Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help - Page 23 - Car Audio | DiyMobileAudio.com | Car Stereo Forum

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Old 07-17-2019   #551
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

I take it that phas is not able to be plotted(?)...
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Old 07-17-2019   #552
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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Originally Posted by Holmz View Post
I take it that phas is not able to be plotted(?)...


Not with Dirac. But I can measure with Smaart afterward and get a phase plot.


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Old 07-17-2019   #553
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Truthunter View Post
Ian, can you check the Dirac tab in the plugin and tell us what Gain is listed on the Sub channel?
I'll double check it later today, but IIRC it was at -11dB on mine.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ErinH View Post
With as many variables as there are itís just too hard to know for sure whatís going on. Might help to just start from the top... sorry if youíve addressed this all before.

When you ran it, was the subwoofer designated as a subwoofer via the checkbox in the DL GUI input/output window (where you set your mic and output levels)? Or did you leave that unchecked? On the minidsp Dirac input menu do you have bass management activated (are the channelsí crossovers set to bypass or are you implementing a filter there)? Same questions for Ian.
Subwoofer checked in the output window, bass management activated but no crossovers there instead I have that set on the output tab. I am planning to try a couple of your suggestions later this afternoon, specifically numbers 2 and 4.

Quote:
Originally Posted by oliverlim View Post
1. Some positions just throw off clipping in the measurements. The manual and helpdesk just tell you to lower the sub channel in Dirac and remeasure just that position. So what does it do in that case? Do you move it back to the original position for the rest of the position?( I do this)
That's what I have done previously, annoying, but seems to be OK.

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Old 07-17-2019   #554
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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Originally Posted by Truthunter View Post
I did check the subwoofer box on Dirac3 (The sub channel) before testing levels and measuring.
Quote:
Originally Posted by naiku View Post
Subwoofer checked in the output window


Ok. I think the quoted is key here. In short, an LFE channel is typically expected from an AVR (for home theater purposes). From an AVR these channels are boosted 10dB.

Since you checked the Ďsubwooferí box in the DLCT menu, youíve designated that channel as an LFE channel and thus told DL that channel will be receiving a +10dB signal from an AVR or some other ĎLFEí channel. Now, you probably have gathered, after running some sweeps, that DL sweeps are fully internal; itís self-generated and there is no external source for their stimulus. Case in point, if you have your radio playing in your car while youíre setting up miniDSP and then switch over to DL GUI, DL takes over and ignores the input signal so it can run the sweeps and measure the response. Since DL receives no external stimulus and depends on the user to tell it what function it serves, the LFE channel sweep is boosted by 10dB in DL because thatís what it expects to receive from an AVR; so it just accounts for that when it runs the sweeps. Then - after DL has done itís thing and matched the response of the interally-generated sweeps to your target - when you play your stereo from the RCA outputs of your headunit (which doesnít apply a +10dB increase for the LFE purpose) the result is the subwoofer volume being too low. Which makes sense because the measured vs target curve match looks good (at least in Ryan's case). But when you exit DL and play music off a non-LFE channel like your headunitís subwoofer out, youíre not providing the miniDSP that extra 10dB DL was told it would have, and you have no more bass.

TLDR: Try unchecking the Ďsubwooferí box. DL expects a +10dB boost from an LFE channel but youíre not actually giving it that from your headunit.

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Old 07-17-2019   #555
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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Originally Posted by ErinH View Post
Try unchecking the Ďsubwooferí box. DL expects a +10dB boost from an LFE channel but youíre not actually giving it that from your headunit.
I'll make sure to give that a try later along with the other suggestions, started work not long after 5 this morning, so should be able to either grab a longer lunch break or sign off early and spend some time taking measurements.

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Old 07-17-2019   #556
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

Quote:
Originally Posted by ErinH View Post
Ok. I think the quoted is key here. In short, an LFE channel is typically expected from an AVR (for home theater purposes). From an AVR these channels are boosted 10dB.

