CLD Testing - Page 8 - Car Audio | DiyMobileAudio.com | Car Stereo Forum

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 4 Weeks Ago   #176
DIYMA 500 Club
 
Lou Frasier2's Avatar
 
Member
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: manteca,california
Age: 52
Posts: 814

Thanks: 5
Thanked 60 Times in 44 Posts
Rep Power: 98 Lou Frasier2 will become famous soon enoughLou Frasier2 will become famous soon enoughLou Frasier2 will become famous soon enoughLou Frasier2 will become famous soon enoughLou Frasier2 will become famous soon enoughLou Frasier2 will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: CLD Testing

Quote:
Originally Posted by VP2015 View Post
What do you think vibrations propagating through the air are?

Thinsulate is not even close to being one of the most cost-effective acoustic insulations, especially not in applications where having a lot of thermal insulation is also desirable. I won't bother mentioning examples because (based on past experience) I doubt you're really interested in them anyway, because you already believe you "know" what works and what doesn't.

I use USB Clip-on Omnidirectional Condenser Microphones, which cost about $14-$15 each. It really only takes five or six, although more is better.
I guess your next complaint will be that this type of mic isn't "good enough" but in fact, the only real drawback is they are omnidirectional, which is easily changed using the method I mentioned in a previous post. The consistency is excellent because the exact same mic is used in the exact same location & orientation before & after treatment.

As I mentioned before, it always seems to turn into an argument between people like *you* who presume to know what will work best without actually having tested much, if anything, yourself, and those like me who have done that (along with more product research than you would believe). I guess that's the difference between amateur and professional. So, I'll let you get back to your previously established presumptions.
did you not get the part where he said from his understanding?no need to come off so harsh
Lou Frasier2 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 4 Weeks Ago   #177
 
Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: TN
Posts: 1,150

Thanks: 108
Thanked 210 Times in 166 Posts
Rep Power: 86 dgage will become famous soon enoughdgage will become famous soon enoughdgage will become famous soon enoughdgage will become famous soon enoughdgage will become famous soon enoughdgage will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (8)



Default Re: CLD Testing

Dude, you’re welcome to volunteer and put forth a testing methodology and see if people will donate to help you test some products.

TOOSTUBBORN2FAIL did CLD testing several years ago that were valuable and did provide valuable consumer information. Based on that testing and the different products now, he offered to test some more products using an improved testing methodology. He has taken his valuable time and money to do some testing that will benefit the DIYMA community. Will it answer every question we want/need, no, but it will definitely help with which are the better CLD materials on the market.

I am grateful for the time and effort TOOSTUBBORN2FAIL has put into the CLD testing he has proposed.

If you have a different set of criteria to test, by all means start a new thread as the more information people have, the better. As you said, the study of acoustics is very complex and no one test will answer the myriad of questions we have or some we don’t even know need asking.
dgage is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 4 Weeks Ago   #178
 
Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 374

Thanks: 47
Thanked 46 Times in 38 Posts
Rep Power: 59 jdunk54nl will become famous soon enoughjdunk54nl will become famous soon enoughjdunk54nl will become famous soon enoughjdunk54nl will become famous soon enoughjdunk54nl will become famous soon enoughjdunk54nl will become famous soon enough


iTrader: (0)



Default Re: CLD Testing

Quote:
Originally Posted by VP2015 View Post
What do you think vibrations propagating through the air are?

Thinsulate is not even close to being one of the most cost-effective acoustic insulations, especially not in applications where having a lot of thermal insulation is also desirable. I won't bother mentioning examples because (based on past experience) I doubt you're really interested in them anyway, because you already believe you "know" what works and what doesn't.

I use USB Clip-on Omnidirectional Condenser Microphones, which cost about $14-$15 each. It really only takes five or six, although more is better.
I guess your next complaint will be that this type of mic isn't "good enough" but in fact, the only real drawback is they are omnidirectional, which is easily changed using the method I mentioned in a previous post. The consistency is excellent because the exact same mic is used in the exact same location & orientation before & after treatment.

