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Old 12-07-2012   #276
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

I was looking at JBL's web site and I guess the passive crossover also has a tweeter protection circuit? Anyone know what part of the passive board makes up the tweeter protection?

2008 Honda Ridgeline JBL GX600c JBL MS8 JL HD900/5 JL audio 10tw1-4 x 2
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Old 12-07-2012   #277
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

The capacitor IIRC
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Old 12-08-2012   #278
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Any updates for running passive? I'll be ordering the ms52c's soon, I'm interested in what configuration you find sounds best to you!

Quote:
Originally Posted by carter1010 View Post
It seemed while running active I could easily push the MS52c to its limits while I could not do this with the C508GTImkii components. The C508 comps could take all the volume I have on tap (amp gains set with SMD1 at max volume, no clipping from Pioneer P9 combo at max volume). The MS52c can not and my volume is limited to -13db before audible breakup occurs. It was this lack of composure that made me curious about how the mid and tweeter interact through the passive. Initially I had the crossover set to 4k for both the mid and tweeter at a 18db slope. After installing the passive on one side I heard a very distinct difference in the passive slope and what I was running active. Once I matched the active to the passive as closely as I could, bandpassing the mid from 200hz and up and running the tweeter at 2.5 with a sharp slope, imaging was better, stage depth improved, and the resolution was better. I set the tweeter to -6db on the passive and am able to bring my volume up to around 8-9 before issues are present.

I really was not successful in increasing the composure of the comp set at the volume I wanted by using the passives and this was a bit of a disappointment. I was however able, and this was by accident, to improve the soundstage. Understanding the passive crossover that comes with the set, mainly letting the mid naturally roll off and set the cutoff of the tweeter to 2.5k seemed to improve sonic performance overall, with a sacrifice in power handling. I think this is why there is a phase plug on the mid in this set, to equalize the higher frequency output of the mid past 2000hz.

Right now the passives are in place as I want to spend some time with them before I go back to active to make sure that I understand how the set was intended to sound. Just have to be easy on my volume : )

I would be very interested in what opinions are out there regarding the passive crossover in this set and the frequencies and slopes of the dividing network which I suspect should be the same for both the 62c and 52c?
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Old 12-08-2012   #279
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

I know it's been asked a couple of times in this thread (just read the whole thing)... but hasn't really been answered.

How do these JBL MS-62C compare to the Polk MM6501? I was pretty much sold on the Polks until I read this thread... now it sounds like maybe the JBLs might be on par (or better) than the Polks. Has anybody tried both and can give a compare and contrast between the two? Which sets are better, and where are they better/worse?

What is the coaxial counterpart to the MS-62C? For example, the coaxial counterpart to the MM6501 is the MM651 (which is what I planned to put in the rear doors). What is it for the JBLs, and are they on par as far as bank for the buck and sound quality? Thanks.
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Old 12-08-2012   #280
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Quote:
Originally Posted by atbear View Post
I know it's been asked a couple of times in this thread (just read the whole thing)... but hasn't really been answered.

How do these JBL MS-62C compare to the Polk MM6501? I was pretty much sold on the Polks until I read this thread... now it sounds like maybe the JBLs might be on par (or better) than the Polks. Has anybody tried both and can give a compare and contrast between the two? Which sets are better, and where are they better/worse?

What is the coaxial counterpart to the MS-62C? For example, the coaxial counterpart to the MM6501 is the MM651 (which is what I planned to put in the rear doors). What is it for the JBLs, and are they on par as far as bank for the buck and sound quality? Thanks.
I don't know why the MM6501 is so popular... In my opinion, you can do much better for the money. The only thing that the MM does better than most is in midbass output and lower midrange - it has no midrange (sounds hollow) and no treble extension.

I'd choose those sets over the MM6501 if I was on a budget:
WoofersEtc.com - TS-D1720C - Pioneer 6-3/4" 260W 2-way Component Set - Sounds great and handle good amount of power - with this set, I'd try to keep the tweeter around 30° off axis. Great price too
MB Quart PVI 216 Component Systems at Onlinecarstereo.com - Like highs? This set has it all and is IMO the best set out of the 4 sets I suggested - if you don't have much power, this set is also very sensitive and lively. Please remember, a tweeter is only screaming if you don't install it correctly unless it really is a bad tweeter
Rockford Fosgate T2652-S (T2 652 S) 6-1/2" Power Component System - when people see RF, they usually frown however I've been quite impressed with their new sets. This particular set is the best bang for the buck in their line up and does everything better than the MM6501 - if you can go up to the T3 set, it really is worth it
WoofersEtc.com - SPX-17REF - Alpine 6.5" Type-X Series Component Set Good set from midrange to high - some say that midbass is a bit lacking but I actually find it to be quite good - just doesn't extend very low

Kelvin

Edit: never heard the JBL set so I can't compare...

