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Robot Chicken 08-13-2019 03:50 PM

Mid bass help
 
I am looking to increase the mid bass in my 2018 Ram 1500. I have run out of stock locations but I was thinking I could add some smaller speaker in an amp rack I a building behind the back seat. I have about 5 to 6 inches of clearnce for these speakers. So my question is would it be better to go with two eights or four 6.5's?. I am looking to cover about 80 to 400 hz. My main concern with the smaller speakers and higher frequencies is that they will be deadened by the fabric behind the seat. Any thoughts?

Hillbilly SQ 08-13-2019 04:00 PM

Re: Mid bass help
 
What have you done in regards to door treatment? And what are you running for gear in your system right now?

gijoe 08-13-2019 04:10 PM

Re: Mid bass help
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Hillbilly SQ (Post 5735707)
What have you done in regards to door treatment? And what are you running for gear in your system right now?

Yeah.

If you're current midbass isn't cutting it, it's best to replace them with something that can instead of adding more speakers. The more speakers you add the more phase problems you'll have, and it will be nearly impossible to balance the sound to accomplish what you want. The ideal situation would be to use as few (capable) speakers as possible.

Get midbass speakers that are better suited for the job, treat the doors, add some processing, but don't throw more speakers at the problem.

Robot Chicken 08-13-2019 04:14 PM

I just finished adding some noico 80 mil to the entire interior. current equipment is

Hertz ML 1650.3 components and 700.3 for midrange. JL stealthbox dual TW10's. Hertz 6.5's in the rear doors. Amps are XD800.8 with 4 channels at 150 for the front mid bass. 75 for the midrange and tweeters and a XD400.4 for the rears at 75 watts. MiniDSP 8x12 (non DL)

Thanks

Robot Chicken 08-13-2019 04:15 PM

Sorry, forgot to add HD750/1 for the subs

Robot Chicken 08-13-2019 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gijoe (Post 5735715)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Hillbilly SQ (Post 5735707)
What have you done in regards to door treatment? And what are you running for gear in your system right now?

Yeah.

If you're current midbass isn't cutting it, it's best to replace them with something that can instead of adding more speakers. The more speakers
you add the more phase problems you'll have, and it will be nearly impossible to balance the sound to accomplish what you want. The ideal situation would be to use as few (capable) speakers as possible.

Get midbass speakers that are better suited for the job, treat the doors, add some processing, but don't throw more speakers at the problem.

I was afraid someone was going to say that. Any suggestions on a good mid bass speaker?

Hillbilly SQ 08-13-2019 04:34 PM

Re: Mid bass help
 
Have you checked to make sure your sub and midbass are in acoustical phase? An rta will help with this. Basically you need to make sure your acoustical slope is about the same as your electrical slope. And did you use some memory foam weather stripping to seal the front of the midbass to the door panel so sound doesn't splatter behind the panel causing cancellation?

gijoe 08-13-2019 04:34 PM

Re: Mid bass help
 
I'd would definitely try cutting the rear midbass out of the equation first, or at least spend some time with the DSP to ensure that they are perfectly in phase with the front midbass. The TA needs to be done properly, if the midbass are out of phase you're going to have cancellation.

Also, sub phase like Hillbilly just pointed out.

Hillbilly SQ 08-13-2019 04:36 PM

Re: Mid bass help
 
Have you used Tracerite to set time alignment? Make sure you enter your crossover points also because that's an important part of proper time alignment setting.

Robot Chicken 08-13-2019 04:54 PM

Re: Mid bass help
 
I have used REW to try and get things as close as I can but I am still playing with it to see where I see the phase bumps but I always end up trying by ear. I suck at TA but I know it is an important part of it all - It is for this very reason I am thinking about the DL upgrade to my miniDSP but I don't want to spend the $$$ if I don't have too. As for Tracerite - is there a big difference between that site and placing the distance values in the DSP?

gijoe 08-13-2019 04:58 PM

Re: Mid bass help
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Robot Chicken (Post 5735755)
I have used REW to try and get things as close as I can but I am still playing with it to see where I see the phase bumps but I always end up trying by ear. I suck at TA but I know it is an important part of it all - It is for this very reason I am thinking about the DL upgrade to my miniDSP but I don't want to spend the $$$ if I don't have too. As for Tracerite - is there a big difference between that site and placing the distance values in the DSP?

Don't over complicate TA, it's very easy. You don't need REW, you don't need a mic, you only need a measuring tape and something to measure to that is where the center of your head would be while driving.

I hang something from my headline and measure from the center of each speaker to that spot, as long as you do this carefully and accurately your done. You're trying to measure from the voice coil to the listening position, so be as accurate as you can, if you can get within a half an inch or so you won't need to do anything else.

Tracerite can be very good too, but in order for it to work you still need to take accurate measurement from the source of the sound wave to the listening position.

P.S. make sure to set all speaker to the same polarity (phase) first.

Robot Chicken 08-13-2019 05:03 PM

Re: Mid bass help
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by gijoe (Post 5735765)
Don't over complicate TA, it's very easy. You don't need REW, you don't need a mic, you only need a measuring tape and something to measure to that is where the center of your head would be while driving.

I hang something from my headline and measure from the center of each speaker to that spot, as long as you do this carefully and accurately your done. You're trying to measure from the voice coil to the listening position, so be as accurate as you can, if you can get within a half an inch or so you won't need to do anything else.

Tracerite can be very good too, but in order for it to work you still need to take accurate measurement from the source of the sound wave to the listening position.

P.S. make sure to set all speaker to the same polarity (phase) first.

Thanks for the help. I like the idea of hanging a static object - never even thought of that. but that makes perfect sense. :)

Hillbilly SQ 08-13-2019 05:09 PM

Re: Mid bass help
 
You should still compensate for crossover points with time alignment. It really does make a difference. This is where Tracerite comes in handy.

gijoe 08-13-2019 06:56 PM

Re: Mid bass help
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Hillbilly SQ (Post 5735771)
You should still compensate for crossover points with time alignment. It really does make a difference. This is where Tracerite comes in handy.

This is why I would use 24dB slopes on both ends.

SkizeR 08-13-2019 07:02 PM

Re: Mid bass help
 
if swapping equipment is the last resort, im willing to bet a pair of Audio Devlopment SW800's will take care of any midbass needs and then some

therapture 08-14-2019 02:41 PM

Re: Mid bass help
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by gijoe (Post 5735745)
I'd would definitely try cutting the rear midbass out of the equation first, or at least spend some time with the DSP to ensure that they are perfectly in phase with the front midbass. The TA needs to be done properly, if the midbass are out of phase you're going to have cancellation.

Also, sub phase like Hillbilly just pointed out.

THIS. Get your fronts rocking the midbass. Any decent 6.5" should be able to provide decent midbass if everything else is right.

Once you have front midbass/subs kicking it, then you can see if the rears can be added in sucessfully.


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