Since you checked the Ďsubwooferí box in the DLCT menu, youíve designated that channel as an LFE channel and thus told DL that channel will be receiving a +10dB signal from an AVR or some other ĎLFEí channel. Now, you probably have gathered, after running some sweeps, that DL sweeps are fully internal; itís self-generated and there is no external source for their stimulus. Case in point, if you have your radio playing in your car while youíre setting up miniDSP and then switch over to DL GUI, DL takes over and ignores the input signal so it can run the sweeps and measure the response. Since DL receives no external stimulus and depends on the user to tell it what function it serves, the LFE channel sweep is boosted by 10dB in DL because thatís what it expects to receive from an AVR; so it just accounts for that when it runs the sweeps. Then - after DL has done itís thing and matched the response of the interally-generated sweeps to your target - when you play your stereo from the RCA outputs of your headunit (which doesnít apply a +10dB increase for the LFE purpose) the result is the subwoofer volume being too low. Which makes sense because the measured vs target curve match looks good (at least in Ryan's case). But when you exit DL and play music off a non-LFE channel like your headunitís subwoofer out, youíre not providing the miniDSP that extra 10dB DL was told it would have, and you have no more bass.

TLDR: Try unchecking the Ďsubwooferí box. DL expects a +10dB boost from an LFE channel but youíre not actually giving it that from your headunit.

Erin,

I'm a manual reader before attempting type of person. Page 25 shows an illustration of where the Dirac test signal are "injected" in the signal path. This is important to me because I previously used the HU sub level control to control sub level on the fly and would tune with it at 10 (out of 15) to give some room to turn it up. But realized that would not work with the DL upgrade because the test signal does not originate from the HU. So if the test signal does not contain this lower level for the sub then had to make sure my source did not either.

This LFE angle is a good theory but not sure if it's correct... it would have to be tested. First off the this current tune that I have going is not lacking in sub-bass at all... though my first attempted tune was.

I had considered the LFE issue as being the cause of low sub output. Actually was not familiar with LFE so I did some reading to familiarize myself (I'm not a HT enthusiest)... Low Frequency Effects signal boosted by 10db.


But reading through the user manual the only mention of LFE is here on page 40:

"For a 5.1 source that applies the ď10 dB LFE gain,Ē use 5.1 Speaker System"


So just from reading the user manual I figured LFE was not the issue as I was not choosing "5.1 Speaker System" in the Dirac app sound system tab... so therefore thinking the App was not treating the subwoofer channel as an LFE signal.

And there is no indication in the manual that corresponds LFE to the subwoofer checkbox on the Output & Levels tab. Page 42 of the manual describes the function of the subwoofer checkbox:

"The subwoofer checkbox tells the Dirac Live analysis algorithm to use a different method to detect the impulse on that channel, which in turn affects the delay that will be assigned to that channel. This is needed because of the limited frequency response of the subwoofer."


Again, just from reading the manual I don't think this is an LFE function issue - but I think it should be tested because manuals aren't always 100%.

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Old 07-17-2019   #557
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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Originally Posted by Truthunter View Post
Again, just from reading the manual I don't think this is an LFE function issue - but I think it should be tested because manuals aren't always 100%.
That's why I am happy to test later, I figure anything that will help us all to get a repeatable process to getting the best results, that I think we all know are possible, with Dirac makes sense to at least try.

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Old 07-17-2019   #558
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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Originally Posted by Truthunter View Post
Erin,

I'm a manual reader before attempting type of person. Page 25 shows an illustration of where the Dirac test signal are "injected" in the signal path. This is important to me because I previously used the HU sub level control to control sub level on the fly and would tune with it at 10 (out of 15) to give some room to turn it up. But realized that would not work with the DL upgrade because the test signal does not originate from the HU. So if the test signal does not contain this lower level for the sub then had to make sure my source did not either.

This LFE angle is a good theory but not sure if it's correct... it would have to be tested. First off the this current tune that I have going is not lacking in sub-bass at all... though my first attempted tune was.

I had considered the LFE issue as being the cause of low sub output. Actually was not familiar with LFE so I did some reading to familiarize myself (I'm not a HT enthusiest)... Low Frequency Effects signal boosted by 10db.


But reading through the user manual the only mention of LFE is here on page 40:

"For a 5.1 source that applies the ď10 dB LFE gain,Ē use 5.1 Speaker System"


So just from reading the user manual I figured LFE was not the issue as I was not choosing "5.1 Speaker System" in the Dirac app sound system tab... so therefore thinking the App was not treating the subwoofer channel as an LFE signal.

And there is no indication in the manual that corresponds LFE to the subwoofer checkbox on the Output & Levels tab. Page 42 of the manual describes the function of the subwoofer checkbox:

"The subwoofer checkbox tells the Dirac Live analysis algorithm to use a different method to detect the impulse on that channel, which in turn affects the delay that will be assigned to that channel. This is needed because of the limited frequency response of the subwoofer."


Again, just from reading the manual I don't think this is an LFE function issue - but I think it should be tested because manuals aren't always 100%.