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I'll repeat it for the miliionth time : All amps do NOT sound the same ... It's astonishing to me that nobody understands this
Who knows, some might understand now
and here's another one and another <-- click on the links
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Old 12-08-2012   #281
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Thank you, subwoofery. I really appreciate your suggestions, though it kinda makes my head spin. I'll stop here so as not to hijack this thread, unless somebody has a comparison of the MM6501 to the JBL MS-62C.
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Old 12-08-2012   #282
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Quote:
Originally Posted by teoulennon View Post
Any updates for running passive? I'll be ordering the ms52c's soon, I'm interested in what configuration you find sounds best to you!

I actually enjoy the passives quite a bit. I bridged my PPI 900.4 to them and reset my gains, set the passive at 0 db for the tweeter and they sound pretty incredible.

2008 Honda Ridgeline JBL GX600c JBL MS8 JL HD900/5 JL audio 10tw1-4 x 2
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Old 12-08-2012   #283
 
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Great! What x over points are u using for mids and tweets?
Quote:
Originally Posted by carter1010 View Post
I actually enjoy the passives quite a bit. I bridged my PPI 900.4 to them and reset my gains, set the passive at 0 db for the tweeter and they sound pretty incredible.
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Old 12-08-2012   #284
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Quote:
Originally Posted by teoulennon View Post
Great! What x over points are u using for mids and tweets?
I am using the passive crossovers. The only additional crossover point is from 200 and up.

2008 Honda Ridgeline JBL GX600c JBL MS8 JL HD900/5 JL audio 10tw1-4 x 2
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Old 12-09-2012   #285
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Quote:
Originally Posted by carter1010 View Post
I actually enjoy the passives quite a bit. I bridged my PPI 900.4 to them and reset my gains, set the passive at 0 db for the tweeter and they sound pretty incredible.
Bridging P900 for speakers seems a little ..insane? When it was driving my subwoofer, it was enough to make interior parts start to rattle. PPI900.4 bridged gives 300watts RMS with 12V battery, 450watts with 14.4.
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Old 12-09-2012   #286
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZAKOH View Post
Bridging P900 for speakers seems a little ..insane? When it was driving my subwoofer, it was enough to make interior parts start to rattle. PPI900.4 bridged gives 300watts RMS with 12V battery, 450watts with 14.4.

Its really not at all. Setting it with the 0db test tone of the SMD-1, dropping each driver to match the one with the least ouput, then eq'ing left and right sides (only cutting frequencies) and then eq'ing together (only cutting frequencies) I was left with very low output. I bridged the amp and things got better, but I think today I will reset with the -5db track and then I will let you know if its to much. I know the dude at Hybrid ran a JL HD 750 to each individual speaker in one of his cars and thats the only thing that gave me the confidence to even try it. It sounds incredible right now, but its not nearly loud enough.

2008 Honda Ridgeline JBL GX600c JBL MS8 JL HD900/5 JL audio 10tw1-4 x 2
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Old 12-09-2012   #287
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZAKOH View Post
Bridging P900 for speakers seems a little ..insane? When it was driving my subwoofer, it was enough to make interior parts start to rattle. PPI900.4 bridged gives 300watts RMS with 12V battery, 450watts with 14.4.
Not at all....yet another topic that has been beaten to death! If its something your not familiar with, there are some great threads explaining this in detail. Its some good education! Your also only talking about what its theoretically capable of......
Nothing wrong with that kind of power to anything (except horns....holy hell!!!!).

