SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES - Page 3 - Car Audio | DiyMobileAudio.com | Car Stereo Forum

View Poll Results: Do smaller companies make better products than mainstream companies?
YES 34 46.58%
NO 39 53.42%
Voters: 73. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-22-2013   #51
DIYMA 500 Club
 
Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: UK
Posts: 862

Thanks: 0
Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts
Rep Power: 114 captainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkZ View Post
You spelled favor wrong.

No I haven't ... read the top line of my post!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkZ View Post

Where do you rank the Sony ES line, the Alpine F1 line, the Kenwood PS series, the Pioneer DEH880 which is owned by like half the people here, or the JL w7 subwoofer?

What about some of the classic JBL speakers that are considered by many to be some of the best made in their class? JBL being owned, of course, by Harman International...

You're biasing the sample which is skewing your results. If you considered ALL of the big companies' offerings, instead of just the ones you see at department stores, you'd realize that big companies often make very high quality products.
I don't rate Sony much for anything. Oh sorry ... i do like there TV's. Out of the 120+ headphones I owned, Sony where at best ... cr*p! Never liked any of the Sony gear.


Pioneer Pioneer DEH880 is a given. Reasonable if not forgotten high end gear. Low end speakers (of which I have a few pairs) ... nothing special. Sure Pioneer are good at head units and they corner the market for DJ gear, but pound for pound, I wouldn't choose them over other brands mentioned

JBL: TLX20 .. my first ever speakers, then i got the JBL Control 1's ... classic! Got/had a few JBL GTO-804 subs, did quite a few builds for them. Again, when it comes to car audio, IMO they OK, but nothing to set them apart from the rest. The little GTo-804 for an 8" (UK price) is a stormer, however again I wouldn't even put JBL ahead of JL.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkZ View Post
If you considered ALL of the big companies' offerings, instead of just the ones you see at department stores, you'd realize that big companies often make very high quality products.
News to me!

I just think there's too much good stuff out there to settle for an 'average' product. And from what I see and hear, most of the good if not best products come from what we might deem as smaller or lesser known companies. The only reason why such brands are big sellers is exactly that ... the brand ... the name. Vibe Audio are the biggest culprits in the UK for producing popular, well liked garbage. but look at Vibes market! When your marketing efforts consists of half naked women in stockings stroking subwoofers ...


Why would I go on ebay and bid for a Sony amp when i can have a Genesis amp for the same money. Why buy JBL or Infinity speakers, when DLS clear the board when it comes to European SQ comps? Again, are you telling me, you'd put JBL above the likes of Hybrid Audio or Morel Sinfoni or Tru... come on!!!

The only issue I have with JL is they showcase new products now and again, I third of them never seem to make it to market, the other third never come over to the UK. Still waiting for the 8WX sub. Loving the amps, loving the subs, speakers under £100 (I've only owned a couple of pairs) ... maybe. Regardless of the nay-sayers rattling on about clever marketing, I still have huge, monumental respect for JL. I still prefer my Sundown SA-12 and E-10 for SQL though!

Last edited by captainscarlett; 04-22-2013 at 10:51 PM..
captainscarlett is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 04-23-2013   #52
DIYMA 500 Club
 
MarkZ's Avatar
 
Enthusiast
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: ..........................................
Posts: 6,851

Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 243 MarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really nice


iTrader: (4)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by captainscarlett View Post
I don't rate Sony much for anything.
This is the blatant type of stereotyping that I was talking about earlier. You've never used some of their high end equipment, but you think it's bad because their xplod series sucks. Frankly, this is the very definition of ignorance.

Edit: Here is a thread that is 3 pages worth of people drooling over Sony products. https://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/...y-xm2000r.html
Do you have any experience whatsoever with any of the products in those pictures?

Quote:
Pioneer Pioneer DEH880 is a given. Reasonable if not forgotten high end gear. Low end speakers (of which I have a few pairs) ... nothing special. Sure Pioneer are good at head units and they corner the market for DJ gear, but pound for pound, I wouldn't choose them over other brands mentioned
Your fellow enthusiasts here apparently disagree with you, since that head unit is probably the most common one that DIYMA folk buy.