The reason I think the subwoofer check box corresponds with the LFE channel is because when subwoofer is checked I definitely heard a different stimulus. Also, I don't see what the purpose of the subwoofer check box would be if not to account for this boost, again, since DL doesn't know the source signal will or won't be boosted without you telling it; and the last thing they'd want you to do is mess with the subwoofer level after the fact. I don't have anything solid to base this on, just some "if/then" assumptions that I gave. But, it's simple enough to find out by running the setup without the sub box checked. I don't care about being right or wrong. I care about getting the most out of this thing so I'm just trying to provide some options and logic as to why I'm suggesting what I am.


Also, Ian, I still recommend you reconsider the subwoofer target you've used. I can't help but think that DL is trying hard to get to that and just can't do it without boosting a whole lot of frequencies. And, no, you can't have my Mc amp!!!!!!

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Old 07-17-2019   #559
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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I'm a manual reader
You mean you don't have someone read to you?... You read things yourself?! You're living in the dark ages, man. You gotta get you a robot to do the reading for you. Or at least book on tape.




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Old 07-17-2019   #560
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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You mean you don't have someone read to you?... You read things yourself?! You're living in the dark ages, man. You gotta get you a robot to do the reading for you. Or at least book on tape.



Lol, I do live in the dark ages somewhat but I'm catching up... Just got my first smart phone this past winter

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Old 07-17-2019   #561
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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The reason I think the subwoofer check box corresponds with the LFE channel is because when subwoofer is checked I definitely heard a different stimulus. Also, I don't see what the purpose of the subwoofer check box would be if not to account for this boost, again, since DL doesn't know the source signal will or won't be boosted without you telling it; and the last thing they'd want you to do is mess with the subwoofer level after the fact. I don't have anything solid to base this on, just some "if/then" assumptions that I gave. But, it's simple enough to find out by running the setup without the sub box checked. I don't care about being right or wrong. I care about getting the most out of this thing so I'm just trying to provide some options and logic as to why I'm suggesting what I am.


Also, Ian, I still recommend you reconsider the subwoofer target you've used. I can't help but think that DL is trying hard to get to that and just can't do it without boosting a whole lot of frequencies. And, no, you can't have my Mc amp!!!!!!
I believe the main reason for the subwoofer option in the dlct app is for the subwoofer volume control. In subwoofer vol mode, the vol knob controls the boost Or cuts for those channels marked as subwoofer in the dlct app.
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Old 07-17-2019   #562
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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I believe the main reason for the subwoofer option in the dlct app is for the subwoofer volume control. In subwoofer vol mode, the vol knob controls the boost Or cuts for those channels marked as subwoofer in the dlct app.
Well, there you go.

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Old 07-17-2019   #563
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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I believe the main reason for the subwoofer option in the dlct app is for the subwoofer volume control. In subwoofer vol mode, the vol knob controls the boost Or cuts for those channels marked as subwoofer in the dlct app.
Could be but why wouldn't the manual state that?

The manual only states that "the subwoofer checkbox tells the Dirac Live analysis algorithm to use a different method to detect the impulse on that channel... because of the limited frequency response of the subwoofer" which makes sense.

Pretty sure the remote sub level control, which has to be assigned as outlined in section 7.3 on page 55 of the manual, only affects the output levels, as it does in the Non-DL version, outside of the Dirac function.... Which is why I think they include the note in section 5.3.3 - "Check that the subwoofer volume is set to zero. (Remember that this volume is relative to the master volume. Zero is typically the best setting to use for calibration.)"

But then again, manuals aren't always %100 correct or complete so

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Old 07-17-2019   #564
 
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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I really like the idea of only a 2 CH Dirac tune... Mostly since I only have a ddrc24, LOL....
So I would like some advise on the best way to set this up. I have a 3-way front, plus Sub. I think I need to simply have ALL left plus the L ch of the Sub on Dirac 1 and similar for the Right side. Then tune as discussed through this post, including some finer details in the below quotes...

I will have basic TA and XO done of course first.... Those 2 ddrc24 outputs will go to my Helix P6, but all EQ on the Helix will be bypassed. I will have the Sub XO and levels set on the P6 SUB outputs but simply passing through to the SUB AMP, right?

Oh, and would it make any difference if the pre-tune is set in the Helix OR DDRC24?


Honestly , Dirac does itís thing the way it wants to,

Some say a pretune is the way, I find it over corrected, and after reading the diracdoc I can see why I find it over corrected as itís meant to ignore certain things

Itís mire about retraining your ears to accept the new ways of listening
And itís better! I went back to the old ways several times and was so disappointed once I gave it a chance and let it do it.


