick pics of the suppporing struction behind the front panel:





despite very little tuning time on it, this truck sounds pretty good. the stage is suprisingly high with not too much rainbowing commonly found on trucks with kick panel mid, and decently centered. tonality is pretty good as well. i think with some more tuning, it will get better for sure. hopefully he can get a little tuning done on sat at santa rosa

well, now its time to relax and rest my sore back, with David's help, i got this truck done in pretty much 3 days leaving me two days to rest

[SWINE]

Cool!!! *subscribed*

[t3sn4f2]

I wish my budget was "limited" in that way.

[eriley]

very nice, I love your work. How do you attach your kicks usually?

[simplicityinsound]

depends, the ones that are molded to the stock panel, attaches of course, like the stock panels. the quicker cheaper ones that are attached to the stock panel, is secured to the stock piece, andt hen a piec eof HD double sided tape prevents laternal motion on the bottom side. so its very secure.

b

[Tonyguy]

I like this setup a lot because of it's simplicity. Great job once again.

[StickToRhythm]

I've got to thank Bing again for his great work on my truck. I've been waiting to do this system for much too long, and I'm really happy now that it's finally done.

The results are great so far, and I'm looking forward to spending some time really dialing it in.

From the moment I brought Bing into the process, he was really helpful, honest, friendly, and professional. I especially appreciate his patience as we nailed down the final design details to make sure we really got it right, and his willingness to let me participate in the install. He is an exceptional installer and a great guy, and I recommend him without hesitation!

Cheers,

David

[simplicityinsound]

pleasure working with you David as well. we will get you to one of these comps and see how you do

working on your truck brings me back to my first vehicle, a toyota truck, man i want one again...

[charcoal grey]

Originally Posted by simplicityinsound

build up pics of the kicks:


ring baffles aimed and attached:

What did you use for the blue portion on the rings? Also I am doing a very similar install, less the subwoofer. What size is that midbass? The truck I am doing is a manual trans, and I don't know if I can build a kick panel as large as that one.

[AdamTaylor]

Originally Posted by charcoal grey

What did you use for the blue portion on the rings? Also I am doing a very similar install, less the subwoofer. What size is that midbass? The truck I am doing is a manual trans, and I don't know if I can build a kick panel as large as that one.

low heat plastic

[JayinMI]

This needs to be a sticky....about 10 people a month seem to ask.

Jay

[StickToRhythm]

The midbass speakers are 6.5".

[glidn]

nice install as usual bing,

any reason you are leavign the cabling so long?

[ReloadedSS]

Great install, Bing. If I ever have the money (really inclination) for a full on install, you'd be one of my phone calls.

[pnn23]

Wow, great work as usual Bing.

[TREETOP]

I can barely believe I'm the first to ask this, but why add the DSP-6 when the 800PRS has built-in processing? For a 3-way setup the 800 has more than adequate adjustability, doesn't require a laptop, and it would have all been done prior to conversion to analog if used that way.

Other than that, clean install as usual. I like where you mounted the amps and how they're covered yet still showable.

[simplicityinsound]

Originally Posted by TREETOP

I can barely believe I'm the first to ask this, but why add the DSP-6 when the 800PRS has built-in processing? For a 3-way setup the 800 has more than adequate adjustability, doesn't require a laptop, and it would have all been done prior to conversion to analog if used that way.

Other than that, clean install as usual. I like where you mounted the amps and how they're covered yet still showable.

ummm...i am not quite sure what you mean? Assuming you have used both set ups...i guess i am not quite understanding the question? as the 800's built in processing and the dsp6 are not directly comparable at all...

IMO the 800 or the 9887, has just barely enough processing ability for a basic two way SQ active set up , for anyone seeking for a higher standard, a standalone dsp, with vastly more tuning ability such as the bitone, zapcos, or H701, is a better bet IMO.

having said that, the goal is still to go wtih a clean signal source, and it just happens in the "reasonable" price range headunits of today, the 800PRS has a good output, as a result, its a well suited peice of kit to start with.

there is no rule thats says, if you have a good aftermarket dsp, you must go wtih lower end units that dont feature any onboard processing of its own. right? (not to mention the relative lack of deadheads out there right now)...just look at how many of us run something like the 800 or the 9887 with a separate dsp, or a 9255 with a dsp or bitone

[TREETOP]

Originally Posted by simplicityinsound

ummm...i am not quite sure what you mean? Assuming you have used both set ups...i guess i am not quite understanding the question? as the 800's built in processing and the dsp6 are not directly comparable at all...

IMO the 800 or the 9887, has just barely enough processing ability for a basic two way SQ active set up , for anyone seeking for a higher standard, a standalone dsp, with vastly more tuning ability such as the bitone, zapcos, or H701, is a better bet IMO.

having said that, the goal is still to go wtih a clean signal source, and it just happens in the "reasonable" price range headunits of today, the 800PRS has a good output, as a result, its a well suited peice of kit to start with.

there is no rule thats says, if you have a good aftermarket dsp, you must go wtih lower end units that dont feature any onboard processing of its own. right? (not to mention the relative lack of deadheads out there right now)...just look at how many of us run something like the 800 or the 9887 with a separate dsp, or a 9255 with a dsp or bitone

You seem a little defensive, I'm not sure why.
Yes, I've used both the 800PRS and the DSP6.

