"Hessian" - Sent me a set of fake Dynaudio MW-160's

[Whippet]

"Hessian"

I am giving him the benefit of the doubt - i.e. a chance to refund my $230USD and the notion that he did not know they were fake. I asked for confirmation in the forums with pics of the speakers in question which I came to suspect:

Need to be 100% sure - please help; Dynaudio MW160's

Response to my post:

"Some of the real old MW160 did not have glue under the speaker terminals, but the later ones did. I've owned both.

I have a picture of a confirmed fake MW160 and it has the same numbers on the sticker (D2 18 11) that yours does and it also has the thick flange. Real MW160's have a thin flange.

On another note, the underside of your cone is a mess. I've never seen a Dyn that poorly built."

Please do the right thing.
Dennis aka Whippet

[DIYMA]

[lucas569]

ive dealt with him before and hes a stand up guy, i doubt he knew if indeed they were fake.

i hope people have exhausted all means before they make posts like this....

[Whippet]

As I clearly stated in my post:

"I am giving him the benefit of the doubt - i.e. a chance to refund my $230USD and the notion that he did not know they were fake."

And yes, we are all stand-up guys, and gals. And Hessian is as well - insofar as the sphere of your own knowledge and experiences extend. I am glad to hear that your experiences were positive. My ebay username is "2whippets" - all 420+ persons have found my trading experiences positive as well.
Again, I did not state that [he] knowingly sent me counterfeit speakers, rather that he sent me counterfeit speakers and that I will give him the benefit that he did not know they were counterfeit and a chance to refund me. I am merely documenting this. This give him the chance to trace them to the person he purchased them from in September of 2009 - which is easily found on the trading board.

Dennis

[a$$hole]

If U paid for some speakers ...
and he sent you some...
then it is worth it to deal with him, in my book. [ everything is fake now-a-days, even girls ]

I'd buy from him !

[lucas569]

noted, BUT when you post something like this IT DOES HURT his rep regardless.

you even stated

"I emailed him yesterday to ask him about the history of the speakers and to [hopefully] have my worries put to rest - but, as of yet, no answer."

we don't even know if the man has logged on to his pc never-mind know about this problem yet....

all I'm saying is i would give him 48 hrs to reply to his email,pms,etc before i make a post like this... that's all.

like i stated if he didn't know and it was indeed a mistake it still cant hurt his e-rep and make others apprehensive to buy off him.


now if he blows you off and no response then by all means call him out on it, but give the man a chance....

[Whippet]

Originally Posted by a$$hole

If U paid for some speakers ...
and he sent you some...
then it is worth it to deal with him, in my book. [ everything is fake now-a-days, even girls ]

I'd buy from him !

So I should advertise the same speakers and pass them on then. At least I will have sent them and the buyer will have received them. Makes it okay in accordance with your skewed reasoning. They pay for some speakers .... and I send some garbage; I mean "speakers".
The problem is, I paid for some Dyns - I got crap. If you are so fine and good with that then send me $230 bucks. If you have nothing sensible to say, keep it closed.

[Whippet]

Originally Posted by lucas569

noted, BUT when you post something like this IT DOES HURT his rep regardless.

you even stated

"I emailed him yesterday to ask him about the history of the speakers and to [hopefully] have my worries put to rest - but, as of yet, no answer."

we don't even know if the man has logged on to his pc never-mind know about this problem yet....

all I'm saying is i would give him 48 hrs to reply to his email,pms,etc before i make a post like this... that's all.

like i stated if he didn't know and it was indeed a mistake it still cant hurt his e-rep and make others apprehensive to buy off him.


now if he blows you off and no response then by all means call him out on it, but give the man a chance....

He did email me back - told me who he bought them from [here on this site] and if I wanted to know anything else about them to ask that person.
This needs to be sorted. His rep won't suffer if we find the real culprit. However, one does need to know what they are selling if one is going to advertise something as genuine and put his/her name to it and take a strangers money for it. It stands to reason that someone selling on a DIY audio site would have some specific knowledge of what they are selling - although this is a pretty good fake. That is why I would like to get my money back and chase this problem back along the path from which the speakers traveled - in a public fashion so that people can see who was affected. There is no need for [I am not including you by any means] for big mouths to see this as some opportunity to display their misguided theories and poor use of the English language. This does NOT help Hessian in any way - it just increases your post count with more useless support; "all stand aside, for I am the Knight in shining stupidity."