Quote:
JBL: TLX20 .. my first ever speakers, then i got the JBL Control 1's ... classic! Got/had a few JBL GTO-804 subs, did quite a few builds for them. Again, when it comes to car audio, IMO they OK, but nothing to set them apart from the rest. The little GTo-804 for an 8" (UK price) is a stormer, however again I wouldn't even put JBL ahead of JL.
You didn't address the high end JBL equipment that I referred to. You're talking gibberish about some entry level JBL gear, and trying to extrapolate that to everything else they made? Have you tried, say, the 2118 midrange? The w15gti subwoofer? Any of their compression drivers? People with a lot more experience than you RAVE about these products.

Quote:
News to me!
That's obvious.

Quote:
Originally Posted by subwoofery
What I wanted to say is that amps ... sound the same.

Last edited by MarkZ; 04-23-2013 at 07:55 AM..
MarkZ is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #53
DIYMA 500 Club
 
edzyy's Avatar
 
Enthusiast
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: The Big Apple/ATL
Posts: 1,907

Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 119 edzyy will become famous soon enoughedzyy will become famous soon enoughedzyy will become famous soon enoughedzyy will become famous soon enoughedzyy will become famous soon enoughedzyy will become famous soon enoughedzyy will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Not sure why ssa is in the SPL catagory.

They're lineup with the exception of the evil and zcon are SQ subs.
edzyy is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-23-2013   #54
DIYMA 500 Club
 
MarkZ's Avatar
 
Enthusiast
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: ..........................................
Posts: 6,851

Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 243 MarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really nice


iTrader: (4)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by edzyy View Post
Not sure why ssa is in the SPL catagory.
Because he has no idea what he's talking about.

He also doesn't realize that about 1/3 of the brands in his "SQ" categoriy are actually owned by large companies. Then he goes on to say that large companies aren't as good, or some such nonsense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by subwoofery
What I wanted to say is that amps ... sound the same.
MarkZ is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #55
Upgrade Your Membership!
 
ChrisB's Avatar
 
Inappropriate Thoughts
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: LFT
Age: 46
Posts: 3,991

Thanks: 8
Thanked 12 Times in 9 Posts
Rep Power: 1029 ChrisB has a reputation beyond reputeChrisB has a reputation beyond reputeChrisB has a reputation beyond reputeChrisB has a reputation beyond reputeChrisB has a reputation beyond reputeChrisB has a reputation beyond reputeChrisB has a reputation beyond reputeChrisB has a reputation beyond reputeChrisB has a reputation beyond reputeChrisB has a reputation beyond reputeChrisB has a reputation beyond repute


iTrader: (17)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkZ View Post
Your fellow enthusiasts here apparently disagree with you, since that head unit is probably the most common one that DIYMA folk buy.
I think most buy the DEH-80PRS because it is the only HU on the market offering the features it does for the price point. To be honest, the Bluetooth on my factory HU is 100x better than the Bluetooth on the DEH-80PRS. While I managed to get over myself regarding that annoying BEEP every time I touch a steering wheel button, I have issues with their crappy implementation of Bluetooth.

2019 WRX Limited with stock HK sound while iDatalink prepares the Maestro RR2 for the modern day Subaru

"Beware of the forum boner for it will screw you every time!"
ChrisB is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #56
DIYMA 500 Club
Upgrade Your Membership!
 
Enthusiast
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 4,235

12V Company:
Audiofrog Inc.
Position:
President

Thanks: 0
Thanked 54 Times in 41 Posts
Rep Power: 581 Andy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond repute


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Sony head unit? Sure. Sony speakers? Maybe not. This has far less to do with the size of a company than it does about the expertise of their product development department and whether that expertise is actually applied to the development of the product in question.
Andy Wehmeyer is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #57
DIYMA 500 Club
 
quality_sound's Avatar
 
Enthusiast
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Cannon AFB, NM/
Posts: 8,965

