Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source. - Page 2 - Car Audio | DiyMobileAudio.com | Car Stereo Forum

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Old 03-24-2015   #26
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

Great news, it's not my tweeters!

Jesus gave me the idea this morning
I use iphone and istreamer, so logically I should not be able to adjust volume on the phone since it sends digital signal.
But strange thing, I was always able to with this DAC (never searched about this).

So far I always used the max volume, just with the idea to maximize voltage output. Old habit from when I didn't have external DAC when the phone was plugged directly on ms8.
This morning I tried to lower it a bit, and the crackles disappeared!!!!! Yalaaaaa
Even just one step, like 90% did the trick!
Of course I lost few db in the total chain, but I still could increase the ms8 volume to insane level without anything disturbing.
Happy man here

I also tried the AUX input setting in ms8, min or max > no effect
I alsways assumed that with iPhone, ms8 and ms amps I would not have to deal with gain etc
I guess I was wrong.

I'll try another DAC soon, the audio engine d1 (with a knob)
this one I know that the phone volume is bypassed.
Just found this about the istreamer:

"The iPod volume control does affect the volume coming out of the iStreamer. By default, it's at the top, so the iStreamer puts out a 2.25 volt signal. But if you need a weaker signal going into your amp, it's great that you can reduce the volume.

At work, my current headphone amp is a portable and the 2.25 volt signal is too strong, causing distortion. Turning down the iStreamer volume a touch eliminates the distortion and the sound is great.

At home, in the bedroom, my integrated amp is 50 watts and my speakers are sensitive (92 dB). If I'm listening very quietly at night, the only way to get the sound quiet enough is to turn down the iStreamer volume.

The iPod is probably just sending a signal to the iStreamer to attenuate the analog output signal. Since the iPod is sending the iStreamer raw data, you can't reduce the "volume" of that data. But you can send extra info along with the data to control the volume once it's been converted into analog sound. It must work that way somehow.

"


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Old 04-22-2015   #27
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

So last week I still had the gb25 in doors and the result was really great to my ears. I just played with XO and levels for few weeks.
Just 2 flaws:
- I am struggling to get something clean on this door panels (and integrate door switch etc, didn't really want to relocate them in the center console for a clean look).
- soundstage was not high enough, even if got better with few weeks playing with ms8. Esthetically I love the tweeters in handles, but it's probably not the best place for stage height.
Would be a great place for the mids, but too big without serious modifications.
So I decided to try some other positions again, and this time measure them, just for confirmation (ms8 bypassed).

Grabbed all small mids I have around: gb25, pioneer Stage 4, some beefy B&W 3" from an old zeppelin, the old stock 2.5" and even my old friend 560 gti (but only in door )
All in different places/angles (kick/dash corner/dash oem hole/pillar, while firing up/aimed to me/facing each other etc)
Here we go:

first, all in left door:


The rest will be only pioneer since tulse is interested

All pioneer overlay


Left pillar, aimed to me


left pillar, facing each other


left dash corner oem hole, firing up


left dash oem hole, aimed to me


Left kick


central channel (just in case I wanna destroy my dash one day ):


Right pillar, aimed to passenger (or me, not sure)


Right pillar, facing each other


Right dash oem hole, firing up


Right dash oem, aimed to me


Right kick



By far the flattest was here:





Ok it's 1/3 smooth but look at that!
It's probably biased since only the pioneer had a perfect enclosure. For the others I had to play with tape/towels/foam etc to simulate either enclosure or IB.

I was so surprised I wanted to try for a week (that's why they're taped and glued).
But first listenings were really not nice, in fact I hated them.
Too bad because it's much easier to modify the pillars!

I tried without tweeters and it worked, but sounded thin.
It gives a better stage height than in doors, but it's too much in my face.
I think the width suffered, not in boundaries, but in "distribution".
If I continue in this way I'll put the tweeters very close to mids, like in sails.

And I just realized today while driving that the top part of my dash was at the same height than them (symetric bump), creating a barrier in between.
Not sure it's that though.

