Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-26-2013   #1
 
DIYMA freshman
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: alabama
Posts: 22

Rep Power: 0 razzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default What does a ground Loop isolator do?

Technically?

I have some really bad altanator whine and amp turn off pop on the small amp that powers my front speakers. I bought a PAC isolator and installed it and it got rid of all the noise in the system but the tone seems different. It has something to do with the voltage b/c now I have to turn the volume up higher to get the same volume level. So what exactly does it do?

I did not hook up the 2 ground wires in the isolator b/c it worked w/o them and b/c I assume that is for people who blew there pico fuse and its just grounding the RCAs.

Either way it is going to have to stay until I can get this noise out of my system. And it's well with the 10$ I paid for it.
razzNB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2013   #2
DIYMA 500 Club
 
DIYMA Enthusiast
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Latonia,Ky
Age: 52
Posts: 2,066

12V Company:
Radio Randy
Position:
owner

Rep Power: 94 ATOMICTECH62 has a spectacular aura aboutATOMICTECH62 has a spectacular aura aboutATOMICTECH62 has a spectacular aura aboutATOMICTECH62 has a spectacular aura aboutATOMICTECH62 has a spectacular aura aboutATOMICTECH62 has a spectacular aura aboutATOMICTECH62 has a spectacular aura aboutATOMICTECH62 has a spectacular aura aboutATOMICTECH62 has a spectacular aura about


iTrader: (5)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

All of the ones that I have seen are just a small signal transformer.The primary to secondary windings will not pass DC so there is zero reference to ground.If they are not of high quality the inductance of the transformer will cause high frequency degradation,phase shifts and less than optimal flat frequency across the audio spectrum.
I avoid using them at all because there is a reason for the noise which should be dealt with.A ground issue or faulty component is the most common problem.

CDA-9886,PXA-H100,EPIC160,Hifonics series VIII Callisto,MC431m on SSMB8's,GTI508 mids(doors),MC431m on GTI408 mids,Morel MDM55's(dash),MC431m on Dayton AMT1-4's(pillars)and GTI508 mids rear,JBL GTO1201.1 on(2)MTX T8512-04 5cuft ported at 30hz,2 batteries,30F cap.5 way active.
ATOMICTECH62 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2013   #3
DIYMA 500 Club
 
DIYMA Loyalist
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Sweden
Age: 27
Posts: 3,399

Rep Power: 88 Hanatsu is a jewel in the roughHanatsu is a jewel in the roughHanatsu is a jewel in the roughHanatsu is a jewel in the roughHanatsu is a jewel in the roughHanatsu is a jewel in the roughHanatsu is a jewel in the roughHanatsu is a jewel in the roughHanatsu is a jewel in the roughHanatsu is a jewel in the roughHanatsu is a jewel in the rough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

Getting rid of the source of the noise or filtering the source of the noise is usually a better option imo. I don't like to put unnecessary equipment in the signal chain. The small ones are transformers as Atomic said ^^

Hanatsu is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2013   #4
DIYMA 500 Club
 
minbari's Avatar
 
DIYMA super monkey!
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: STL, MO
Age: 41
Posts: 10,812

Rep Power: 165 minbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to all


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

as everyone has said. just a simple 1:1 ratio transformer.

good ones are more than $100.

Original post whore!
Bent Nail Brewery

2013 Fiesta, Stock Sync HU |AC LC2i | Phoenix Gold EQ215i | Soundstream SA120 -> ID CD1eMH | Phoenix Gold T500.2 -> ID X65 | JL 500/1 -> (2) 15" Pyle PL1590BL in IB
minbari is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2013   #5
 
DIYMA freshman
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: alabama
Posts: 22

Rep Power: 0 razzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

What would be good one?
razzNB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2013   #6
DIYMA 500 Club
 
VP Electricity's Avatar
 
"Count the heads"
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Portland OR
Posts: 1,331

12V Company:
Musicar Northwest
Position:
Zaphod Beeblebrox

Rep Power: 83 VP Electricity will become famous soon enoughVP Electricity will become famous soon enoughVP Electricity will become famous soon enoughVP Electricity will become famous soon enoughVP Electricity will become famous soon enoughVP Electricity will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (18)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