Thanks: 18
Thanked 11 Times in 8 Posts
Rep Power: 264 quality_sound is just really nicequality_sound is just really nicequality_sound is just really nicequality_sound is just really nicequality_sound is just really nicequality_sound is just really nicequality_sound is just really nicequality_sound is just really nicequality_sound is just really nicequality_sound is just really nicequality_sound is just really nice


iTrader: (52)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by captainscarlett View Post
The only issue I have with JL is they showcase new products now and again, I third of them never seem to make it to market, the other third never come over to the UK. Still waiting for the 8WX sub. Loving the amps, loving the subs, speakers under £100 (I've only owned a couple of pairs) ... maybe. Regardless of the nay-sayers rattling on about clever marketing, I still have huge, monumental respect for JL. I still prefer my Sundown SA-12 and E-10 for SQL though!
What has JL EVER "showcased" and not brought to market?

quality_sound is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #58
DIYMA 500 Club
Upgrade Your Membership!
 
Enthusiast
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 4,235

12V Company:
Audiofrog Inc.
Position:
President

Thanks: 0
Thanked 54 Times in 41 Posts
Rep Power: 581 Andy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond reputeAndy Wehmeyer has a reputation beyond repute


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Not making it to YOUR market is not the same as not making it to market.
Andy Wehmeyer is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #59
DIYMA 500 Club
Upgrade Your Membership!
 
Aaron Clinton's Avatar
 
Supporting Vendor - SSA
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: SSA HQ East
Age: 42
Posts: 1,245

12V Company:
Sound Solutions Audio Inc.
Position:
Co-Owner

Thanks: 110
Thanked 32 Times in 21 Posts
Rep Power: 178 Aaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really nice


iTrader: (3)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by edzyy View Post
Not sure why ssa is in the SPL catagory.

They're lineup with the exception of the evil and zcon are SQ subs.
Thanks, as I was wondering the same thing, but the the Evil can be used in SQ installs for sure.
Aaron Clinton is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #60
Upgrade Your Membership!
 
subwoofery's Avatar
 
Enthusiast
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Newport Beach, CA
Posts: 6,214

Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 308 subwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond repute


iTrader: (7)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron Clinton View Post
Thanks, as I was wondering the same thing, but the the Evil can be used in SQ installs for sure.
What the woot?

Kelvin

Lycan
Quote:
I'll repeat it for the miliionth time : All amps do NOT sound the same ... It's astonishing to me that nobody understands this
Who knows, some might understand now
and here's another one and another <-- click on the links
subwoofery is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #61
DIYMA 500 Club
 
scion1403's Avatar
 
Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: lafayette,nj
Posts: 292

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 95 scion1403 is on a distinguished roadscion1403 is on a distinguished roadscion1403 is on a distinguished roadscion1403 is on a distinguished roadscion1403 is on a distinguished road


iTrader: (3)



Default

I agree that boutiques make better products on average. But here is something to consider a small audio maker may very well go out of business, stranding you without support. They may also deny support or service and they are not accountable like a large company. Also since they do not have the same relationships with vendors of parts they might need to switch parts suppliers in order to keep going and that can affect quality
scion1403 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #62
DIYMA 500 Club
 
Newbie
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 152

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 95 santiagodraco will become famous soon enoughsantiagodraco will become famous soon enoughsantiagodraco will become famous soon enoughsantiagodraco will become famous soon enoughsantiagodraco will become famous soon enoughsantiagodraco will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Wehmeyer View Post
Sony head unit? Sure. Sony speakers? Maybe not. This has far less to do with the size of a company than it does about the expertise of their product development department and whether that expertise is actually applied to the development of the product in question.
Exactly. This is the point I tried to make early on in the thread. Large or small is irrelevant. Ultimately it's about the people and the choices they make. A large company can build fantastic products just like a small company can assuming they have people with the right skills in the right roles - and this includes management making the right financial decisions, R&D making the right design decisions and manufacturing executing properly. At the end of the day the same dynamics drive all of the processes.

Current: Infiniti FX50s | Samsung HomeSync 1tb Android 4.3 optical/hdmi out controlled wirelessly by Galaxy Note 3 or Galaxy Pad 8.4
Alpine PXA-H800 Processor | Alpine PDX M12 - 2 Morel Ultimo 12sc | Alpine PDX-V9 - HAT Clarus 6 Midbass | Alpine PDX-F4 - HAT L1PR2 Pro Tweeters - L3SE Mids
santiagodraco is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #63
DIYMA 500 Club
Upgrade Your Membership!
 
