Since installing my new mids I'm having a lot of rattles in my doors and it's very much attributed to the extremely thin sheet metal that my driver/ring are mounted to. So, to remedy this, I'm going to try sandwiching in my door skin using a sheet of mdf on the inner portion of the skin. The plan is to use 1/4" mdf, cut a template out to the shape of the sheet metal on the inner side and beef up the skin using this. I'm not completely sure I can get another sheet of 1/4" on the outer portion of that skin, but I'm going to try that, too. Then I will have essentially increased the thickness of that portion of the panel by 500% if I can get 2 sheets of mdf, and even 300% if only one sheet. I'm really hoping this will just about kill any chance of flex/rattles in the door alone. In a nutshell, I'm making the "baffle" as thick as I would a small subbox in about a 2sq foot area.
Has anyone else done this on their panels, and if so, did it help as much as I’m thinking it will?
The large contributing factor for doing this is that I need to do my best to stop all flex at the point of the driver. If I can do this, then the need to seal the access hole up with something very sturdy will have diminished greatly, and thus I can *hopefully* get away with simply laying deadener over the hole and not have to use wood or something equally as thick. I’m trying my best to avoid adding thickness in the access hole area because my door panel won’t fit back on my doors due to the odd shape of the door skin itself.
If all goes well, I'll start on this tonight or tomorrow and try my best to get pictures of the process. I'm hoping this will work. In theory it's all good, but who knows what'll happen in actuality.
My big question is how well will the wood 'fit' to the skin, though. I know it's not perfectly flat, so it may cause issues. I also wonder if it's worth the trouble to put clay on the portions that touch the sheet metal; I think not. Likely just going to deaden and put some sort of foam over them. I'll have to use overkill on the inside, but I won't have enough to do 2 sheets per door, so I'll have ot use some other sort of foam for the outer portions. Wal-Mart, here I come.
I covered the surface area/volume between the metal and .75 inch MDF with liquid nails type construction material. This provided some adhesion, provided some rattle prevention, and provided some additional mass.
^ Do you think it was worth the effort? Honestly, it seems like it would really work well, but it's still nice to get opinions before I go through the trouble.
I'm looking at bolting the 2 sheets of mdf together using a typical nut/bolt assembly and sandwiching the skin b/t the 2 sheets. IF I can get 2 sheets on there.
Don't use MDF, especially in the doors! No matter how well you seal it, the doors get very wet. The water will find a way in somehow-both into the door and into the MDF. I can picture the MDF swelling in your doors right now and torquing them all to hell. I can even see your door not closing properly or your windows not sealing. I would REALLY VERY STRONGLY recommend something else. Glass them up and see how that works, but don't use MDF. I've seen MDF that I left outside swell up 2x or even 3x its normal size.
Pioneer 880PRS, Tru SSLD6, Morel Supremo Piccolo, Hertz ML 1600, Morel 12" Ultimo, Tru Copper C7.4, Clarion DPX11551
Have you thought about using cutting boards/HDP instead of MDF? It can be had really cheap at a Big Lots/Tuesday Morning type of place. Then weather wouldn't be a concern. Just some food for thought bro.
Don't use MDF, especially in the doors! No matter how well you seal it, the doors get very wet. The water will find a way in somehow-both into the door and into the MDF. I can picture the MDF swelling in your doors right now and torquing them all to hell. I can even see your door not closing properly or your windows not sealing. I would REALLY VERY STRONGLY recommend something else. Glass them up and see how that works, but don't use MDF. I've seen MDF that I left outside swell up 2x or even 3x its normal size.
That was going to be my contribution to this thread. But, you beat me to it.
Ge0
Alpine, Zapco, Scanspeak, Image Dynamics, Critical Mass
Life lesson #1) En boca cerradas no entra moscas! (loose translation: sometimes it is best to keep your fuggin mouth shut and listen)
The years passed, mankind became stupider at a frightening rate. Some had high hopes the genetic engineering would correct this trend in evolution, but sadly the greatest minds and resources where focused on conquering hair loss and prolonging erections. - Narrator: Idiocracy
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Come to think of it, I think that you can get the cutting boards for cheaper than you can buy MDF. And you won't have to deal with the god awful dust that MDF throws when it's being cut. It's a win/win situation.
i would use sheet metal or aluminum flashing to cover up your door holes, then deadening on top of that...thats what i did in the Celica with the addition of Vertex Barrier Pad. The doors were DEAD and no rattles...too bad the car is totalled
Yeah, that aint gonna work out so hot unless you cover the MDF completely with paint or fiberglass to seal it.
