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Old 06-15-2017   #1
 
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Default Help Tuning Clarion's Full Digital System

I'm too new to post a link to Clarion's website, but you can find details on their full digital system there.

I went with the NX807 Nav unit so I would have a digital optical out to the Z3 processor. I'm awaiting my sub box to get here, so for now, I'm just running the tweeters and mids.

As this full digital approach is still relatively new, I'm finding it hard to locate any good resources on tuning it. The good news is, the Clarion Z-tune app is great. It allows for on the fly adjustments to the crossover, to include gain, slope, and even phase. You can also adjust the time delay and it has a 31 band EQ.

Currently, my settings are as follows:
Tweeters:
HPF = 2kHz
Slope = 12
Gain = -9
Phase = Normal

Mids:
HPF = 100kHz
Slope = 6
LPF = 12.5kHz
Slope = 12
Gain = 0
Phase = Normal

Any help would be great. To be honest, the tweeters scream at higher volume levels but the mids aren't as loud as I would expect. It is almost like I can't turn the volume up beyond the speaker capabilities.
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Old 06-15-2017   #2
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Default Re: Help Tuning Clarion's Full Digital System

theres nothing wrong with your settings, that's an interesting starting point, but theres a lot wrong if your going for volume and sound quality. this is what I would do personally, and it may work, but keep in mind every car is different, and I have 0 experience with the clarion full digital..just..i know what a 6.5 and tweeter usually will do.

tweeter, highpass 3100 hz 24 db.
mid, lowpass at 2200 hz 12 db, invert phase. highpass at 90 hz 24 db.

try that, then adjust tweeter gain to where you like it. it is not uncommon for the tweeter to be say way lower than the midbasses.

"you will need to use all 31 bands on the eq, qualifying a speaker as better cause you feel it needs lesser eq just means you're not listening closely enough."
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Old 06-15-2017   #3
 
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Default Re: Help Tuning Clarion's Full Digital System

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lycancatt View Post
theres nothing wrong with your settings, that's an interesting starting point, but theres a lot wrong if your going for volume and sound quality. this is what I would do personally, and it may work, but keep in mind every car is different, and I have 0 experience with the clarion full digital..just..i know what a 6.5 and tweeter usually will do.

tweeter, highpass 3100 hz 24 db.
mid, lowpass at 2200 hz 12 db, invert phase. highpass at 90 hz 24 db.

try that, then adjust tweeter gain to where you like it. it is not uncommon for the tweeter to be say way lower than the midbasses.
Thanks for your inputs! To be honest, I am very new at trying to tune. I spent the last few nights looking at youtube videos, so bear with me. I based my inputs on doing google searches but I don't doubt that they aren't optimal.

One quick question, can you expound upon what you mean by, "but theres a lot wrong if your going for volume and sound quality." I take it you are thinking there is a lot I'm leaving on the table?

Thanks again...
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Old 06-15-2017   #4
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Default Re: Help Tuning Clarion's Full Digital System

if you use a six db slope on the highpass, you are making a small speaker work harder than it should using up power you could devote to overall volume. it probably sounds good without the sub so I get why you might have ended up there, but a 6.5 really doesn't do much below 80 hz in the average door.

and from the sq point of view, you have a lot of overlap between tweeter and mid, so you are putting a whole lot of spurious sound into the car from the upper range of the mids, and that might explain why you feel the tweeters scream at you.

"you will need to use all 31 bands on the eq, qualifying a speaker as better cause you feel it needs lesser eq just means you're not listening closely enough."
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Old 06-15-2017   #5
 
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Default Re: Help Tuning Clarion's Full Digital System

That makes a lot of sense.

Ok, here is what my crossover is allowing. I'll start here and see how it is sounding:
Tweeters
HPF = 3.15kHz
Slope = 24
Gain = 0
Phase = Normal

Mids
HPF = 80Hz (my EQ only allows 80 or 100)
Slope = 24
LPF = 2kHz (my EQ only allows 1.6, 2, 2.5)
Slope = 12
Gain = 0
Phase = Reverse

I'll give that a try and report back.
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Old 06-15-2017   #6
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Default Re: Help Tuning Clarion's Full Digital System

you might find 2.5 k at 18 db works better than 2k at 12, I like a gap there especially to avoid beaming in the midrange, but that's a bigger gap than maybe works good. if the tweeters are reflecting off the winchield the lower end of them will be reinforced so the gap might work. also, I think the 0 db gain for tweeters will end up being way to high and they will still overpower the mids, but not knowing amp power, efficiency etc, I cant recommend where to put gains..but -9 might be a good start like you currently have.