Next time I'll measure with ms8 ON to compare.


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Old 04-23-2015   #28
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

Thank you for posting all those! Some stuff I would not expect. Just goes to show (again) you should do you own testing and listening, with your own divers, in your own car.
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Old 04-23-2015   #29
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

You're welcome, it's probably not useful for a different car like you said (my windhsield/dash angle is pretty accute), but tendencies should here.
Also I realized that the chase for flat response is just one step, like here to avoid craziest placement, but that's it. Especially with a dsp.
(call me captain obvious? )

Next I think I'll install the 4 pairs, door mids&tweeters versus pillar, and swap/calibrate quickly to compare each pair.

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Old 06-05-2015   #30
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

So after some work on the pillar version https://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/...-post1338.html
I finally decided to go back to the door mount.

Last work was to re-built the enclosure.
All in fiberglass, few layers without filler for now, and then polyfill and quickly covered with headliner.
I'll re-work later on the finish, for now it's enough.
They're about 0.4 liter




before it was just cardboard and hotglue (a lot) & just 0.2L, it was ok to get the feeling on the placement, and I tried several angles here.
But at the end I just used them flat on the panel, not aimed to me, just same angle than the tweeters.




Now that it is solid, the improvement is massive I was surprised.


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Old 06-05-2015   #31
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

So now I want to build a midbass enclosure…

Well for few more reasons in fact:
- to integrate the door switch (probably here where they are on previous pics)
- the woofer is actually obstructed and I have sounds going into the panel.
- to get a clean finish
- it's fun
So if I have go into all the work, why not an enclosure?

I tried once already, when I had 560&660 in doors. but it was a hell of a job
For this first tentative I tried to make it in two parts.
One filling the holes in the doors, to use the maximum volume I could.
And another part based on the interior of the door panel.
I totally messed up and ended up with this only:


So I just used the fiber panels to "seal" the door holes (in red).





But I have few questions now.
here's the original door:





You can see that is has a good usable volume already (the door itself is almost flat).
So everything under the armrest line is usable, probably around 3 or 4 liters just for the rear part near my hand, but I didn't measure yet.
If I optimize the "inner" fiber-panel, by going into the door the maximum I could, I could maybe add 1 or 2 more liters.
Then the idea is to cut the front triangle of the panel and re-build around the driver to find a few liters again.
If I make it going "into" the cabin or keep it flat to the door panel, like:

[/URL]

But not ported, sealed, and by using the rest of the door panel volume.
So a mix of wood and fiberglass work, then cover the triangle in suede like:



Initially I planned for 4/5 liters, based on their T/S and the manual.
But LBaudio gave me real life feedback on the necessary volume for the 660s to be happy.
And it's closer to 12l. than 4.5, so I'll really try to get the most volume I could
12 will be hard, but maybe 7/8?


So the questions are:
Should I make it independent or included in the door panel?
Integrated would:
- maximize volume use
- be easier to build (I could fiber directly inside the panel)
- panel will be harder to attach, It is only clipped, no screw anywhere, and the added weight will probably destroy the existing plastic things.
when I had both 560 & 660 in my previous custom panel it was super heavy (also super ugly )

Separated:
- would mean a double shell construction (like Gary's one, harder to close/finalize?)
- easier for the mount
- able to add some foam/decoupler everywhere
- probably less volume

Thanks!

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Old 06-06-2015   #32
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

you can go both ways, depends on your skills. In both casses put a lot of dynamat on doorcards and onto enclosure walls.
If you choose the first plan, than you can bolt doorcard to the door metal from inside of enclosure on few spots, but in that case put some neopren or rubber between door metal and enclosure to prevent rattles.
Maybe you ban also use carbon grill holders to compliment carbon parts on your dash.

good luck with project!

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Old 06-06-2015   #33
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

you can go both ways, depends on your skills. In both casses put a lot of dynamat on doorcards and onto enclosure walls.
If you choose the first plan, than you can bolt doorcard to the door metal from inside of enclosure on few spots, but in that case put some neopren or rubber between door metal and enclosure to prevent rattles.
Maybe you ban also use carbon grill holders to compliment carbon parts on your dash.

good luck with project!