Aaron Clinton's Avatar
 
Supporting Vendor - SSA
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: SSA HQ East
Age: 42
Posts: 1,245

12V Company:
Sound Solutions Audio Inc.
Position:
Co-Owner

Thanks: 110
Thanked 32 Times in 21 Posts
Rep Power: 178 Aaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really nice


iTrader: (3)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

This is an interesting topic on many levels, as when you see three company heads of differing size and quantity, things quickly become relative.

Sir Manville (JL Audio) - Mega volume with many great different products and top notch facility in Florida, all products stocking, some products made here in Florida some made overseas, moderate to higher price point.

Jacob (Sundown) - Mid level volume and climbing, increasing number of great item offerings, growing location in NC, some products stocking made over seas, some products made-to-order in NC, moderate price point.

Me (SSA) - Small level volume but climbing, small number of great product offerings, small location in Vegas & NY, minimal products stocking while majority are made-to-order all products built in Las Vegas, moderate price point.

So the perspective is relative to the needs and budget of the customers. The point being, it is not really fair to compare (in this example) JL to Sundown to SSA. Each can offer something the others can't, so value and "better products" is all relative to the install.
Aaron Clinton is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #64
DIYMA 500 Club
 
edzyy's Avatar
 
Enthusiast
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: The Big Apple/ATL
Posts: 1,907

Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 119 edzyy will become famous soon enoughedzyy will become famous soon enoughedzyy will become famous soon enoughedzyy will become famous soon enoughedzyy will become famous soon enoughedzyy will become famous soon enoughedzyy will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron Clinton View Post
Thanks, as I was wondering the same thing, but the the Evil can be used in SQ installs for sure.
Really?

Just found my next sub
edzyy is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #65
DIYMA 500 Club
 
Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: UK
Posts: 862

Thanks: 0
Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts
Rep Power: 114 captainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkZ View Post
This is the blatant type of stereotyping that Iwas .talking about earlier. You've never used some of their high end equipment, but you think it's bad because their xplod series sucks. Frankly, this is the very definition of ignorance.

Well lets deal with the ignorance first, from someone who told me i don't know how to spell 'FAVOUR'

I prostrait myself to someone who obviously had expereince of evey single Sony product that I refered to. Home Audio, Personal Audio, Car Audio. I was commenting on the few i have tried, and I've no wish to waste my hard earned money on any other. I have installed a Sony £5,500 Home Audio system,that i thought was equally garbage ... does that count.

If you're really putting Sony above, the likes of Brax, Mosconi, Digital Designs (on the SPL side) DLS ... consistant winners at EMMA ... then that's your personal opinion. Many other do or don't agree with you. But that's your opinion ... nothing else.

Quote:
Pioneer Pioneer DEH880 is a given
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkZ View Post
Your fellow enthusiasts here apparently disagree with you, since that head unit is probably the most common one that DIYMA folk buy.
Oh dear .. its hard for some people!!

Not sure that really meant i was saying that the Pioneer DEH880 is a bad product. Just saying many high-end and competition systems use the DEH880 (and previous high-end Pioneer HU's) and as a high-end piece of equipment, is seems to be an obvious choice.

Again, in the UK the range available to us is far less than you have in the U.S. But put Pioneer speakers and amps against the likes of Morel, DLS, Audison ... i couldn't pick pioneer over such brands.


Some brands it would seem perform consistanly well. Other brands seem to fair not so good. Sony, Pioneer, JVC, Kenwood, JBL, Infinity etc i believe have both their good and not so good products in range.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkZ View Post
Because he has no idea what he's talking about.

He also doesn't realize that about 1/3 of the brands in his "SQ" categoriy are actually owned by large companies. Then he goes on to say that large companies aren't as good, or some such nonsense.
Quote:
might deem as smaller or lesser known companies
I'm starting to doubt your ability to undertand what's actually being said!


Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkZ View Post


That's obvious.
On voicing your opinion, on this occassion, and attempting to slap others down in the process .. i'm afraid you are confused.

