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JBL's MS-8 processor!

2M views 13K replies 999 participants last post by  mzmtg 
#1 ·
MS-8 comes with the pre-amp/amp, a small display, a wireless remote control, a binaural microphone and a setup CD.

MS-8 will have 8 speaker level inputs, 8 line level inputs and an iPod input. The inputs are summed to provide a full-range 2-channel signal. If 6 or fewer inputs are required, then the last 2 can be used for an additional aux input.

There are no digital inputs. Why? Because the real benefit of digital input is "no noise". The downside to providing one is that for 99 percent of users, it's more hassle than it's worth and will cause a great deal of confusion. Not too many people understand that the connector doesn't determine the signal. What I mean is, if we put a toslink input and a user hooks up a toslink output, it will only work is the signal is compatible. DVD-Audio isn't available on a digital output, DVD signals are 48k, PCM is 44.1, home-made digital audio can be anything. The signal from tuners is often only output on the RCAs. For the vast majority of users, there is no benefit and too much opportunity for disappointment. As far as noise goes, our inputs are differential, so the commoon mode noise rejection is super high. There won't be any noise.

There are 8 input channels, so the 8 speaker level inputs and 8 line level inputs are basically in parallel. You can use any combination.

Once the signals have been combined and un-EQed (for a flat 2-channel signal), the signal is processed with Logic7. That provides signal steering for a center channel (if you have one--if not, no problem) and processing for side and rear channels. L7 works on any 2-channel source and is our version is written for cars rather than live-in rooms, so it sounds MUCH better than any of the encoded formats in a car. The 2-channel downmix of any encoded DVD or DVD-A disc will play back in full surround. If good-old 2-channel is what you want, L7 is defeatable and the channels are fully configurable (there are 8 output channels and they can be pre-amp channels or powered channels--20W x 8 at 4 ohms, 30W at 2 ohms). You can have 3-way front, a center and a sub, 2-way front, rear and a sub...whatever you want to do.

The electronic crossover that's built in is fully configurable. You can assign any channel to be anything and it includes an EZ setup mode and an advanced mode. In EZ setup, you tell each channel the speaker location (front right, for example), then you tell it what speaker is connected (6" full-range). It sets the crossover point. In advanced mode, you tell the channel the location (right front) and then assign a filter type (HP, LP, BP) and then you set the filter frequency (you can assign any value between 20 at 20kHz) and the slope (1st-4th order).

After the crossover setup is completed, you move on to the EQ. You put on the microphones (they look like airline headphones but contain mics instead of speakers) and insert the CD. The display will give you some instructions to sit in the driver's seat and look at the left mirror and press "go". the unit will make a quick sweep of all 8 output channels. Then it will ask you to look forward and will make another sweep. Finally, it'll ask you to look to the right--another quick sweep. You can measure only the driver's seat or up to 4 seats. After the measurements are made (takes about 5 minutes) the unit will calculate the frequency response, level and arrival time for all 8 channels in each seat and crunch some numbers (another 30 seconds or so). It auto-tunes the car with 48 measurements per seat (up to 4 seats). It will output a tuning optimized for the driver, passenger, compromise between driver and passenger and one for the rear seats. If you use a center channel, both front seats will sound the same and the image will be great for rear seat passengers too.

After the auto-tuning is done, it will allow you to change the target curve. You can call up a 31-band EQ tool and make whatever changes you want. Unlike a regular EQ, you don't have to find an RTA and tune the car with the EQ, you just draw the curve you want to hear and press "go" and it does the work in implementing your curve. Then you can switch back and forth between your curve and the automatic one and continue making changes until you're satisfied. The curve you draw will always be adjusted in level so that the maximum number of bits are available to describe the signal (optimized for dynamic range). Once you save the curve, you can access any of the settings optimized for any seat using the remote control and the display.

You can turn Logic7 on and off, adjust the level of the center channel, use a balance control, fader, 3 or 11-band graphic EQ or adjust the level of the bass. THe bass control isn't a gain control for the subwoofer output, it's a filter that works with the crossover and applies the right amount of bass to ALL channels so the illusion of bass up front isn't destroyed when you turn up the bass.

Answers to some likely questions:

1. You don't have to use the unit's volume control. You can use the one in the head-unit if you want to.
2. Maximum input voltage on the RCAs is 2V and 15V on the speaker level inputs. The signal is converted directly into digital after the preamp buffer, so a high signal level is far less important in this device than in conventional ones. The input is fully differential, so there won't be noise. I suggest speaker level connections because they are COMPLETELY isolated from ground.
3. The automatic EQ isn't exactly parametric or graphic. It's a very powerful algorithm that works on the impulse response to adjust both time and frequency response. It's amazing and does in about 30 seconds what I can do with an 80 band parametric EQ, crossover, time alignment and a serious analyzer in about 3 days.
4. The display doesn't have to be mounted. If you don't want iPod control or the ability to adjust after setup, you can unplug the display and use MS-8 as a "black box".
5. The unit is small--about 8.5" x 11" x 2.5"
6. Price will be about $800...TBD
7. The software is updatable via USB and a PC.