[a$$hole]

For $340.00 you can get some new here >>> MW160 - Dynaudio 160mm Midrange/Midbass Speaker

Our Price $169.99
Availablity: In Stock
Condition: Brand New
Warranty: 1 Year Warranty
Sold As: Individually

That price is what the fake ones sell for on ebay...too !! [ $230.00 - $265.00 ]

[Whippet]

Originally Posted by a$$hole

For $340.00 you can get some new here >>> MW160 - Dynaudio 160mm Midrange/Midbass Speaker




That price is what the fake ones sell for on ebay...too !! [ $230.00 - $265.00 ]

You are spot on. I bought a set of ID's there and thought I'd save a couple of bucks when I saw the Dyn's here. Seemed like a decent place to buy - and I still think it is - like I said, and I likely cam off too strong ... Hessian also likely as surprised as I am.
Thanks for the tip - I appreciate it.

[lucas569]

i hope it works out for you two, if it was me and i sold a fake id refund the money and throw the fakes away or install em in a second car.

you can make a claim with paypal as "misrepresented" if all else fails.

[a$$hole]

Originally Posted by lucas569

i hope it works out for you two, if it was me and i sold a fake id refund the money and throw the fakes away or install em in a second car.

you can make a claim with paypal as "misrepresented" if all else fails.

Thanks - I got a reply about the history of them. The seller told me that he got them from another known person here at this site and that I should talk to him about the history.

{ Caveat Emptor }

There are actually circuit boards on amps that say "ZED" and are not made by Stephen Mantz

It takes research to keep from getting burned

[Whippet]

Originally Posted by a$$hole

{ Caveat Emptor }

There are actually circuit boards on amps that say "ZED" and are not made by Stephen Mantz

It takes research to keep from getting burned

Caveat Emptor - I do agree. However by any definition one acknowledges that the buyer is believing that he/she is purchasing what is being advertised. As in:

"The axiom or principle in commerce that the buyer alone is responsible for assessing the quality of a purchase before buying."

Otherwise the buyer has been misled, swindled or otherwise. He cannot assess that which has been misrepresented. That is why we have courts with which to punish.

If I had purchased speakers that "looked just like MW160 Dyns - you can hardly tell the difference" and then complained about it afterward - then yes, Caveat Emptor.

[Hessian]

I asked the person I bought these from if they were real and he said yes. If they are fakes then I did not sell them knowing they were fakes. I am in no way an expert on Dynaudio speakers.

I will contact the person who sold me these. If they are fakes I will try and get my money back and then send Whippet his money.

I sold these to him at a loss, so it's not like I'm trying to make money on this.

[Hessian]

This has me concerned that the other Dynaudio speakers I have are fakes. I have a set of 172s, 190s and 140s that will be installed soon. I hope these 160s turn out to be real.

[rommelrommel]

No offense, but getting your money back has nothing to do with giving this guy a refund.

Sad to say but I really think that trading standards have gone downhill in the 10ish years I've been dealing online.

[Hextall 27]

Originally Posted by rommelrommel

No offense, but getting your money back has nothing to do with giving this guy a refund.

X2 If you sold him fakes then YOU should take responsibility for your sale to him not the fact that you were fooled.

[Hessian]

It has everything to do with getting my money back. If I were to give a refund and they turn out to be fake then I am stuck with them.

If these are in fact fakes then the person who originally sold them is at fault.
What I sold was authentic, to the best of my knowledge, Dynaudio speakers.

I made it a point to ask the person who sold them to me if they were authentic. He stated they were.

I have other Dynaudio speakers that I will be installing soon. (I sold the 160s because I wanted to use 172s instead.) I am really concerned they will not perform. If they are fake then I consider myself stuck with them. I should have asked more questions or had been more informed. I'm more than pissed off that they may be fakes.

It would be different if the speakers arrived damaged. At that point I would seek a refund.

I really would like to hear from the person who sold them to me as to whether they think they are real. At that point I can make a better judgment.

[rommelrommel]

Originally Posted by Hessian

It has everything to do with getting my money back. If I were to give a refund and they turn out to be fake then I am stuck with them.