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Old 06-06-2015   #34
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LBaudio View Post
you can go both ways, depends on your skills. In both casses put a lot of dynamat on doorcards and onto enclosure walls.
If you choose the first plan, than you can bolt doorcard to the door metal from inside of enclosure on few spots, but in that case put some neopren or rubber between door metal and enclosure to prevent rattles.
Maybe you ban also use carbon grill holders to compliment carbon parts on your dash.

good luck with project!
I feel like it's a bit over my skills in fact, but I really want to try.
If I plan well the process I might succeed.

Ok for the dynamat & decoupler, in any case I'll have to keep in mind the thickness needed for this.
Either the foam between door and "enclosed" panel, or between enclosure and door panel.
Maybe the "independent" option for the enclosure would make it easier to filter all vibrations to the armrest.

So I'll take time to study all mounting options first.
See where I could add & keep access some new holes in the door.
I'll try to draw something to share my options.

I forgot about the carbon rings! They're a bit too "techy" for me but I'll check if they match.
For protection I could try something minimalist like this on the center part:


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Old 06-06-2015   #35
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

Checked the volume, with just the stock panel I get 9 liters already!
(and the foam didn't go everywhere)
Even with let's say 10% margin of error it's a good start.

If I add what I can get inside the door by curving the panels in the holes
+ around the driver by moving it a bit into the cabin I'm sure I can go really close to 12L.
That leaves me a good marge for the thickness and damping/decoupler material around.
I'm surprised!

So maybe I could try ported...






About the aiming:
I know at that frequencies it's not important, but can it have an impact on any null effect?
It sounds silly to ask...
But could it change something if I aim them differently than horizontally like actually? More off axis to the front, or slightly aimed over the tunnel (the transmission tunnel is large, but not too tall so few degree will make them fire over it).
Any of these ways would help me to get a cleaner line on the door (It could also give more rigidity to the box I think).

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Old 06-06-2015   #36
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

I love me those XJR and XKRs so much. Just great cars and really are pretty robust. Always wanted to do a system in one of mine. I think I may have to buy another one. LOL

Love the XKR 100s though. Being only 300 still exist i would have a hard time performing that level of surgery on the doors.

Kudos man, wish i could form panels like that but dont have the time, skill, patience for it.

Denali:Alpine X009GM, SI TM65MKIII, SI M25, SI BM MKV, Helix G One & G Four amps.
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Old 06-06-2015   #37
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LaserSVT View Post
I love me those XJR and XKRs so much. Just great cars and really are pretty robust. Always wanted to do a system in one of mine. I think I may have to buy another one. LOL

Love the XKR 100s though. Being only 300 still exist i would have a hard time performing that level of surgery on the doors.

Kudos man, wish i could form panels like that but dont have the time, skill, patience for it.
Yep, I can use reliable and jaguar in the same sentence!
(100kmiles this one, and 120k the other)
Everything is well done, not too much plastic, a lot of leather or vinyl, no rattles etc. well honestly a bit more now since I disassembled it so many times...
That's the only way I hurted it I think, didn't cut the doors, and I have every parts to put it back to stock if I need.
In fact I did it once, but I just couldn't find anything else that I like enough (except an Aston... )


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Old 06-07-2015   #38
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

Today I tried to make a copy of the door surface on the other car, to get an idea of the work later.
On the volume/attachments/relation with door panel etc.
Same car, same door, but with much less dynamat and stuff to deal with (and I can keep my sound system while building ).
(It's a bit hard to be syntethic and not taking an hour to type, so please excuse if it's messy)

So first, one of the issue ont my actual door:






The driver is already really low in the door, but 1cm top is still hidden by the panel (rough cut here).
I can add 1 or 2 cm to go lower and inside the cabin. but not sure it will be enough.
I say that because I want to minimise the work on the external part of the door panel.
For good looking results (by experience )
If I can avoid to cut or add some fiber on the outside I'll be glad.
So if you follow me, this means I will have to move lower/more inside the driver, while using fiberglass from the inside of the door panel, to the outside of the new ring of the speaker. Not sure it's clear…
That's why I asked about aiming previously. If i can aim it differently I could save few mm.