Last edited by captainscarlett; 04-23-2013 at 02:53 PM..
captainscarlett is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #66
DIYMA 500 Club
 
MarkZ's Avatar
 
Enthusiast
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: ..........................................
Posts: 6,851

Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 243 MarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really nice


iTrader: (4)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by captainscarlett View Post
Well lets deal with the ignorance first, from someone who told me i don't know how to spell 'FAVOUR'
It was a joke based on the fact that you felt it so important to announce that you were in the UK.

Quote:
I prostrait myself to someone who obviously had expereince of evey single Sony product that I refered to. Home Audio, Personal Audio, Car Audio. I was commenting on the few i have tried, and I've no wish to waste my hard earned money on any other.
And that's the problem. You commented about a product line that you admit to having no experience with, based on experience with a few other Sony products in different lines. Meanwhile, I posted a thread where at least two dozen DIYMA members gave thumbs up to a guy's collection of Sony ES amps, probably because they had some experience or knowledge of the craftsmanship of those particular products.

I would also criticize those same people if they said, "I owned a Sony XES amp before and it was great, and therefore all Sony equipment must be great!" They would of course be WRONG!

I wish more people understood that it's ok to say, "I have no experience with that product and therefore I will abstain from having an opinion about it." But every-fucking-body needs to feel like they have an opinion about every product ever.

Quote:
I have installed a Sony £5,500 Home Audio system,that i thought was equally garbage ... does that count
No, it doesn't. Because it has nothing to do with the products I asked you about.

Quote:
If you're really putting Sony above, the likes of Brax, Mosconi, Digital Designs (on the SPL side) DLS ... consistant winners at EMMA ... then that's your personal opinion. Many other do or don't agree with you. But that's your opinion ... nothing else.
At least that opinion is based on something concrete. Your opinion is based on guesswork and stereotyping. You've never used the products in question, and I'm guessing you never even realized they existed before this thread. So how on earth could you possibly have an opinion about them? Having an opinion based on experience with something is worth more than making guesses about a specialized line of amplifiers because you don't like Sony headphones.

What you have is not an opinion. It's a guess. Those are two entirely different things.

Quote:
Some brands it would seem perform consistanly well. Other brands seem to fair not so good. Sony, Pioneer, JVC, Kenwood etc i believe have both their good and not so good products in range.
That's not about consistency... it's about purpose and specialization. If tomorrow DLS said, "Hey, we have great amps, but a lot of people can't afford them. So we're going to offer a separate line of entry level amps that cost less but don't perform as well." Would you then think less of DLS's original amplifier line? Obviously, the original amplifiers would be exactly the same as what they were before they introduced the entry level line, so it doesn't make any sense for you to then say that they're now of lower quality.

BTW, you list CDT and Alpine on your "sq" list, but both of those companies have done EXACTLY what I describe above.

Quote:
Originally Posted by subwoofery
What I wanted to say is that amps ... sound the same.

Last edited by MarkZ; 04-23-2013 at 03:07 PM..
MarkZ is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #67
DIYMA 500 Club
 
Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: UK
Posts: 862

Thanks: 0
Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts
Rep Power: 114 captainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron Clinton View Post
but the the Evil can be used in SQ installs for sure.
I do love my Sundowns for SQ. As a UK enthusiast, i don't see SSA bening mentioned here much. I do see a lot of mention on the SMD forum!
captainscarlett is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #68
DIYMA 500 Club
 
Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: UK
Posts: 862

Thanks: 0
Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts
Rep Power: 114 captainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enoughcaptainscarlett will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

[QUOTE=MarkZ;1872108]
I wish more people understood that it's ok to say, "I have no experience with that product and therefore I will abstain from having an opinion about it." But every-fucking-body needs to feel like they have an opinion about every product ever.

QUOTE]



I think ... for me its a bit more simple than that. No one has resources and time to try and buy every product line up. Again personally I give any brand my own myoney two maybe three times, and that's your lot. I've no doubt some like specific Sony products as mentioned by yourslef and others, but I thought the disciusion as a 'Whole' was about brands as a whole.

My personal expereince of Sony ... low end gear or not low end gear (£5,500 HA system)has not been psositive. My experience as a whole with Sony has not been positive, and so asking me to part with my money for something from Sony would be near impossible to do, high-end or not.