The original plan (before remembering I have some cutting boards from last November) was to deaden the mdf.
Some of you guys who swear up and down that it'll get wet?... I had cardboard in my doors for 2.5 YEARS... and just removed that... not wet at all; not falling apart, nada, zilch. The only thing I had ever done was covered it in deadener.
The original plan (before remembering I have some cutting boards from last November) was to deaden the mdf.
Some of you guys who swear up and down that it'll get wet?... I had cardboard in my doors for 2.5 YEARS... and just removed that... not wet at all; not falling apart, nada, zilch. The only thing I had ever done was covered it in deadener.
Considering that deadener is waterproof, I'm gonna go out on a limb here and suggest that maybe, covering the cardboard in deadener is what made it waterproof. Seems silly to not provide full details of your original plan, and then criticize the (unanimous) suggestions. Cardboard doesn't swell like MDF will, either, so that was a much safer experiment. Good luck with the project.
Considering that deadener is waterproof, I'm gonna go out on a limb here and suggest that maybe, covering the cardboard in deadener is what made it waterproof. Seems silly to not provide full details of your original plan, and then criticize the (unanimous) suggestions. Cardboard doesn't swell like MDF will, either, so that was a much safer experiment. Good luck with the project.
That was the point... I kind of thought you guys would know that I would put deadener over the mdf. The post you just quoted (and somehow misconstrued my reply for criticism) was to point out that I had deadener over the cardboard and things worked out well for that... but, see, I didn't explicitly say I was putting deadener over the MDF. Assume = ass (out of) u (and) me
Now, before this thread turns into a typical OT thread... let's get back on track. I'll use deadener/mdf or the cutting board I have. Don't know yet. Likely a mix of the two since the cutting board sheets are about $10/each and I already have tons of 1/4" mdf.
If you want to go cheap as possible use the 1/4" MDF and make a template of the hole you want cut the middle out and glass the middle....that way it's not heavy....no worries about water damage...and any weird contours of the door skin will be easliy overcome.
You also aren't restricted to a flat one dimensional panel.
I still really strongly caution against MDF. It doesn't even take flowing water to make it swell. Even high humidity can do it. I've seen it with my own eyes. I can envision your MDF panel expanding and warping your door panel with it. You probably could use enough sealant on MDF to make it watertight, but after all that work, you'll kick yourself for not using plastic or glass.
Pioneer 880PRS, Tru SSLD6, Morel Supremo Piccolo, Hertz ML 1600, Morel 12" Ultimo, Tru Copper C7.4, Clarion DPX11551
Plastic it is. What sucks is that I can't seem to cut the cutting board I bought with a jigsaw; using different blades and going slow doesn't seem to make a difference.
The original plan (before remembering I have some cutting boards from last November) was to deaden the mdf.
Some of you guys who swear up and down that it'll get wet?... I had cardboard in my doors for 2.5 YEARS... and just removed that... not wet at all; not falling apart, nada, zilch. The only thing I had ever done was covered it in deadener.
I have untreated MDF braces inside my door between outer and inner skins to stiffen the door structure up. They are dry as a bone and have not swelled. Now, my MDF rings for the midbasses are sealed with thick layers of clear coat paint. I removed my door panel the other day just to check things out. They swelled up at the bottom! Looks Like I'll need to go with my original plan of Corian to re-construct them.
Ge0
Alpine, Zapco, Scanspeak, Image Dynamics, Critical Mass
Life lesson #1) En boca cerradas no entra moscas! (loose translation: sometimes it is best to keep your fuggin mouth shut and listen)
Why not use thin lead flashing sheet, fairly cheap depending on where you get it, but also has great acoustic properties, and it will curve to some degree to any odd shapes your door panels may have.
Gradually learning to do more and more with less and less until I can do everything with nothing.
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Originally Posted by chad
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Why not use thin lead flashing sheet, fairly cheap depending on where you get it, but also has great acoustic properties, and it will curve to some degree to any odd shapes your door panels may have.
not sure if that would add enough mass... and that's the name of the game here.
Sandwiching door skins with mdf.
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