Then, here I have a solid point to attach everything (the hole on top right, missing a strong metallic L bracket)
The armrest is fixed here, but the armrest is attached to the door panel somewhere else behind, by below.
So I'll have to create some kind of tunnel in the box, to get to the screws






On the next door, spare panel, cutted, to show some of the oem speaker holes I'll try to reuse to attach the box/panel.






Here just a layer of foam to add some space for later, for any kind of decoupler or dampener I'll want to use.
It also smoothes out the surface, so easier to fiberglass:






Then taped and fibered, just enough to give me an idea.
I'll probably re-do a better one later






Then check on the door panel, where will I have to cut/add some fiber, especially for the last step, coupling of both panels:






A lot of space, and I optimized the maximum:



Maybe about 2 more liters added with the internal poachs.
I grabbed all i could to keep room for any added thickness of the fiber.
About this, what's more important: weight or rigidity?
Because I could use much less fiber if I brace everywhere.


And then just free try to get an idea of how I could mount the driver.



An old K2 destroyed by the couple ms8 & flat battery





I don't have so much room behind, maybe 1cm, and the gti is larger, so I'll have to increase the "spacing" for this "triangular" part. a bit more in the cabin.

A detail of the skin:



My experience with vinyl is that it's really not that easy to get a clean finish. So I don't want to recover the entire door.
So I'll try to destroy the actual one the least I can to re-use it.
Should be ok here since it's the bottom. The idea is to glue both panels and recover the corners here.




Next step: MDF





I have no experience on mdf, except with rings.
I'll grab some during the week at home depot probably.
If I can cut it like that, fiber on the oem cover (marroon here) and filler in the gaps.
At the end I'll try to make some kind of clipped cover on this whole front part to simulate a rear-mount of the driver.

Clearly a lot of work, I guess few week ends.
But it seems accessible!




PS:
Also something I tried yesterday, the lost foam technic.
I really wanted to avoid to fiberglass the panel so it seemed a good idea for an "independent" enclosure.
I used Joann styro blocks, super easy to use, few minutes gave me this shape:



But finally I don't think it's the way to go.
Too much steps to make it to perfectly match the door, too much lost space at the end, and no obvious solution for the mounting.
Also I would have had to work with epoxy, and I never did that.
The only thing I really like about this technic, is that I could have easily added some rigidity with internal braces (like crossing chopstick everywhere in the foam before I dissolve it for example, if you see what I mean).


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Old 06-16-2015   #39
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

A little update on the doors, few pics should tell the story:











Finally I'll go the independent way. It was too hard to try to save volume everywhere and save the original door card.
So I cut the panel, on an horizontal line, just below the armrest, and will use mdf as backbone, FG to the cut panel with added depth. (1cm move = 1 or 2 liters added)

The pile of cups were here to help to find the right depth, considering volume needed, global look, and of course practical side like door that still close etc
Since it will be one piece, simple shape, I'm ok to recover it in vinyl or even just acoustic fabric. And I don't plan for the best look, just something ok since i'll have anyway to replace them one day.
I just hope the armrest will cover any ugly thing, the midrange enclosure that sits just upper could help too.
The very front part will need to be clean though.

I have more than 13 L. without the speaker hole that I could easily use.
So depending of the volume used for bracing & FG thickness etc I have room enough I think!

Have to say, I had very great feedback from LBaudio here, many many many good advises, a very nice guy.
His site: Custom Installs | LBaudio or his build threads here should illustrate his level.

Actual basic plan to join and close both parts of the enclosure is to use fleece, then cut flat among the mdf, FG inside, and glue or put filler to close back, then filler outside to clean the lines.

