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Old 2 Weeks Ago   #76
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Default Re: Stereo Integrity TM65 mkIII impressions

Yeah, it's DEFINITELY not an easy business. And there is a crazy amount of competition coming at you from all sides, and from large corporations that have big marketing and advertising budgets.

Unfortunately, from my experience with these types of product categories and in this segment of the marketplace, it's important to maintain several lines at different quality levels & pricepoints, for a variety of reasons.

A) The High-End Product Line...to show that you are a serious contender and that all of your products are based on a foundation of high-end technology & engineering, and that you can compete with the "big boys". For those that want the best, you have that category covered. (And still at reasonable price points compared to the competition).

B) At least one "point of entry" product line that "gets people in the door" and offers really good performance, but at an accessible price for the masses. Something on the order of, "Our 'Performance' line offers nearly all of our proprietary, trickle-down technology from our "Expert" line, but using soft parts & hardware that allow us to offer an excellent level of performance at substantial savings. The 'Performance' line is our absolute best value for excellent SQ without the 'High-End' price tag!"

C) But you also need to have "B" as a "stepping stone" to "A". And you need to maintain "B" as a supplementary line to "A". For instance, I have the ''Expert" line as my front stage, and the "Performance" line for rear fill, or to cover the rear passengers. Or I have the "Expert" line in my main "fun" vehicle, and the "Performance" line in the family SUV or minivan, etc. "But when money permits, I'll switch everything over to the 'Expert' line". This allows for more potential sales overall.

Look at how Hybrid Audio Technologies and Audiofrog have developed their lineup over time and continue to maintain them. You'll see the same across most brands, and in all of the products they offer.

Obviously, producing and maintaining the multiple lineups requires a huge investment and commitment! But I know of several companies that maintain a "break-even" product that helps to support their "money maker" product(s) just so that "on the books" they can acquire better investment financing and can show and project increased sales numbers. Or vice-versa.

I know that it might not make sense, but if I can show the bank that there is potential for several thousand orders of my "break-even" product line, with future potential for increased profits as economies of scale grow (lower manufacturing cost with increased quantities over time in the future), this looks better for sustained business and income growth compared to coming to the table with just 100 potential orders for my "premier" product.

So the "break-even" product supports the financing to manufacture & produce the "money maker" product line, where otherwise you might not be able to obtain or create the capital to get ANY of your products manufactured.

One thing is for sure...

It takes money to make money. It's rough out there!

Yes, it seems logical to just produce a Passive Crossover network for the TM65-III/M3/M25 since all of the R&D and tooling for the drivers is already in place. And I would LOVE to see that happen.

But, as Jason said, those still might be at too high of a price point for the potential customers he is targeting. He needs that "point of entry" or general consumer product line first.

Last edited by bbfoto; 2 Weeks Ago at 02:49 PM..
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Default Re: Stereo Integrity TM65 mkIII impressions

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Originally Posted by bertholomey View Post
I talked to Nick from SI recently - Iím not speaking for him, but it appears to be a business decision. He did an analysis of his sales for the last couple years, and he evaluated many of the communications he has received over that time period.

The analysis showed that a large percentage of the folks who contact them are looking for a solution that isnít about raw drivers and active processors. He has had guys on the phone - about to give cc info ask if crossovers are included. He explained that the M25ís, M3ís, and TM65ís are raw drivers that are intended to be utilized in an active set up. Well, that isnít what the customer wanted.

He seems to be looking in a different direction - focusing on the potential larger customer pool than those on DIYMA, and he has decided to not attempt to support both models - active raw driver model and the 2 way with crossover model.
Correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jroo View Post
That's really weird and I am just thinking out loud here. If he in fact has more people calling him to do a comp set versus raw drivers, wouldn't it be easier to get a passive designed and built versus scraping the tweeter and the Mid. Unless he is thinking some budget line that priced lower than the set but I would do a high end raw driver line and lower end consumer comp set.
In our growth over the past 2 years regarding component speakers I looked over one key item: that most of my customers want a turn-key component set. DIYMA is great but DIYMA accounts for less than 15% of my total sales these days. I love you guys and enjoy the discussions, tech talk, etc, but where I/we (DIYMA enthusiasts) are in terms of system design is not the same place that a lot of people are in car audio. Meaning us here on DIYMA assume we need a 4 channel amplifier with full crossover abilities per channel, without a DSP, to run a single pair of components actively. Almost everyone else shy's away from that. As Jason pointed out, I can not tell you how many customers have told me "Oh, it doesn't include crossovers and I need two 4 channel amps to run two sets of your component speakers...yeah...I'll call you back" only to never hear from them again.