The DSP6 shines when you're using amplifiers with symbilink input at a distance, which those ARC KS series (you called them KX series) don't/aren't, or when using a head unit with limited processing, which the 800PRS isn't.

Your first design goal included "within a limited budget". I just don't see how adding an $800 processor PLUS 6 Symbilink to RCA adapters is encouraging staying within that given parameter.
The 800PRS also does separate left and right equalization, active 3-way crossover with slope and polarity adjustments, and time alignment for every channel. BEFORE converting the signal to analog.
You're adding quite a bit to the signal path, which adds to the detraction from your other first design goal- "Achieve a high degree of SQ". Using the head unit's D/A converter and preamp, then out to RCA, then RCA to Symbilink, then into the DSP6 which has to convert analog back to digital for processing, then processing, then back to analog for output from the DSP6, then Symbilink to RCA so signal can be used by the amps.
To do the same things the 800PRS is internally capable of. With only RCA cables directly to the amplifiers.

I know you wouldn't have gotten to include your gratuitous laptop photo if you used the 800PRS' processing, maybe that's why?

If you want to keep the controls out of the customer's hands, say so.
If you personally feel more comfortable with the DSP6's methods of adjustments, say so.
If the customer simply has a hard-on for Zapco products, that'd qualify too.
Just don't start a thread with "1. Achieve a high degree of SQ within a limited budget..." and then completely contradict that. The 800PRS' processing is MORE than capable of handling the processing of the simple system shown. The added $1K or whatever of the DSP6 and the adapter cables could have been better spent in sound deadening, and cheeseburgers for 3 months. In my opinion of course. I like cheeseburgers.

[simplicityinsound]

so just to be clear...what you are saying is:

1. the only reason why one would use DSP6 is with zapco amplifiers?

2. 800PRS and dsp6 has basically the same tuning ability?

3. Anyone who uses a DSP of any type with the 800PRS is wasting his or her time?

4. the digital to analog back to digital back to analog route is not desireble, there fore, instead of using dsp6 or any zapco DC reference amplifiers(whcih uses that signal route), we should all just get a 800PRS or alpine 9887 instead?

thats what i am getting from ya if thats the case...then i think we just have to agree to disagree?

won't even go into the personal attacks in the last portion of your post.

still a bit confused, is this the first install of mine you have seen? if not, then this isnt exactly the first time i have paired a HU iwth internal processing and zapco DSPs, and the only time i use the dsp6 really is with non zapco amps...why the sudden interest?

[simplicityinsound]

Originally Posted by TREETOP

If you want to keep the controls out of the customer's hands, say so.
If you personally feel more comfortable with the DSP6's methods of adjustments, say so.
If the customer simply has a hard-on for Zapco products, that'd qualify too.
Just don't start a thread with "1. Achieve a high degree of SQ within a limited budget..." and then completely contradict that. The 800PRS' processing is MORE than capable of handling the processing of the simple system shown. The added $1K or whatever of the DSP6 and the adapter cables could have been better spent in sound deadening, and cheeseburgers for 3 months. In my opinion of course. I like cheeseburgers.

acutally, i will respond to these little gems

1. i took the time to teach the customer how to use the dsp6. as i do with everyone single one of them who tells me they want to learn. the customer is in the computer business and a diyma member, trust me, he likes to fidigit with these things

2. i do indeed like the GUI of the zapco dsp6, but as i said, IMO the dsp6 offers way more tuning ability than the 800prs, for one, it can eq the speakers individually. not to mention the infinitely adjustable parametric eq, wide range of Q factor etc etc. thats my opinion.

3. love of zapco is definetly not the reason he got the dsp6.

4. limited budget indeed, if you know how much i got out of my way to get people better sound within their budget, you wouldnt say that. in this csae for example, in order to fit the dsp6 into the scheme of things, i discounted my labor rate so heavily that if you factor net costs, adding the dsp6 came no where nera $800 gosh...maybe not even half that cost. infact, iwth the extra labor associated with installing the dsp6 into the signal chain. i definetly made LESS money selling it than just going rca straight to the amps. i also dont charge extra for any simblink cables on ANY of my installs, when i do anyhting that requires simblink cables, i just throw the cost into the labor. you can feel free to ask any of my customers who is on diyma, and see i dont do this kind of thing for everyone of them in the sake of achieve good sound.

5. adapter cables for dsp6? if you have used the dsp6, then you should know that it comes wtih the simblink to rca adapters, and i have built up so many rca to simblink transmitters from all the dc reference amps that i dont charge for those at all...


so...thats all i wanna say about that if you are reasonable and believe me, then thats great, if you just think i am here to lie to everyone and present a fake image...then i am sorry, or if you are one of those people who just wanna mock and ridicule me for the hell of it like peter euro, then thats fine too

as far as why i was being defensive, i guess someties, i just feel like people accuse me of dishonest motives for no real reason, and it gets to me after a while. I mean, we all have different opinions on how to achieve good sound, so its perfectly fair to say, hey, i dont agree with what you are doing beucase i think it wont help, but when you are blatantly hinting or suggesting that i am doing the dsp6 for some different, more sinister and selfish reason.... I really like to think that i go out of my way to help my customers, often at the expenses of my own personal financial gains...

[tintbox]

Well put. Nice install by the way.