But still studying the questions now, about bracing, mounting holes, rigidity needed etc.
Most of the mounting points will be in front, 4 strong ones around the oem speaker hole, then the L bracket in the middle + others around.
But I'd still really like it to be light, like super light, while keeping priorities for the sound.
So I'm studying any kind of solution:
core mat/honeycomb/aero mat or bracing with mdf/thick cord/FG panels etc

It's hard to find a common agreement on this, most here use mat apparently, to build weight, then strength.
But it seems to me that using a real sandwich would give the same rigidity for much lower weight.
But then what about the effect on sound?

Also I'll probably try ported first, but I'm not there yet.

For now the idea is:

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Old 07-30-2015   #40
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

Some news about the door midbass enclosure:
This thing is damn' long to build! I spent maybe 4 or 5 weekends already, only on the right one and it's not finished.
I had to change my plan 5 or 6 times, made a lot of mistakes but at least I learned a lot in the process.
I wanted to end it with some more cloth all around but it's solid enough I don't need and I get tired.
The shape is like the original door panel, just 1.5" deeper in the cabin for the whole bottom part, so a bit intrusive but not too much

But it's just super heavy, more than 5 Kgs without the driver and I wonder if my door will appreciate… I may have to reconsider the attachment points, and reinforce the inner skin.
The original plan was to go ported, Winisd and other online calculators gave me about 10/12L. for ported, or half only for sealed.
But since it's hard to measure cabin gain, and I have a dsp to shape the final curve I wonder if I should still go ported.
Also the port tube itself (2") might be hard to install inside with enough clearance around (should be 2" around the tube too no?). Or could be not compatible with the wool stuff.

I quickly tried to mount everything on the right door, and just listened a bit.
Nothing was adjusted of course, box without the port yet so probably too big for sealed (but is there such a thing?)
And didn't change anything on ms16 but I just couldn't resist.
Midbass only, playing with balance to compare L&R:
The sound is muffled, maybe too much sound absorbant inside, or just the bad settings, or box too big.
But the most impressive was the resonance, or the absence of resonance!
At pretty loud volume, level that I rarely listen to, the left door was crying her mother, bzing boing whoom everywhwere!
On right… nothing! Even louder, just a little ringing on one of the metal bracket that attach the box (temp).
That is really cool!
And a bit disturbing, I thought my doors were ok, not perfect but ok. I think the skin is just not rigid enough.

So I really think I'll continue on this, but ported or sealed… don't know.
Sealed would be much easier, I can find up to 8 liters in the original panel easily.
Just FG the inside of the panel and close with mdf > lighter, much simpler to build, and stealth look.

Any thoughts guys?

















































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Old 08-01-2015   #41
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

Anybody can help on this?

- too much felt?
or maybe I should not focus on this at all for now.
I read that it's not that important for low FR, but I'd like to be able to use this box to play higher in midrange for a 2 way later if I want to try.

- ported vs sealed when with a dsp
I consider this first box as a draft.
I could either cut the hole and place a port,
or fill it with something solid to find the right volume for sealed

I wonder if I should buy the Dayton measurement tool, to get the real T/S. I found very different specs online for the gti (between JBL and ErinH for ex).
To get the right VAS/FS/QTS especially.

I also have some old sealed cabinets about 8L., I think I'll try them in the car just to see.

- weight
Anyone who destroyed his door hinges with too much weight?

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Old 08-01-2015   #42
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

very interested. SUBd!

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Old 08-03-2015   #43
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vwjmkv View Post
very interested. SUBd!
Thanks vwjmkv!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Majik View Post
Eager to see the final product. I'm in the planning stages of my 04 XKR build and was considering a similar enclosure design for my midbass.
Great news, did you start anything yet, what's the plan for now?
I found it really easy to work on.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Majik View Post
How did you make this speaker pod?
By hand, few years ago, with drill/jigsaw/file, and that was loooong.
Now with a dremel it should be much faster.
Basically the same shape than the oem one.
They're solid, but I realize now that the door skin itself is not strong enough.
Maybe a sandwich with a ring behind could help.
But adding/spacing more the mounting points would be better.
The bottom part is ok, but the top one moves few mm when you press firmly over it.