I do however strongly believe in a post Dirac tune for taste and for better crossover interaction, the Dirac doesnít know how good or bad the crossovers will interact after its correction and sometimes a little delay needs to be added to a speaker after to get things staging and sounding good again. And just for personal taste


A ddrc with a helix is solid way to go. Although I hate the helix file structure, itís still a very good dsp. The C would do as good or better


But Dirac does what it wants? Sometimes the after just needs a little love.
But even a little tweaking after Dirac is still miles better than what you do with just peq


If you havenít bought that yes I would get the C

If you have the helix get the ddrc it will work fine


Edit:

I would still keep your helix functioning for crossovers and some tuning bound that as well. A ddrc upstream would be fantastic (Iíve done it actually)

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Old 07-17-2019   #565
 
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

I just tried 8ch Dirac
But linked all channels to single eq (so it behaves like 2ch Dirac but it does delays


I tryed it before with very screwed up results,

This time itís good, it sounds correct

I donít know if anyone else wants to try it also,
I think last time I was boosting somewhere ,

It shouldnít work but it is actually pretty good.


Iíll measure the phase tonight in rew and see what itís doing.


Minidsp has never said anything about doing it this way, Iím still a little confused why this time itís working very decent, and last time it was a mess

:-/


Maybe last time I had gaps in crossover region and wanted to add boosts after crossover s or my target wasnít low enough

Idk but it seems to sound a awful lot like 2ch Dirac now, your guess is as good as mine ....



I know Iíve said this is bad way,
Iím just screwing around , and ended up working now.

Iím only posting this if anyone else wants to try it

If you have some 8ch measurements, linked all to one target and load a curve
Iím just curious if anyone elseís sounds good doing this

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Old 07-17-2019   #566
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

OK, just got done with some measurements.... tried with the subwoofer not checked on the output tab, seemed to make no real noticeable difference (either visually or auditory), certainly not a 10dB difference if it were thinking it was an LFE channel or not.

So, went back and took new measurements with it set as a subwoofer. I had tweaked the LPF from 24db to an 18db slope. I also modified the target to more closely resemble the measured response from the sub:



Overall Dirac response:


Measured REW (1/3 smoothing, pink noise, sweeps around the head):


Looking at the REW response, I think the output of the mids could be lowered. They play 800 - 4200Hz, which seems to coincide right with that bump. That could also explain some of the harshness at higher volumes.

But.... overall it is sounding a WHOLE lot better. The subwoofer is still lacking some for me, although it does match between REW and Dirac (about a 13-14dB swing from one end to the other). I think the next time I will try to raise the subwoofer in the output tab by 2-3dB, lower the mids 4-5dB and re-measure. Might find time to do that later today, especially now I know what level on the output tab seems to work for all positions.

My only real complaint currently........ Overall volume. Again, I am not sure if this is a behaviour difference between tablet and head unit. It just seems odd to me that for it to be loud (hitting 100dB playing music) that I have to have it at 75% volume. That could absolutely just be me though, especially as it is plenty loud enough, just odd to have to turn it up so much for it to be loud.

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Old 07-17-2019   #567
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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Originally Posted by subterFUSE View Post
Not with Dirac. But I can measure with Smaart afterward and get a phase plot.
I think that looking at the phase for the sub, and the mid bass separately... will show if anything 'untoward' is happening in the cross over region.
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Old 07-17-2019   #568
 
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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I think that looking at the phase for the sub, and the mid bass separately... will show if anything 'untoward' is happening in the cross over region.
Totally agree,

And if he can do overlays with smaart man that could help us,

Iíve only been able to compare single measurements of individual speakers and a measurement of two (or more) speakers in REW with the same mic location and same windowing methods etc.

Itís clear to me itís not trying so much to ďlinearizeĒ or make phase flat, as much as itís trying to make the phase the same for bolth left and right , the entire transfer function. Iíve seen the phase still have some GD properties and some wraps from XOs , but left and Right were so so much alike vs with Dirac off.


With smaart he should really be able to see whatís going on every step of the way,


John please do! Iíll put my learning hat on and let you take it away.

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Old 07-17-2019   #569
 
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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My only real complaint currently........ Overall volume. Again, I am not sure if this is a behaviour difference between tablet and head unit. It just seems odd to me that for it to be loud (hitting 100dB playing music) that I have to have it at 75% volume. That could absolutely just be me though, especially as it is plenty loud enough, just odd to have to turn it up so much for it to be loud.