It does what all other OEM integration tools do and what every other DSP (EQ, Crossover, Time alignment, 7.1) processors do, but it sounds better, is easier to use, is less expensive and is far more advanced in terms of DSP power. Best of all, it's a tool you can be successful with, rather than a whiz-bang collection of filters and adjustment possibilities that require a PhD in acousitcs to use.
 
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#904 ·
And still the coolest thing.. like with all of these, bit-one, ms-8, pxe, etc.
Swap cars, keep your processor and throw it into whatever other car you have.. It will work. With a decent aux input, if the OEM head unit puts out anything decent, that's bonus. :)
 
#909 ·
do you guys realize this thread is going on 2 years now ...... and still no MS-8, at least not for the general public.
 
#911 ·
First of all, this thread is filled with such comments so another one wasn't really necessary. :)

Secondly, you're absolutely right, but the general public doesn't know about it anyway. In fact, very few are aware of the very existence of the product. This thread is followed by a very limited amount of car audio freaks around the world, hardly a representative sample of the worldwide car audio scene as a whole. Hence, JBL might have "lost" some potential customers by not making this available sooner, BUT in the end - when it does come out - it'll (hopefully) have none of the glitches we keep hearing on other products (I'm not naming any). ;)

It's as BigRed said above. The only risk JBL are taking with the long wait is the possibility of another company bringing out a much better/more modern product that would eliminate the need for the MS-8 altogether, along with its potential commercial success. :blush:
 
#910 ·
Id rather have it in 2 years working correctly, than having it not work correctly, and then ***** about it for 2 years :)
 
#912 ·
well, I certainly haven't read thru all 37 pages to notice how many times people have brought this up - I just saw this thread again and went to pg 1 to see how long it's been going is all. I agree that it's better to have it right then all jacked up and full of glitches like you usually see.
 
#913 ·
I can understand JBL's commitment to this technology. What auto manufacturer wouldn't want it? I could see where it would be a "must" for any high end OEM system. As for aftermarket - if you had a choice between a HU that had it and one that didn't and there was a $150 difference which one would you pick?
 
#915 ·
now i have another dilema with this unit.... i plan on buying the pioneer x99rs deck with all the bells and whilstles, but i want the jbl ms-8 now i will be getting the pioneer in mid feb. my problem is this........... iam building another sqi car and want to run either the pioneer deh 880 deck or the pioneer x-99rs deck..... if the jbl ms 8 will be out befor next may then i will go with the 880 but if it wont be released befor the end of next iasca season then i will buy the x99rs...................... come on andy lets get going on this,.
 
#920 ·
alright andy i am going to purchase the pioneer deh p880prs it has 3 sets of pre out front rear sub/non fading.. 5 volts at 100 ohms... my front will be 2tweets.....2- 3 inch......... and 2- 6 inch front with the subs in rear....... now would i use front pre outs only, or f and r, or f/r/& s into your processor??? i can shut off the preamp stage of the deck... do you advise this?? also do i have to set all xover points and the eq points will be self calibrated? ie... tweets 2.5k up at 24db/oct... mid 500hz to 2.5k bandpass at 24db/oct. midbass at 65hz to 500hz at 24db/oct... subs zero to 65 hz at 24db/oct..then let the ms-8 do the rest?
 
#922 ·
If I were you I'd turn off the preamp and run the speaker level lines with no processing to the MS8. If using the preamp, I'd turn off all processing on the Pioneer and run fronts only to the MS8 (IF you can get fullrange out of the fronts; otherwise run front+sub to the MS8). As Andy posted, you can set the MS8 xovers as you like and let it handle the rest.
 
#926 ·
I've been a little out of the game on the MS-8 since a decade of pages ago and many moons..

Andy will this thing still have amplifier channels in it?


And n-boost, from owning a pair of 3sixty.2's I can safely assume this thing will annihilate it....when it comes out.
 
#936 ·
After hearing the unit, I really believe people are going to be rethinking a center channel. I will be at least. Thats how impressed I was with it. :)
 
#940 ·
just finished the last iasca car show on sunday out here and the judging for my cars imaging was deadly...... imaging was just past the windsheild wipers and dead centre for centre vocals.... iam using a pair of r.f.360.2 for processing but cant wait to get my hands on this new processer up here in canada..... when i talk to ericksons they know nothing about this piece tho andy...... whats up with that or are they just being cautious.
 
#941 ·
So on the drawing board planned a front stage, my setup is going to be dynaudio MW 170, MD140.2, & MD 100, right now my stage is passive. Will this unit allow me to go completely active. I have purchased 3 amps Zapco 350.2 Mid-Bass, Zapco 350.2 midrange, Zapco 200.2 tweeters is the way I'll configure the amps. I'll change the RF3Sixty.1 to something for a digital signal and active crossover, maybe this unit if it'll do the task.

My car now
RF
3Sixty.1

Speakers
Dynaudio system 340 front, & Dynaudio 340 rear
JL10W6V2 x 1

Polk Momo
400.4

Polk Momo
300.2

Pollk Momo
500.1
 
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