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Old 08-03-2015   #44
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

So I tried quickly the old cabinets with the the gti installed inside (no tweeter):





I think they're about 7-8 liters, so not too far off.
I calibrated as 1 way front, and just played a bit, normal to high volume, and different high pass (no sub).
I took some measures with REW but I messed up with the settings so don't want to share my graphs now.
I'll have to find the exact same settings that I used for "IB in doors" and re-do them with the cabinets soon to really compare apples to apples.
So far, the curves didn't look exactly the same, on the cabinet ones the High pass is stronger, I mean there's less informations below the high pass point.
And on phases (I measured ms8 on/off) the ms8 seems to have fixed everything below 500Hz, two holes, at 80 and 200Hz.
But I need to double check on this, too many .mdat files...
Maybe it's just because the ms8 doesn't apply the same filters to a 1 way VS 3 way + sub, even on the same limited FR window.

But the obvious improvement is the ability to go very low without rattles/resonances from the door.
Before I couldn't high pass at 60Hz, or even 70Hz. With the cabinet no problem, it's still clean and tight.

Not related, but I was surprised to hear also some highs. Even on the left one almost in front of me due to its size.

I think I'm on the right path here, will continue with the enclosure solution for sure.


Last edited by Elgrosso; 08-03-2015 at 04:32 PM..
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Old 08-04-2015   #45
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

cool! thanx fot taking test and report!

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Old 08-04-2015   #46
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Majik View Post
Thanks! I haven’t started yet as the equipment is currently installed in another vehicle. The XKR is new to me as of April and I’ve been focusing more on performance upgrades for the last few months. My goal was to have the stereo build completed by August…but you know how things go. I'm probably still a month out until I even begin...
Cool, I'm glad to find a X100 buddy here.
What did you change on the car so far?
I didn't feel the need for any mechanical upgrade personally… since I fall in the audio stuff
And I have another one for the fun.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Majik View Post
Source: Rework stock radio housing and cage to accommodate the CD7200, as no pre-fab mounting kits are available for this car and I don’t mind doing the work. This way I can add my USB port and sub-level control on the same faceplate.
I found one few years ago, just a plastic adapter to fit a regular DIN.
It has a curve that follow the rest of the controls.But never used, I think I found it on Jaguar Forums - Jaguar Enthusiasts Forum


Quote:
Originally Posted by Majik View Post
Front stage: Tweets in dash pods or A-pillars…depending what sounds better.
I tried many layouts in this one, and I remember the two way was good with tweeters in sail panels.
But it was a long time ago, and totally personal, taste/dsp/driver dependent etc


Quote:
Originally Posted by Majik View Post
For the 6.5 mid I was thinking of glassing a tunnel that just barely extends through the existing speaker cover; still using the door as the enclosure. Sealed and deadened of course. This would allow me to keep the speaker cover and cloth by simply cutting a hole to accommodate an angled face of the driver/mounting surface, and rewrapping the cover panel with the same OEM fabric. Simple and lightweight but should still look tasteful. See your image below and imagine there is a sealed tunnel behind the speaker, “connecting” it to the door...essentially a fiberglass extension of the stock speaker mount.

I see what you mean for the woofer.
A solid ring will already be a big step compared to the flimsy plastic one.

The OEM cover (triangle part) has a plastic ring to "seal" it onto the foam around the oem driver, but I couldn't re-use it.
There was some kind of leaks around this area into the door panel, that I just try to fix with foam etc.
So if you can get a clean flush mount on the panel side it should be a success.

But the door panel itself is not exactly cut all around the driver, few cms on top are covering the ring and the very top of the driver. So it might be hard to place some fiberglass there and still be able to plug back the panel.
See here on the pic, the top part. I cut it a bit but it was still an issue:


Had the same issue with the enclosure, but I put the driver lower so it fits.