We are working with another company to develop a passive set of 6.5's/tweeters/crossovers for under $400 shipped. Said 6.5s will have more midbass than our previous TM65's with a normal amount of applied power with smoother midrange. The 6.5 will use a 2" coil and have 6 mm of Xmax with a slightly higher Qe/Qt than normal to achieve the most midbass performance possible while using choice components to get smoother, more airy, midrange out of an in-door application. The tweeter will be a slightly oversized unit (larger than 25 mm) capable of playing out to/past where most of our ears stop at 16,000/20,000 Hz. Passive network will be small and easy to mount. A complete package.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdunk54nl View Post
I am sure it also has to do with finances. It takes a lot of upfront cost to have multiple products sitting on a shelf. He probably has to make a choice of what is going to make him the most money and sit on the shelf the shortest amount of time.

Now he could potentially do some pre-sale stuff like he has in the past, but that can cause issues as I am sure a bunch of us have seen. I personally don't think the issues that those can cause are worth that effort.
Pre-sales have been good for us in the past but we fully realize who our market is and a fairly expensive ($500+) active component set is not that market. These new 6.5/tweeter component sets will sell considerably quicker to our current market. Our market wants stellar performance with a passive crossover network without without spending $1,000 on the set.

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Default Re: Stereo Integrity TM65 mkIII impressions

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Originally Posted by Electrodynamic View Post
We are working with another company to develop a passive set of 6.5's/tweeters/crossovers for under $400 shipped. Said 6.5s will have more midbass than our previous TM65's with a normal amount of applied power with smoother midrange. The 6.5 will use a 2" coil and have 6 mm of Xmax with a slightly higher Qe/Qt than normal to achieve the most midbass performance possible while using choice components to get smoother, more airy, midrange out of an in-door application. The tweeter will be a slightly oversized unit (larger than 25 mm) capable of playing out to/past where most of our ears stop at 16,000/20,000 Hz. Passive network will be small and easy to mount. A complete package.
Sounds great, Nick. Looking forward to it!

Curious if you'd consider selling both the 6.5" and tweeter individually as raw drivers for those that are already running active? Or would that throw a hitch in production & inventory of complete sets?

Thanks for taking the time to post all of the information that you did. Great insight.
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Default

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Originally Posted by bbfoto View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Electrodynamic View Post
We are working with another company to develop a passive set of 6.5's/tweeters/crossovers for under $400 shipped. Said 6.5s will have more midbass than our previous TM65's with a normal amount of applied power with smoother midrange. The 6.5 will use a 2" coil and have 6 mm of Xmax with a slightly higher Qe/Qt than normal to achieve the most midbass performance possible while using choice components to get smoother, more airy, midrange out of an in-door application. The tweeter will be a slightly oversized unit (larger than 25 mm) capable of playing out to/past where most of our ears stop at 16,000/20,000 Hz. Passive network will be small and easy to mount. A complete package.
Sounds great, Nick. Looking forward to it!

Curious if you'd consider selling both the 6.5" and tweeter individually as raw drivers for those that are already running active? Or would that throw a hitch in production & inventory of complete sets?

Thanks for taking the time to post all of the information that you did. Great insight. [IMG class=inlineimg]https://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/images/smilies/thumbsup.gif[/IMG]
Yes sir. I forgot to mention that, but yes the raw components will be available without the crossovers.

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Default Re: Stereo Integrity TM65 mkIII impressions

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Originally Posted by Electrodynamic View Post
Yes sir. I forgot to mention that, but yes the raw components will be available without the crossovers.
what kind of ETA are you shooting for on the comps and raw drivers
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Default Re: Stereo Integrity TM65 mkIII impressions

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Originally Posted by Jscoyne2 View Post
Im talking about the surround being attached to the metal part where you put screws. So it can twist the surround off.

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NIce
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