I'm willing to bet that anyone that did this (assuming quality install and tuning/not an idiot) would find the results to be pretty incredible. I have given that recommendation to MANY on here and every one of them had the same great results from it.
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Old 12-09-2012   #288
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Quote:
Originally Posted by carter1010 View Post
Its really not at all. Setting it with the 0db test tone of the SMD-1, dropping each driver to match the one with the least ouput, then eq'ing left and right sides (only cutting frequencies) and then eq'ing together (only cutting frequencies) I was left with very low output. I bridged the amp and things got better, but I think today I will reset with the -5db track and then I will let you know if its to much. I know the dude at Hybrid ran a JL HD 750 to each individual speaker in one of his cars and thats the only thing that gave me the confidence to even try it. It sounds incredible right now, but its not nearly loud enough.
I know you can tune things, but to me this seems like a waste of power/or extra channels. Without bridging, you already get near 140-150watts, which is something most speakers will not handle without very sharp high pass filter.
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Old 12-09-2012   #289
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

I know it's not the best test, but I'm still waiting for a few parts to come in before I can do the car install (want to get it right the first time) so I decided to test the MS-62 mids wrapped in a blanket powered by my Pioneer HT receiver highpassed at 80 then 50 Hz. Audition material was a few tracks off various Bass Mekanik discs. I wanted to run something a little more dynamic, but fucking iTunes decided to completely rewrite all of my old WAV discs so I've got a lot of housecleaning to do.

Anyway, I'm very impressed with the tangible midbass from this set. I could tell the difference in output quite easily when I had a good seal on the back wall with the blanket vs when I didn't. I could see what people were talking about with regard to the natural rolloff of the mid as I didn't really get the impression I was experiencing any breakup. The cone barely moved, but I could feel strong vibrations all the way up past my elbows. This makes me really want to focus on properly deadening the doors...

I would have tested the tweets and crossovers, but I want to keep those in as pristine a condition as possible before actual install. As of now, I'm on the fence whether I'm going to try to get the tweets into the stock location (sail panel) or just velcro them at ear level on the a-pillar aimed directly across the windshield using the angle-mount cups.
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Old 12-10-2012   #290
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

I plan on ordering a set of these components by this Friday hopefully and installed in the next week. I am so excited. This set has been getting a lot of praise and seems to be nothing but positive/happy reviews.

Very very excited and will post my review once I am done! :-)
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Old 12-10-2012   #291
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Hi guys, I've spent a long time lurking Diyma forums, but my 1st time posting.

I have pulled the trigger on a set too thanks mainly to this thread and the talk audio review, unfortunately jbl have no plan to bring them in to sell here in New Zealand, so I am having some sent from the States. I am quite excited also on seeing the improvement over my tsd 1720c comps, which never quite did it for me.
Do you guys that are running these think they should perform well via the passives, off an Eclipse ea4000 4ch @ around 75rms? Or should I look at getting more to them?

Cheers in advance.

Last edited by calibre; 12-10-2012 at 01:31 AM..
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Old 12-10-2012   #292
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Quote:
Originally Posted by calibre View Post
I have pulled the trigger on a set too thanks mainly to this thread and the talk audio review, unfortunately jbl have no plan to bring them in to sell here in New Zealand, so I am having some sent from the States. I am quite excited also on seeing the improvement over my tsd 1720c comps, which never quite did it for me.
Do you guys that are running these think they should perform well via the passives, off an Eclipse ea4000 4ch @ around 75rms? Or should I look at getting more to them?

Cheers in advance.
Maybe a bit late for you, but I believe this set is sold under the Selenium brand in other parts of the world. Perhaps you can find it under that name in your country.
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Old 12-10-2012   #293
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Quote:
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Maybe a bit late for you, but I believe this set is sold under the Selenium brand in other parts of the world. Perhaps you can find it under that name in your country.
Thanks mate, but no I have never heard of Selenium here? We have most of the jbl range here, but the importers said they have no intention to bring them in, that could very well change down the line, but you know how this addiction works, my trigger finger was itchy! even though they stung me an extra 55usd postage, they sound worth it, we really get ripped on pricing here compared to the US...
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Old 12-10-2012   #294
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Quote:
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Kevin C,

Can the tweeters be pulled from its casing, basically exposing the tweeter without its grill? If so, would that be much small than 1.5"?

Thanks again,
Keoni
Yes u can remove the tweet from its casing, push out carfully with a small screwdriver. they are not that big, i was worried too . But they were about the same size as the stock tweeters .Check out my instal pics of this set , the bare tweeter is in some shots.
2011 gmc sierra instal
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Old 12-10-2012   #295
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Quote:
Originally Posted by carter1010 View Post
Its really not at all. Setting it with the 0db test tone of the SMD-1, dropping each driver to match the one with the least ouput, then eq'ing left and right sides (only cutting frequencies) and then eq'ing together (only cutting frequencies) I was left with very low output. I bridged the amp and things got better, but I think today I will reset with the -5db track and then I will let you know if its to much. I know the dude at Hybrid ran a JL HD 750 to each individual speaker in one of his cars and thats the only thing that gave me the confidence to even try it. It sounds incredible right now, but its not nearly loud enough.
Bump up the gains. I guarantee you will be smiling once you do that. You've lowered the levels so much you're letting the amp sit idle. Problem #1 is tuning by DMM with a 0 dB test tone.