I'd also humbly suggest to rigidify the door around the speaker hole as possible. There's too much opening around for it to be rigid. You should be able to feel it by pressing just by hand.
That's what I would do now if I had to.

For the sealing part of the door holes, the top rear "square" opening was a bit tricky, since there's only very little room between the door skin and the door panel. Maybe you could try by inside.
The yellow one here:


I also curved the fiberglass panels inside the holes when I could, so they got a bit more rigid while still not too thick.
Because all this + the foam and the thinsulate…. made hard to put the panels back!





Quote:
Originally Posted by Majik View Post
I do like your independent fiberglass enclosures in the empty space behind the door panels…but I’m not exactly sure how much it will improve the sound over a well deadened and sealed door. I’m looking forward to your results!
The last one is bigger than the door itself, about 1" more into the cabin, but same shape, or close.
But if finally I decide to go sealed, I'll just FG the door panel itself, there's good volume there and it would be clean!
Now does it worth it or not…?
For the sound I'm pretty much convinced now, for the few reasons in previous posts about the door isolation.
Of course I need to finish everything.
And will it worth the time and effort? This I'm not so sure haha



Quote:
Originally Posted by Majik View Post
Subs: I like your idea of using the rear deck for the sub (is that an IB install btw? I’d like to see more pics of that)…
Not sure I have more I'll check. But yeah this was fun.
OEM hole is 8" so I had to cut a bit to 9", then stack of mdf from 9" to 12", it ends up at few mm of the windshield on top, and few others from the fuel pump below.
The whole thing is a bit angled back. It was a pain to fit and tighten.
But it works well, you can check on my pics the measurements.
Maybe due to some kind of horn effect with the windshield?
I should take some more time to deaden more the rear cover itself since I can get some rattles around 20Hz.
But the metal sheet itself is rigid enough.
I searched for a while for a good 12" IB that would fit.
All the shallow one, at that time, didn't fit.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Majik View Post
but since I’m using a pair of 12” subs, and we have fuel tanks in our trunks, I’m not sure how effectively the bass would penetrate in to the cabin with traditional trunk mounted subs. I’ll try them in the trunk first…BUT…I’m pretty set on replacing the back seat cushion with down-firing dual enclosures. The back seats in these cars are useless anyway…might as well make a true 2-seater. I’ve never installed subs inside the cabin of a vehicle, so I’m not exactly sure what to expect. Fingers crossed I guess. Anyone else have experience with down-firing subs in a small coupe?
Ha yes a nice rear seat delete!
Have this in mind since the beginning… Maybe you saw some on the jag forums?
There's not so much room just below the bench, but the entire volume could converted to a big box, XJS style.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Majik View Post
My amp rack will be similar to yours. It just makes sense in these vehicles.

Rear fill: basic install in stock location. It’s just fill...

Deaden both doors, floor and ceiling.
Yep it's deep and big enough. And always good to fit everything low. Speaker wires are long enough to go anywhere in the trunk if you need, fuse block, battery, everything, just waiting for you!
I guess you have the donut too?
If so you should be able to find a truck floor for xk8, totally compatible to cover everything.
Do you plan to keep the oem amp in place or use both corners for the subs?

I didn't do ceiling, just front floor, doors, rear shelf/seats and around the rear fill.
The floor could have used a bit more, it's a bit flimsy on big impacts. I tried to double the carpet thickness, it worked but it was too messy with the pedals.

There is for sure many more things to say, so MP if you need!

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Old 09-21-2015   #47
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

Nope, did nothing since a while (build OD and just too hot to work).
For the wires, since almost all my stuff is temporar I didn't bother to run them cleanly. So oem wires for woofers and tweeters, and passed the midranges ones through the fuse panels on both dash sides. Clean enough for now.

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Old 03-19-2016   #48
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

Few news on here,
Some time ago I removed all the stuff from the green car to prepare it for resale (but I still don't know what will be the next one).
In the meantime I couldn't live without decent sound so I just dropped some of the stuff in the convertible.