At the same price point, my interaction with other brands like Morel, JL Audio and DLS ... the DLS and JL products .. has been far more positive.

Vibe Audio ... popular UK brand .. i gave them a lot of my hard eared. having broadened my range and experience of other brands.. I won't give them any more! This is how i feel about Sony.

Not saying that Sony are on a par with the likes of Boss, Lanzar of Plye ... but in my mind they might as well be ..... if you catch my drift MarkZ. I would say i've had far better experioence with JBL than Sony.

However i do satnd by my statement that as a whole, I believe the best products come from compaines that some might deem samller or lesser known companies .. Pioneer DEH880 and other singular products are a rare exection to that (my) rule.

Last edited by captainscarlett; 04-23-2013 at 03:48 PM..
captainscarlett is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #69
DIYMA 500 Club
 
MarkZ's Avatar
 
Enthusiast
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: ..........................................
Posts: 6,851

Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 243 MarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really niceMarkZ is just really nice


iTrader: (4)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

That's fine, but I think judging things "as a whole" is a major impediment to most people in car audio. You will be doing yourself a favor by judging each piece of equipment by its own merit instead of trying to pigeonhole ALL Sony as this, and ALL JL Audio as that, etc.

Even the so-called terrible brands you listed make a few good products. Pyle, for example, has historically made some pretty good gear. A couple guys here even run Pyle subs with great success. The same goes for Lanzar... didn't Stephen Mantz once design amps for them? He then went on to design some very other well-regarded amps, including the ESX Quantum series which people here DIE for 15 years later. Then he sold ESX which was bought by a Japanese company that started making garbage with ESX stamped on the front of it.

That little story I think illustrates exactly why it's dangerous to attribute a certain "quality" to a brand name, or even worse, to an entire company!

That doesn't mean you shouldn't be wary about certain manufacturers, or that some broader conclusions can't be drawn. I think this can be a valuable site when people share their experiences about particular products instead of trying to group everything into one big bucket.

But this is true for most things in life.

Quote:
Originally Posted by subwoofery
What I wanted to say is that amps ... sound the same.
MarkZ is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2013   #70
DIYMA 500 Club
Upgrade Your Membership!
 
Aaron Clinton's Avatar
 
Supporting Vendor - SSA
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: SSA HQ East
Age: 42
Posts: 1,245

12V Company:
Sound Solutions Audio Inc.
Position:
Co-Owner

Thanks: 110
Thanked 32 Times in 21 Posts
Rep Power: 178 Aaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really niceAaron Clinton is just really nice


iTrader: (3)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by captainscarlett View Post
I do love my Sundowns for SQ. As a UK enthusiast, i don't see SSA bening mentioned here much. I do see a lot of mention on the SMD forum!
Surprised on being mentioned on that forum.
Aaron Clinton is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-24-2013   #71
DIYMA 500 Club
 
Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Atlanta GA.
Posts: 438

Thanks: 1
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Rep Power: 133 cheebs will become famous soon enoughcheebs will become famous soon enoughcheebs will become famous soon enoughcheebs will become famous soon enoughcheebs will become famous soon enoughcheebs will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (19)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

most interesting. this is a issue i have as a whole with this subject. most all companies lines are like the tide. you will have this great item and the company will ether surround it with shit products lines or it will cost too much for the core of car audio buyers and or the others in the same line will suck. sucking in this case is ether the product is just plan bad or bad for it's price point.

the truth is most of the sh!tty product lines are not made for us.(diy guys) they are made for the person who would like a better product than factory but isn't going much farther than that and to them it works fine. the smaller companies just are not big enough to go after the niche market they are in and best buy market too. they don't have the reach. they stick to what they do and do that well. also they tend to be closer to their core market so if a product isn't working the can change faster than the larger ones can. (when was the last time you seen sony or pioneer at a local event.)

second sometimes when a company gets a great product the corporate side milks the hell out of it and kills the rep of the company. than no matter what the company puts out to most people it will say it sucks. say like Audi. Audi makes a great car now but in the early 90s and late 80s they sucked hard and it stuck with them til almost 2000. perfect example is as we know there are a few amps that share the same internals and i am talking about the ones with all the same internals. there are about five or six of them. but some of the are said to suck because of the product name. when you ask why most will tell you about another product line that they had that sucked. think about it you can get a post with 20 people telling you this amp sucks but if you Google it you can't find any bad reviews about it.