Jensen Iso-Max Ci-2RR. Markertek.com. Flat to damned near DC.
VP Electricity is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2013   #7
 
DIYMA freshman
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 28

Rep Power: 21 fasfocus00 will become famous soon enoughfasfocus00 will become famous soon enoughfasfocus00 will become famous soon enoughfasfocus00 will become famous soon enoughfasfocus00 will become famous soon enoughfasfocus00 will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

i use to believe in using Ground Loop isolators but i realized they don't really fix anything. it's like getting sliced up with a knife and using a bandaid, it didn't fix the issue it just covered some of it up. most shops offer this b/c finding and fixing the issue cost them too much time and money.
fasfocus00 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2013   #8
DIYMA 500 Club
 
VP Electricity's Avatar
 
"Count the heads"
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Portland OR
Posts: 1,331

12V Company:
Musicar Northwest
Position:
Zaphod Beeblebrox

Rep Power: 83 VP Electricity will become famous soon enoughVP Electricity will become famous soon enoughVP Electricity will become famous soon enoughVP Electricity will become famous soon enoughVP Electricity will become famous soon enoughVP Electricity will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (18)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

I didn't suggest using a GLI, the OP asked what a good one was, so I replied with the best GLI on the planet. You won't have any problems with that GLI.

Now, 99% of the time, you can get rid of the noise without a GLI, but that wasn't the request
VP Electricity is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2013   #9
DIYMA 500 Club
 
minbari's Avatar
 
DIYMA super monkey!
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: STL, MO
Age: 41
Posts: 10,812

Rep Power: 165 minbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to allminbari is a name known to all


iTrader: (0)



Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fasfocus00 View Post
i use to believe in using Ground Loop isolators but i realized they don't really fix anything. it's like getting sliced up with a knife and using a bandaid, it didn't fix the issue it just covered some of it up. most shops offer this b/c finding and fixing the issue cost them too much time and money.
Yes and no. you shouldn't bandaid the problem, but there is a legitimate benefit to decoupling the DC content between devices and xformers do an excellent job of it

Sent from my motorola electrify using digital farts

Original post whore!
Bent Nail Brewery

2013 Fiesta, Stock Sync HU |AC LC2i | Phoenix Gold EQ215i | Soundstream SA120 -> ID CD1eMH | Phoenix Gold T500.2 -> ID X65 | JL 500/1 -> (2) 15" Pyle PL1590BL in IB
minbari is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2013   #10
 
DIYMA freshman
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: alabama
Posts: 22

Rep Power: 0 razzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

I think I'm going to buy this Jensen unit b/c my Car (02 miata mx5 lx) is famous for being a electronically hostile environment for sound equipment. I think it has something to do with the battery being in the trunk even though I thought that would be a good thing.

AND...I just don't to mess with it anymore.

One of these Transformers might be good to have around anyway even when I get tired of the Car or the equipment.

Is 150$ the best price I'm going to get? I don't mind throwing down a buck but a buck fifty makes me a little hesitant.
razzNB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2013   #11
DIYMA 500 Club
 
VP Electricity's Avatar
 
"Count the heads"
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Portland OR
Posts: 1,331

12V Company:
Musicar Northwest
Position:
Zaphod Beeblebrox

Rep Power: 83 VP Electricity will become famous soon enoughVP Electricity will become famous soon enoughVP Electricity will become famous soon enoughVP Electricity will become famous soon enoughVP Electricity will become famous soon enoughVP Electricity will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (18)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

List is $200. You're welcome to look. I know of none. And I've never had a noise issue in that car, even with factory HU and Bosectomies.
VP Electricity is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2013   #12
 
DIYMA freshman
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: alabama
Posts: 22

Rep Power: 0 razzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

Quote:
Originally Posted by VP Electricity View Post
List is $200. You're welcome to look. I know of none. And I've never had a noise issue in that car, even with factory HU and Bosectomies.
What would u think would be the culprit and how would I fix it? It is a ground loop I assume since the adaptor worked?