My system: Clarion CX305, Massive Audio Core-1, Cerwin Vega V600.4, CV B2, CV V1500.1D, CDT ES-6CW, CDT ES1200iS, CV V465 rear fill, Dayton Titanic 12 in 2.0 cubes @ 36 Hz
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Old 12-10-2012   #296
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

i have a set of these JBL MS-62C in the doors and APillars of a 2011 sierra. Passive .Powered by a Alpine f250 bridged to 100 watts rms per channel Setup with a -5db test tone @1000 hz . (planning on a better amp in the future). Doors are properly prepared and midbasses are mounted to decoupled MDF baffles.
I run the tweets @ -3db on the passive xover,but will probly revert back to 0db when i clean up the reflections of the dash.
When High Passed @ 63hz , its a bit much in my truck cabin, 24db xover.I prefer a 80hz@12db xover and a 80hz 24db low pass on the single 10" sub.
This combination really allows the JBL midbass to realistically play low and extend a little deeper than 80hz and the sub doesnt play up with the steep xover. midbass is tight and has great impact when volume is turned up.Bass is right up front!
I have no eq cuts/gains, except -2@160hz , this is to deal with a rise from cabin gain , not bad tho cause the cabin in the 4 door sierra is quite large.
These speakers just keep getting nicer and nicer sounding with extended breakin
The 100 watts seems enough for me ,its not over the top for these speakers , again, depends on the crossovers , I could bottom them with a 63hz HP and a 12db xover .they are just a 6.5".
The tweets are nice , a little bright , depends on the source quality . they play really clean and sound clear and correct when listening to a good quality cd passage but can be too bright and tiring with mp3 sources .
My setup impresses with music such as Styx ,Grateful dead, Ted nuggent. Harder rock such as AC/DC etc is very "live" sounding.
These are just personal opinions based on other speaker setups i have heard.
I have friends that are professional musicians and they have listened and are very impressed by these speakers truth and detail to instrument sounds ,playing studio samples of theirs, they are impressed with the speakers ability to play realistic in comparison to some very nice studio monitors.
Overall i would say these speakers are an excellent choice , properly setup , for any front stage in a vehicle.
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Old 12-10-2012   #297
 
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Loving the review, Kevin. Quick question:

When you say your MDF baffles are decoupled, what extra steps did you take? I'm asking because I'll be doing the same on my 06 Passat. I have to drill out the facory speaker/baffle and will be using 1/2" for the bottom plate and 3/4" for the ring. End result will be something like this:

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Old 12-11-2012   #298
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

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Loving the review, Kevin. Quick question:

When you say your MDF baffles are decoupled, what extra steps did you take?
He means you put something between the baffle and the door skin, and between the speaker and the baffle. Closed cell foam, clay and butyl rope all work well for this. CCF is the easiest to work with and comes apart easier for future repairs if needed. I use butyl rope between the speaker and the baffle, then CCF between the baffle and inner door skin.

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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

Gotcha. I've seen install shots of people just using CLD tiles and scratching my head wondering what the merits of that really were, but CCF makes more sense as a decoupler. Any chance I might be able to find it cheap at a local hardware store? I'm kinda hoping to get this install knocked out this weekend.
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Default Re: JBL MS-62c First impressions. These surprised the hell out of me!

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Originally Posted by neo_styles View Post
Gotcha. I've seen install shots of people just using CLD tiles and scratching my head wondering what the merits of that really were, but CCF makes more sense as a decoupler. Any chance I might be able to find it cheap at a local hardware store? I'm kinda hoping to get this install knocked out this weekend.
You just dont want wood directly to metal, anything that does not absorb water will work. Closed cell weatherstip and rope caulk will work, Duct Seal (non hardening clay) works great but is annoying. 8x10 foam sheats (1/8") from the scrapbooking isle at walmart will do the job. Just make sure to test that it does not absorb water.

Put a piece in a glass of water, if it starts to sink after an hour, dont use it.
If you using MDF for your baffle, make sure to seal it with something unless you live in a desert.

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