I see what you're saying, but wouldn't break up be an issue with woofer being off-axis in the usual location in many cars? In any case, with so many users of Imagines so far no one has complained of the woofer having sloppy dispersion.. I tried to run the woofers with tweeters turned off, and while this will sound off as expected with not treble and low sound stage, its surprising to m ear how much information is coming from the woofers.
They probably start beaming where 6.5" usually beam. Woofer rolloff is anything but regular, it doesn't mimic a crossover.
The crossovers in these amps are very capable. Crossovers do more good then they do harm. No reason not to use them, especially since they give you flexibility. The only time you should bypass them in the amp is if you have others built into your digital source, prior to converting your digital signal to analog. That applies to people that have 4way or 3way headunits or optically linked processors.
how do these do under high volume for long period of time?
I am trying to convince my neighbor to install these in the bottom center console of his silverado so I dont have to pull his seat out of the back every time he wants to adjust it like his current amps are.
I dont like to put them under seat cause if you spill something then it usually ends up right there under seat..
just want to know how hot these will get. he will be pushing them
Joseph Goebbels, Nazi propaganda minister during World War II said: “It is the absolute right of the State to supervise the formation of public opinion; truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
Thats the advantage of class D amps, they dont really heat up. Even in summer heat of high 90s to over 100F, my JL gets just warm while I blast it for 2hrs straight. My friends Eclipse class D, the most efficient ones I know of always feels cool, and we both run ours bridged so we're not at max efficiency.
You should have no problems with heat.
Regarding the Imagine discussion, you can design a driver that had little break up on the high end and off axis often helps reduce the ability to notice the break up. Also beaming is dependent on physical dimensions only, so it will beam at the same frequency of an identical size driver. if the driver operates cleanly over it's full band, theres no reason out wouldn't sound as good or better crossing lower unless the tweeter has poor response that low, which could likely be due to high Fs our high distortion at lower frequencies. As for how well things sound, the car environment hides alot, and contributes alot of distortion and irregularities.
I have had many class d. This ppi is the smallest I have had so I wondered how it does. Some due better than others.
Anyone know the efficiency rating? I need to read the review again.
Joseph Goebbels, Nazi propaganda minister during World War II said: “It is the absolute right of the State to supervise the formation of public opinion; truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
CEA-2006A rated 4 ohmpower (minimum power per channel developed over the entire intended audio bandwidth) - 131 Watts
Maximum Efficiency at full 4 ohm power per ch. - 83.0%
Maximum Efficiency at full 2 ohm power per ch. - 75.8%
Efficiency at 10 watts per channel, 4 ohms - 60.4%
You cut tweeter's positive wire and solder a capacitor inline. I did this yesterday using this part. This creates a high pass crossover with -6dB slope starting at around 18KHz according to crossover calculator. This frequency sounds like a strange spec, but remember that with a shallow slope it means that the tweeter will be only 12dB down at 4500Hz and 18dB down at 2250Hz. The later could be accomplished with a high pass crossover at 4.5KHz with a 18dB slope. I just finished such quasi active setup and since I don't have a capability to change my tweeter crossover slope to try out whether something like 6000Hz high pass with 18dB slope would sound a lot better than the stock setup, but I does seem to sound nice to my untrained ear as of right now. Having this capacitor would probably help to protect your tweeter from nasty clicks and pops sent my lower quality amplifier on turn on and off.
PS: If you don't want to bother with the capacitor, you can try to use the amplifier's crossover at the max value to see how it goes. Having an amplifier crossover could help you a little even if you use a capacitor in line (e.g. apply amplifier crossover at 4KHz or so, making sure the tweeter is dead silent at lower frequencies).
Just my $.02. 6 and 18dB slopes are undesirable since they create a phase shift that cannot be corrected. I vowed many years ago to stick with 12dB, 24dB or full active xovers...
Joseph Goebbels, Nazi propaganda minister during World War II said: “It is the absolute right of the State to supervise the formation of public opinion; truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
I have a 900.4 too but it's still in the box and dang if it's not suddenly cold
Joseph Goebbels, Nazi propaganda minister during World War II said: “It is the absolute right of the State to supervise the formation of public opinion; truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
"Moving the amp to the Cogent test bench verified my impressions from my listening session, the amp makes gobs of power, and does it with relative ease. Efficiency was excellent, especially at fractional power levels where the majority of us listen, and the P900.4 managed to exceed all its published specs. Frequency response measured ruler flat in the audio band, and extended to over 30kHz. signal to noise proved to be equally as impressive, scoring -82dBA @ 2V. About the only minor gripe I had was the amp didn’t have quite as much gain as I might have liked, requiring about 280mV of input to drive it to clipping with the gains maxed. This is no problem if you have a high volt output radio, but if your head unit’s preamp output voltage is on the anemic side, high quality recordings with wide dynamic range and lots of crest factor may not be able to get the amp to full power. But any good 4 volt or higher sources will be perfect."
From the PASMAG review. does this mean the gain has to be higher clockwise than normal? I thought that is what someone said.
does anyone know what the voltage output of these 900.4 amps are? I would like to get an idea of wether or not we are close or not on the gains in my buddies truck.
we were also thinking of bridging the amp and turning the gains all the way down to get more use of the entire amp.
when he got it he was going to use all 4 channels but since he installed it we have just run 1-2 .
it seems a waste to use just half an amp.