Am i right to assume that It could only be 2 things the head unit (jvc av60 BT) or the amp (vibe lightbox stereo 2 micro)? I do have a sub amp but the noise predates it. The amp is grounded to the negative terminal of the battery. Would running a ground Wire from the head to the battery work? My Car had more than just whine too. It had a awful turn off pop and even some engine noise.
razzNB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2013   #13
 
DIYMA freshman
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: alabama
Posts: 22

Rep Power: 0 razzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enoughrazzNB will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

It also might have something to do with the Bose amps. My hand was too big to unplug them and I didn't want to pay my local shop 45$ an hour to screw with them so they are still there pro bialy grounded to the same Wire as the head.
razzNB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2013   #14
DIYMA 500 Club
 
DIYMA Addict
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: LA
Posts: 7,863

Rep Power: 200 cajunner has a reputation beyond reputecajunner has a reputation beyond reputecajunner has a reputation beyond reputecajunner has a reputation beyond reputecajunner has a reputation beyond reputecajunner has a reputation beyond reputecajunner has a reputation beyond reputecajunner has a reputation beyond reputecajunner has a reputation beyond reputecajunner has a reputation beyond reputecajunner has a reputation beyond repute


iTrader: (3)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

Quote:
Originally Posted by razzNB View Post
It also might have something to do with the Bose amps. My hand was too big to unplug them and I didn't want to pay my local shop 45$ an hour to screw with them so they are still there pro bialy grounded to the same Wire as the head.
yeah, that's probably a good place to start with troubleshooting.

if the amps are connected to the new deck through the factory wiring harness or fuse block, it's easy to see a noise generation fault crop up.

every time they Power up, they could be causing a current ripple, or something.

I'd make sure they were "out of the loop" by disconnecting their harnesses, and run a DMM test to see what the ground difference is between the new amps and the new deck, and fix that first.
cajunner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2013   #15
 
DIYMA Novice
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: EU/Slovenia
Age: 42
Posts: 439

Rep Power: 77 LBaudio will become famous soon enoughLBaudio will become famous soon enoughLBaudio will become famous soon enoughLBaudio will become famous soon enoughLBaudio will become famous soon enoughLBaudio will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

Dont use GLI, it is only a band-aid and it only masks the problem and not solve it.
Take your time and find and eliminate problem.....

take care of your wiring, use one common point for all negative and positive leads for all equipment including factory HU.

For Fast Moving Concerts
Team LB audio
Team Hybrid Audio
LBaudio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2013   #16
DIYMA 500 Club
 
chad's Avatar
 
DIYMA Psychopath
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Illinois
Posts: 17,196

Rep Power: 886 chad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond repute


iTrader: (10)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

There is a time and place for transformers, good ones are expensive and it is most certainly NOT a band-aid.

Every recording you hear has some of the finest gear used in it using transformers. I'd say most recordings we have contain at least a hundred passes through a transformer.

If I were doing an OEM integration the first thing I'd buy would be a set of transformers, needed or not. My time is worth the extra price to not have to fuck with the integration. There are also some combinations of gear that simply WILL NOT work without isolation. some older amps ground the shield as opposed to tying it to the center tap of the PS, this will almost always induce a ground loop in even the rest of the gear that cannot be solved without galvanic isolation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bikinpunk View Post
Mark's an up late kinda dude. His neighbor has a horse.
chad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2013   #17
DIYMA 500 Club
 
chad's Avatar
 
DIYMA Psychopath
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Illinois
Posts: 17,196

Rep Power: 886 chad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond reputechad has a reputation beyond repute


iTrader: (10)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

Why the fuck does this forum link to FUSES when I type ground?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bikinpunk View Post
Mark's an up late kinda dude. His neighbor has a horse.
chad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2013   #18
 
Super Moderator
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 3,601

12V Company:
Audiofrog Inc.
Position:
President

Rep Power: 513 Andy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond repute


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?

Quote:
Originally Posted by chad View Post
There is a time and place for transformers, good ones are expensive and it is most certainly NOT a band-aid.

Every recording you hear has some of the finest gear used in it using transformers. I'd say most recordings we have contain at least a hundred passes through a transformer.