As I mentioned before, it always seems to turn into an argument between people like *you* who presume to know what will work best without actually having tested much, if anything, yourself, and those like me who have done that (along with more product research than you would believe). I guess that's the difference between amateur and professional. So, I'll let you get back to your previously established presumptions.

This felt personal and it is my first interaction with you.... Maybe you didn't mean it to be personal but you used the word "you" a lot which definitely portrays the original writer, or me in this instance.

I wasn't disagreeing that your method would *probably* yield better results, which is why I said it is good. But your method is still beyond what most people are willing to do and for how much of an improvement over the standard 25%+ coverage of CLD (less than 6db compared to 100% coverage according to the paper you linked)? Will your method of measuring first result in 0db difference compared to 100%? or 5db difference? I also say probably because to actually figure that out, we would need to have a very controlled test, using the same exact car and applying the CLD with the "standard" method and measuring results compared to applying with your methods results. We would have to use the same car, as you stated, all vehicles are different. This would be very hard in reality so we go to tests like TS2F's CLD test and Justin Zazzi's MLV test.

You have to admit that if you just use one microphone this is going to take some time to do all of the tests. If you were to buy more microphones, even at $15 a piece that is $100. Is that $100 and less time invested better spent on other sound deadening materials? A $100 buys ~15sqft more of Resonix Squares and minimal additional time when you are already applying it.

Also, while panel vibrations do contribute to vehicle noise, there have been quite a few tests with data (which I am sure you are aware based on your writings in this thread, so I won't bother linking them) that CLD alone does very little for sound reduction in vehicles when compared to other products.

Even the "white paper" that you linked states that CLD isn't that effective at normal car temperatures of up to 40 degrees celsius. Also, that white paper does not go into any testing methodologies to achieve that data, so definitely is not a paper that I would be able to quote if I was writing a paper on dampening. It also says estimated noise reduction so those two things make me lean to these are theoretical values and never actually tested.

I'm a scientist by nature and career. Therefore I am always open to new data and my mind being changed. But there is definitely an amount of diminishing returns that is happening with your microphone method. Which was my whole point.

If you are Jennifer Renninger of E-A-R (a 3m company), then the facilities/materials are already there for you to do this type of testing and I am sure you would do it just because that is what you like to do. So it is time well spent.

2014 F150 Limited -> Factory HU programmed for 4v outputs -> Helix DSP.2 -> Alpine PDX-V9 -> SI M25 in Valicar Stuttgart Pods, SI TM65 mk3, & JL TW3. Rears: SB17's. Resonix 35% CLD and 100% CCF, 100% MLV, Soon: PDX-F6 and SI M3 in Valicar Stuttgart pods

Last edited by jdunk54nl; 4 Weeks Ago at 02:47 PM..
jdunk54nl is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Bookmarks

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Car Audio | DiyMobileAudio.com | Car Stereo Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:
Location
Where you live
First name
Last name
Do you work in the 12 Volt industry?
Do you work in the 12 Volt industry?
Youtube Channel
Enter Your Youtube Username, And It will Be Linked To In Your Posts!
12V Industry - Company Name
Your company name.
12V Industry - Your Position
Your position in your company.

Log-in



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Sound Deadening (CLD) Testing TOOSTUBBORN2FAIL Member Reviews & Product Comparisons 1725 03-05-2019 02:51 PM
CLD Testing 2 - Application Techniques TOOSTUBBORN2FAIL Member Reviews & Product Comparisons 12 07-30-2016 09:22 PM
How much CLD coverage on a door? Mahkku General Car Audio Discussion 12 10-19-2009 03:24 PM
Removing butyl CLD from butyl rubber speaker surround... impossible? shadowfactory Technical & Advanced Car Audio Discussion 6 08-29-2009 01:30 PM
Testing...1 , 2 Testing Oliver Technical & Advanced Car Audio Discussion 26 05-14-2008 10:27 AM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:07 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

Ad Management by RedTyger

Home | User CP | Members List | New Posts | ITrader | Faq | Post Spy