Umm, so? You made the sale. You're responsible for it. Not the guy you got them from.

If these are in fact fakes then the person who originally sold them is at fault.
What I sold was authentic, to the best of my knowledge, Dynaudio speakers.

And now you know they are probably fakes and that the buyer wants a refund. Whether you knowingly sold fakes or not is immaterial. The person that sold them to you is at fault for that transaction, but you are responsible for your sale of them.

Seriously, take responsibility for your actions. If you end up with a fake 20 dollar bill you don't get to tell the store you try to use it in "well, I didn't know it was fake so I'm not paying anything else."

[Rudeboy]

Originally Posted by Hessian

It has everything to do with getting my money back. If I were to give a refund and they turn out to be fake then I am stuck with them.

If these are in fact fakes then the person who originally sold them is at fault.
What I sold was authentic, to the best of my knowledge, Dynaudio speakers.

I made it a point to ask the person who sold them to me if they were authentic. He stated they were.

I have other Dynaudio speakers that I will be installing soon. (I sold the 160s because I wanted to use 172s instead.) I am really concerned they will not perform. If they are fake then I consider myself stuck with them. I should have asked more questions or had been more informed. I'm more than pissed off that they may be fakes.

It would be different if the speakers arrived damaged. At that point I would seek a refund.

I really would like to hear from the person who sold them to me as to whether they think they are real. At that point I can make a better judgment.

Most people will look at this as two distinct transactions - whether or not you acted in good faith. It this were counterfeit money that you received from someone and then gave to me, it would be up to you to make good on your transaction with me: you still owe me the money. Then it's up to you to go after the person who passed the bad money to you. My problem stops at you. You have a problem with me and the person who gave you the counterfeits.

[Hextall 27]

WRONG, you getting your money has NOTHING to do with Whippet getting fake speakers. As Rudeboy said these are two separate sales. You being out the cash you paid is your own damn fault.You sold them as authentic, they weren't, so now the impetus is on YOU to make right by him and THEN seek your money back. I wouldn't mess around too much on this board or you'll be up shit creek if you ever want to sell here again.

[Hessian]

Originally Posted by Rudeboy

Most people will look at this as two distinct transactions - whether or not you acted in good faith. It this were counterfeit money that you received from someone and then gave to me, it would be up to you to make good on your transaction with me: you still owe me the money. Then it's up to you to go after the person who passed the bad money to you. My problem stops at you. You have a problem with me and the person who gave you the counterfeits.

I am doing my part to investigate this matter. I have contacted the person who sold these to me. He told me they were authentic. Why would I think otherwise?

[Rudeboy]

Originally Posted by Hessian

I am doing my part to investigate this matter. I have contacted the person who sold these to me. He told me they were authentic. Why would I think otherwise?

I understand, but that isn't the buyer's concern. Your part as the seller is to make things right with your buyer. Your part as the buyer is to investigate and work them out with the original seller. If Whippet is OK with how you are going about this, fine. If you are contesting his assertion that the speakers are counterfeits, then that is the issue that needs to be resolved. If you believe that you are not responsible for Whippet's dissatisfaction because you passed along counterfeits unknowingly, you are wrong.

[azngotskills]

This situation sucks but I believe that Hessian should refund Whippet for the fake Dyns. He sold them to Whippet under his belief that they were authentic but they werent, so his payment needs to be refund from Hessian. Now he needs to address this problem with the seller who he originally bought them from.

Two different transactions man, own up to your mistake and take care of your own problems. I realize that this situation sucks but do whats right

[Hessian]

Originally Posted by Rudeboy

I understand, but that isn't the buyer's concern. Your part as the seller is to make things right with your buyer. Your part as the buyer is to investigate and work them out with the original seller. If Whippet is OK with how you are going about this, fine. If you are contesting his assertion that the speakers are counterfeits, then that is the issue that needs to be resolved. If you believe that you are not responsible for Whippet's dissatisfaction because you passed along counterfeits unknowingly, you are wrong.

If these are fake and the person who sold these to me follows the same set of rules then I will have my money ASAP and so will Whippet.

And yes, Whippet knows I am contacting the person who sold these to me. I PM'ed him and the original seller yesterday.

[azngotskills]

Delaying Whippet's refund because you cant get your own refund is not his problem!!! This is a prime example of terrible customer service and poor business practice