If I were doing an OEM integration the first thing I'd buy would be a set of transformers, needed or not. My time is worth the extra price to not have to fuck with the integration. There are also some combinations of gear that simply WILL NOT work without isolation. some older amps ground the shield as opposed to tying it to the center tap of the PS, this will almost always induce a ground loop in even the rest of the gear that cannot be solved without galvanic isolation.
This is absolutely correct--100%. Transformers can be invaluable. I'd even argue that a noise FILTER is more of a band-aid than a transformer. Until all outputs are floating (or balanced) and all inputs are differential, transformers are the best way to get rid of ground loops in your system. Loops are most often NOT caused by a bad Power supply ground connection for your amp. They ARE caused by different potential to ground in the input sections of your amps.

Not all GLIs include transformers, though. The ones that are only caps and resistors decouple ground too, but the value of the caps has to be tuned for the input impedance of the next component. I avoid using those, but building components that include this kind of DC-busting circuit is fine.

Chief Cook and Bottle-Washer, Audiofrog, Inc.
Andy Wehmeyer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2013   #19
DIYMA 500 Club
 
Banned
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Up to 11 different dimensions
Posts: 12,574

Rep Power: 0 Oliver will become famous soon enoughOliver will become famous soon enoughOliver will become famous soon enoughOliver will become famous soon enoughOliver will become famous soon enoughOliver will become famous soon enoughOliver will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (19)



Default Re: What does a ground Loop isolator do?



Quote:
Originally Posted by chad View Post
Why the fuck does this forum link to FUSES when I type ground?
Fuses sell for a bit more

Quote:
Andy Wehmeyer They ARE caused by different potential to ground
Let's call noise a curious kid, we'll call the doors of our building paths to ground.

If noise finds and unlocked door they're going in, some paths to ground allow noise to come in.

Last edited by Oliver; 04-29-2013 at 09:33 AM..
Oliver is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


» Amps
A/d/s/
Advent
Alphasonik
Alpine
American Bass
ARC Audio
Atomic
Audio Art
Audio Gods
Audiobahn
Audiocontrol
Audiopipe
Audison
Aura
Autotek
Avionixx
Bazooka
Beyma
Blaupunkt
Boss
Boston Acoustics
Bravox
Cadence
Cascade (CAE)
CDT Audio
Cerwin Vega
Clarion
Clif Designs
Concept
Coustic
Critical Mass
Crossfire
Crunch
DB Drive
DC Audio
DC Power
DEI
Denon
Diabolo
Diamond
Digital Designs
Directed
DLS
Dual
DYnamat
Dynaudio
Earthquake
Eclipse
Elemental Designs
ESX
Eton
Farenheit
Fi Car Audio
Focal
Fusion
Genesis
Ground Zero
Hafler
Helix
Hertz
Hifonics
Hushmat
Image Dynamics
Infinity
Interfire
JBL
Jensen
JL Audio
JVC
Kenwood
Kicker
Knu Konceptz
Kole Audio
Kove Audio
Lanzar
Lightning Audio
Linear Power
MA Audio
Magnat
Marantz
Massive Audio
MB Quart
McIntosh
Memphis
Metra
Milbert
MMATS
Mobile Authority
Morel
MTX
Nakamichi
Niche Audio
O2 Audio
Ohio Generator
Optima
Orion
Oxygen Audio
OZ Audio
PG Audio
Phase Linear
Phoenix Gold
Pioneer
Polk
Power Acoustik
Powerbass
Powermaster
Precision Power
Profile
Pyle
Pyramid
RadioShack
Rainbow
Rampage
RE AUdio
Rockford Fosgate
Scanspeak
Scosche
Seas
Sony
soundstream
Sparkomatic
SPL Dynamics
Stinger
Sundown Audio
Swiss Audio
Targa
TC Sounds
TREO Engineering
TRU
Tsunami
Ultimate
US Acoustics
US Amps
Velodyne
Vifa
Viper
Visonik
Xtant
Zapco
Zed Audio
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:37 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

Ad Management by RedTyger

Meet Our Team | Forum | Privacy and Rules | Advertise | Archive | Search | Contact Us

Home | User CP | Members List | New Posts | ITrader | Faq | Post Spy