Joseph Goebbels, Nazi propaganda minister during World War II said: “It is the absolute right of the State to supervise the formation of public opinion; truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
From the PASMAG review. does this mean the gain has to be higher clockwise than normal? I thought that is what someone said.
does anyone know what the voltage output of these 900.4 amps are? I would like to get an idea of wether or not we are close or not on the gains in my buddies truck.
we were also thinking of bridging the amp and turning the gains all the way down to get more use of the entire amp.
when he got it he was going to use all 4 channels but since he installed it we have just run 1-2 .
it seems a waste to use just half an amp.
On average many amps have an input sensitivity of 200mV(Gains MAX) to 8V(Gains MIN). All he is saying is that this amps input sensitivity requires a minimum of 280mV so the gain structure is a little different than what he is used to. I think setting gains with a DMM or O-Scope is good in terms of getting you in the ball park. However, music is dynamic...the final setting should ALWAY be with your ears...A gain setting CD, track, etc is the way to go...IMO.
ok. I think we are fine. no need to throw out tutorials anymore. I have set amps many times.
I was just making sure this wasnt like a Phoenix Gold Zero Point amp which required a line driver to really pump out the power OR gains maxed
Joseph Goebbels, Nazi propaganda minister during World War II said: “It is the absolute right of the State to supervise the formation of public opinion; truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
ok. I think we are fine. no need to throw out tutorials anymore. I have set amps many times.
Mike, in the test report I think you might have missed:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Written by Garry Springgay from PASMAG
"This is no problem if you have a high volt output radio...any good 4 volt or higher sources will be perfect....the amp makes gobs of power, and does it with relative ease"
But, my point and the point of NPDANG's posts was that "ears" are how we get around the limitations of setting gains with just a voltage setting....I know you know this already...but maybe some that read this don't know?
what you guys must understand is the friend we installed this in is the most anal i have ever met.
he makes me ask questions I usually just dont cause I have installed so many amps I just do it the way I always do.
I am being overly critical.
thanks for all the input
Joseph Goebbels, Nazi propaganda minister during World War II said: “It is the absolute right of the State to supervise the formation of public opinion; truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
By the way, where is the PDF manual for PPI Phantom amplifiers?
I have one question (it's probably not in the manual). Would P900.4 run stable if the rear channels were bridged to run a subwoofer that's wired for 3ohm impedance? I know that a mono block sub would work better for this duty, but I was thinking of using the other two channels for rear fill speakers. I guess, the 5-channel could also work for this duty too.
By the way, where is the PDF manual for PPI Phantom amplifiers?
I have one question (it's probably not in the manual). Would P900.4 run stable if the rear channels were bridged to run a subwoofer that's wired for 3ohm impedance? I know that a mono block sub would work better for this duty, but I was thinking of using the other two channels for rear fill speakers. I guess, the 5-channel could also work for this duty too.
I just looked for a pdf for them and they're not posted yet.
P600.2 (190W x 2) - $159.99
P1000.1 (580 Watts x 1@ 4 Ohms/725 Watts x 1@ 2 Ohms) - $209.95
The mono would do about 660 watts @ 3 Ohms. So thats 1040 watts for $369.94. SMALL, POWERFUL, EFFICIENT, and AFFORDABLE! Why even think about putting all that stress on a single 4 channel when amps like these are available today? Grab as many as you need to get-r-done the right way!
Another question.. just how bad would it be if I mounted a P900.4 on a side wall of a subwoofer box in my daily driver? I have heard that mounting amplifiers on subwoofer boxes is bad, but then home come home threater subs come with amplifiers mounted on the box? I don't need this amplifier to work for 10 years. If it could last for 3-4 years, that would be great.
I'd be shocked if it didn't last 3-4 years mounted on a sub box! Hell I'm seriously considering throwing one in the cabin of a high performance offshore boat. I was thinking I might be able to get a few seasons out of one in that environment and I promise one afternoon on the ocean in that thing is far, far more punishing than being bolted to a sub box! I think you'll be fine mounting it on the sub box...
many amp repair techs will highly disagree with the both of you. but if you want to do it then do it.
If I were to do it then I would have some type of damping in between the bottom of amp and the box. if i were.
Joseph Goebbels, Nazi propaganda minister during World War II said: “It is the absolute right of the State to supervise the formation of public opinion; truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
Mounting an amp on a box is not the best place, but people have been doing it for decades. The idea is that the parts can come loose. The stress on an amp in a car with bad shocks, or in a boat on choppy water, would be much worse then stress from being mounted to a box. It is not like a sub is going to to put 30+ pounds of force on the amplifier. Hell, may last system had 3 amps mounted to back of my box in my jeep. I took it offloading with my shocks set to level 8 (vey stiff). Never had a problem, although I think some of my parts games loose. LOL If you mount to the box, use rubber washers between the feet and the box to help damp a bit... This has been a topic for 3 decades and I have yet to experience, see, or even hear about a single amp that fell apart do to being mounted on a box. Just more shit to discuss and argue about...
Sorry, this is all I have on hand, all the others are on FB and after a minute of trying to figure out how to export them here I remembered why I hate FB, haha!
OMG!!!!
That has to be the most fun ever on water!!
Twin blown big block Chevrolets!!!!
I wish I had that for a weekend in the San Francisco Bay or Lake Havasu in AZ.
I have a question about bridging the P900.4 for subwoofer duty. Do the inputs require a mono signal on both rca plugs in bridged mode, or is it fine to run cables with normal stereo signal? In other words, does this amplifier sum the input signal when bridged?
Re: New PPI amps (Phantom & Black Ice)
Linear Mode