First just the iphone/dac in dash with ms8 and oem speakers.
I had to buy few 6.5" since I missed some, started with basic woofers on PE.
Like the one from the dayton 652 monitors.



It was ok but sensitivity was too low, and a bit "nasal" (no eq).
So I tried the PRV, much higher sensitivity (and only $10), bigger motor, still 4 ohms, drop in replacement.
With ms8 amp it worked well, a good step. For sure one good woofer for cheap oem replacement.
But then lack of sub bass after few days, oem sub = just two 6.5" in small enclosures on each sides in the back.

So I decided to instal my jbl SQ pro, tried quickly in the trunk, but it was useless.
It had to go in the cabin so: rear seat delete, found some heavy straps so it won't find my ass in an accident, and a nice black blanket to cover the ghetto instal.




Wow way to go, this guy pushes so much!
Not clean as the IB12AU in the coupe, nothing really below 40Hz, but over that it's great! (once EQed)
In the now empty sub enclosures I installed some gs63 coax to enjoy L7, not the best spot with the sub in between, but it's a drop in.

But system was not balanced, again, I needed more in front.
I quickly tried some scanspeak 5f in the dash (perfect drop in replacement)
But it was really thin, something was not right (again I didn;t EQ at that time)
I then installed temporarly a gmd1004 for the front 2 way, to see if the scans wanted more.
See, started as a simple temporar instal, now it gets ugly :



But it made things worst, and my oem tweeters really didn't like the power increase (they share the same channels with the dash mids, with just a cap).
So since I still had the green car handles trim ready for the gb10, I decided to install the gb15 for a simpler 2 way.
Just enlarged a bit and cut the handle even more, it fits:



I always liked that look, and everything in the door is way easier to tune, for me.
I think I said it already about the green car, but in the door the soundstage is larger, just a tad less deep and high.

Then my strange episode about tweeter crackles…

Solved today! So I finally spent some time on EQ
I've never really messed with the ms8 EQ on the other install, since I didn't know what to do.
I usually just played with amp level/xo, speaker placement etc
But I just tried to learn the ms8 behavior with REW and optimize what I understood.
And it seems to work well, process was:
- measure left/right dsp off/on just to see what it does, to get the big picture, check XO, levels, distortion
- then look at dips/peaks/phase > what do I understand? Where can I do something?
- and start with sweeps for both sides around the head (only front, and just one per ear, me inside, it's consistent enough and I don't focus on highs))
- then EQ a bit and remeasure, loop like that 10/20 times
I first wanted to cut only, but the sub needed too much cut so I had to boost the midbass.
Sub is now at the minimum on EQ, and few dbs less on the sub menu, maybe like -15db in total.
(gain is at the very limit of turning it off)
- then listen some music and adjust, usually cancel partially what I did in previous steps.
For example I cancelled everything I first did over 1K, it didn't sound right. Like trying to fill the large dip around 4/5k.
So here's the last step, red before/purple after, VAR if I remember, still wip:

EQ:



Now I need to listen more, but it's a good change, not perfect (phase issue on midbass) but better than before.
Even not perfect, the sub/midbass integration is still very enjoyable, it hits hard and clean, on a much broader type of tracks too. Ms8 is really a great piece.
Highs are great, even with some strange stuff on very high some time.
But mids are not good enough yet.
But clearly these little woofers are doing their job. I really wanted to try cheap drivers, to see if I can really hear the difference.
They first distorted a lot, but now with the EQ they're getting better.
It's certainly not like with the 660gti, but it's also a much simpler instal. I can probably live like that few weeks.


Last edited by Elgrosso; 03-20-2016 at 09:30 AM..
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Old 03-20-2016   #49
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

Just found this thread, love what you did with the tweeter and inside door handle. It turned out killer!
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Old 03-20-2016   #50
 
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Default Re: Jaguar XKR, Jbl, Audiofrog, Acoustic Elegance & iphone source.

Thanks!

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