cheebs is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-24-2013   #72
Upgrade Your Membership!
 
rton20s's Avatar
 
Enthusiast
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Central Valley California
Posts: 8,658

Thanks: 656
Thanked 710 Times in 515 Posts
Rep Power: 358 rton20s has a reputation beyond reputerton20s has a reputation beyond reputerton20s has a reputation beyond reputerton20s has a reputation beyond reputerton20s has a reputation beyond reputerton20s has a reputation beyond reputerton20s has a reputation beyond reputerton20s has a reputation beyond reputerton20s has a reputation beyond reputerton20s has a reputation beyond reputerton20s has a reputation beyond repute


iTrader: (8)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Trying to read through that hurt my eyes.
rton20s is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-29-2013   #73
DIYMA 500 Club
 
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: South Florida
Posts: 981

12V Company:
JL Audio
Position:
VP Marketing

Thanks: 27
Thanked 170 Times in 80 Posts
Rep Power: 320 msmith has a reputation beyond reputemsmith has a reputation beyond reputemsmith has a reputation beyond reputemsmith has a reputation beyond reputemsmith has a reputation beyond reputemsmith has a reputation beyond reputemsmith has a reputation beyond reputemsmith has a reputation beyond reputemsmith has a reputation beyond reputemsmith has a reputation beyond reputemsmith has a reputation beyond repute


iTrader: (2)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by cajunner View Post
I think the small company is the one that has the founder still involved in day to day operations, and maybe does some engineering okays or nays.
By this definition, JL Audio is still a small company. The company founder, Lucio Proni, is also the Chief Engineer and directly participates in all speaker design and is involved in a lot of the amplifier design as well.
msmith is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-29-2013   #74
DIYMA 500 Club
 
07azhhr's Avatar
 
Enthusiast
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Mesa AZ
Age: 45
Posts: 1,952

Thanks: 1
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Rep Power: 116 07azhhr will become famous soon enough07azhhr will become famous soon enough07azhhr will become famous soon enough07azhhr will become famous soon enough07azhhr will become famous soon enough07azhhr will become famous soon enough07azhhr will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (3)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by msmith View Post
By this definition, JL Audio is still a small company. The company founder, Lucio Proni, is also the Chief Engineer and directly participates in all speaker design and is involved in a lot of the amplifier design as well.
Do you or he think you guys are still a small company?

Pioneer 80prs, Zapco DC 350.2 powering Audible Physics in the kicks/Soon to be DC 350.2 and DC 200.2 powering Morel Hybrid Integra 402, Zapco DC 750.2 powering Morel Elate MW 6 in the doors, Zapco DC 500.1 powering RE Audio SE (original series) 15
07azhhr is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-29-2013   #75
Upgrade Your Membership!
 
subwoofery's Avatar
 
Enthusiast
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Newport Beach, CA
Posts: 6,214

Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Rep Power: 308 subwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond reputesubwoofery has a reputation beyond repute


iTrader: (7)



Default Re: SMALLER AUDIO COMPANIES MAKE BETTER PRODUCTS THAN MAINSTREAM COMPANIES

Quote:
Originally Posted by 07azhhr View Post
Do you or he think you guys are still a small company?
Not anymore

Kelvin

Lycan
Quote:
I'll repeat it for the miliionth time : All amps do NOT sound the same ... It's astonishing to me that nobody understands this
Who knows, some might understand now
and here's another one and another <-- click on the links
subwoofery is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Bookmarks

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Car Audio | DiyMobileAudio.com | Car Stereo Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:
Location
Where you live
First name
Last name
Do you work in the 12 Volt industry?
Do you work in the 12 Volt industry?
Youtube Channel
Enter Your Youtube Username, And It will Be Linked To In Your Posts!
12V Industry - Company Name
Your company name.
12V Industry - Your Position
Your position in your company.

Log-in



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:19 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

Ad Management by RedTyger

Home | User CP | Members List | New Posts | ITrader | Faq | Post Spy