"you will need to use all 31 bands on the eq, qualifying a speaker as better cause you feel it needs lesser eq just means you're not listening closely enough."
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Old 06-15-2017   #7
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Default Re: Help Tuning Clarion's Full Digital System

thump

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Old 06-16-2017   #8
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lycancatt View Post
you might find 2.5 k at 18 db works better than 2k at 12, I like a gap there especially to avoid beaming in the midrange, but that's a bigger gap than maybe works good. if the tweeters are reflecting off the winchield the lower end of them will be reinforced so the gap might work. also, I think the 0 db gain for tweeters will end up being way to high and they will still overpower the mids, but not knowing amp power, efficiency etc, I cant recommend where to put gains..but -9 might be a good start like you currently have.
I gotta say, your inputs made such an improvement! My high end home audio isn't as clear as this setup. I'm excited to keep tweeking on it, but you gave me such a good staring point, so thanks for that.

As for the Clarion stuff, I have to say, it is impressive but not blow your hair back loud. I can still run my receiver at max volume (40) without exceeding the capabilities of the speakers. Granted, I went on a four hour car ride yesterday and didn't turn my system up past 30, but it does seem a little "quiet" compared to traditional amp and speaker combos. With that said, it is crystal clear. And I mean crystal. I'm excited to add in the rear 6.75" speakers and the two shallow subs, that should really thicken the soundstage.

Thanks again.
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Default

And if you have any advice for the starting crossover settings for the rear 6.5s and two subs, I'd love your opinion!
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Old 08-04-2017   #10
 
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Default Re: Help Tuning Clarion's Full Digital System

I'm installing the rear doors and dual subs today.

This is what I'm looking at so far. Any tips? How do my settings look?

Z3 tweeters:
6ohm
1.5kHz ~ 40kHz

Z7 mids:
Driving section:
89dB at 1W S/N
102dB Dynamic Range
10Hz ~ 48kHz +/- 2dB Freq Response
Speaker section:
4ohm
28Hz ~ 15kHz
60Hz Fs
0.85 Qts

Z25W subs:
Driving section:
90dB at 1W S/N
103 dB Dynamic Range
10Hz ~ 48kHz +/- 2dB
Speaker section:
4ohm
20Hz ~ 200Hz Frequency Response
38Hz Fs
4.75 Qms

And this is what I have so far. Any advice on how to dial this in?

Tweeters:
HPF = 3.15kHz
Slope = -24
Gain =-9.0
Phase = Normal

Mids:
HPF = 80Hz
Slope = -24
LPF = 2.5kHz
Slope = -18
Gain = 0
Phase = REV

Subs:
HPF = 20Hz
Slope = -12
LPF = 80Hz
Slope = -12
Gain = 0
Phase = Normal
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Default Re: Help Tuning Clarion's Full Digital System

Can I ask please how would the clarion system compare to a dsp like helix p six with hybrid audio speakers and a sub

i mean its strange that i am not seeing these glowing reviews about the clarion, and that only few bought it, any reason why ?
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Old 11-13-2018   #12
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hykbooks View Post
Can I ask please how would the clarion system compare to a dsp like helix p six with hybrid audio speakers and a sub

i mean its strange that i am not seeing these glowing reviews about the clarion, and that only few bought it, any reason why ?
Because helix?
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Old 11-13-2018   #13
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Default Re: Help Tuning Clarion's Full Digital System

Quote:
Originally Posted by hykbooks View Post
Can I ask please how would the clarion system compare to a dsp like helix p six with hybrid audio speakers and a sub

i mean its strange that i am not seeing these glowing reviews about the clarion, and that only few bought it, any reason why ?
Maybe because:
Clarion = 1/3rd octave graphic eq & only 1/3oct for xover filter freq's
Helix = 30 band full parametric eq & continously variable xover filter freq's

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Old 02-01-2019   #14
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Default Re: Help Tuning Clarion's Full Digital System

Quote:
Originally Posted by jackers View Post
I'm too new to post a link to Clarion's website, but you can find details on their full digital system there.

I went with the NX807 Nav unit so I would have a digital optical out to the Z3 processor. I'm awaiting my sub box to get here, so for now, I'm just running the tweeters and mids.

A bit of an off-topic question here, how's the clarion working for you in terms of usability up till now? I was pondering over getting that head unit for the optical output along with an external DSP. Can you share some pros and cons?

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