I think thatís pretty normal with a lot of eq cuts, but unfortunately itís necessary to make big cuts or itís just worse. You should still have enough overall volume tho


As far as the harshness, can you isolate what frequencies it sounds harsh at?

Do you think maybe (just maybe) itís one of the speakers disagreeing with the correction,

I have extremely efficient speakers that are so capable of any kind of eq you throw at them and this sometimes can put them right up to the end of what they want to do. Meaning,

If the speaker naturally wants to play a certain way and your asking it to do something opposite of how it wants to behave it could make it harsh kinda quickly or prematurely. Follow what Iím saying...

If you can isolate the frequencies thatís making it harsh , you could try a different crossover or maybe some eq to tame it and let another speaker play the part itís breaking up (if thatís even possible?)

Just some ideas .......

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Old 07-17-2019   #570
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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Originally Posted by oabeieo View Post
As far as the harshness, can you isolate what frequencies it sounds harsh at?
Not sure exactly which frequencies yet, it's towards the higher end of female vocals. Need to give it a longer listen to be sure though.

Anyway, so I knocked down the mids by 4dB and increased the subwoofer by 3dB, then re-measured. I think I am experiencing the same thing that Ryan did with his measurements and the sub...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Truthunter
I tried upping the level of the sub to try and meet up with the target but no matter what I did the measured response stayed the same even though I could hear the sweeps were louder which baffled me.
The sweep sounded louder, visually they looked larger on the DLCT measuring screen, I also just compared the sub response on the filter design tab and it is exactly the same, despite me turning it up. Weird.

Anyway, took new measurements, loaded my target and now making some real good progress with this. Latest REW (1/6 smoothing) response looks like this:


I'm thinking if I can cure that dip around 55Hz that I may well be completely happy with this particular tune.

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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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Originally Posted by oabeieo View Post
Itís clear to me itís not trying so much to ďlinearizeĒ or make phase flat, as much as itís trying to make the phase the same for bolth left and right , the entire transfer function. Iíve seen the phase still have some GD properties and some wraps from XOs , but left and Right were so so much alike vs with Dirac off.
Are you in on the beta 2.0? I understand that one of the main upgrades on 2.0 DL is a better phase correctiOn between pairs of speakers.

ďIn addition to the usability upgrades, the new Dirac Live also includes an enhanced phase correction algorithm for improved stereo reproduction. Where the previous version of Dirac Live individually measured the phase of each stereo speaker, this new version also analyzes speakers in pairs, which ensures that the pair's phase responses are matched to each other.Ē

I am still hoping they release it soon. So that I can stop tinkering so much in my car. Wife is going to wonder soon why I am always sneaking to my car with my laptop in tow.....
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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The sweep sounded louder, visually they looked larger on the DLCT measuring screen, I also just compared the sub response on the filter design tab and it is exactly the same, despite me turning it up. Weird.
Right... I did it over three times turning the sub up 4db at a time and saw no difference on the filter design screen. Bloody Wonky

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Old 07-17-2019   #573
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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Are you in on the beta 2.0? I understand that one of the main upgrades on 2.0 DL is a better phase correctiOn between pairs of speakers.

ďIn addition to the usability upgrades, the new Dirac Live also includes an enhanced phase correction algorithm for improved stereo reproduction. Where the previous version of Dirac Live individually measured the phase of each stereo speaker, this new version also analyzes speakers in pairs, which ensures that the pair's phase responses are matched to each other.Ē

I am still hoping they release it soon. So that I can stop tinkering so much in my car. Wife is going to wonder soon why I am always sneaking to my car with my laptop in tow.....
IDK, it seems to do a decent job of that already. I mean, on a standard DSP, if I were to set delays by distance, then eq L/R to the same target and then measure the combined response with mono pink noise - the response would be all over the place because of phase differences between the two sides. There is a popular tuning guide that instructs it be done that way but it never produced good results for me. Dirac seems to take care of those differences as the combined overall measured response basically follows the targets set for each side.

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Old 07-17-2019   #574
 
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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Not sure exactly which frequencies yet, it's towards the higher end of female vocals. Need to give it a longer listen to be sure though.

.

So somewhere in the tweeter to mid crossover, uugh yeah thatís tough to get right no doubt.


I would try starting with the tweeter channels in PEQ link them together, than set a peq to a Q of 1.7 , turn it down to -6db , than listen and move the frequency slider up/down and try to see if the mode goes away, than do the same thing to the mid and try the same thing. Try to isolate that frequency,
Moving the frequency slider trying and listening to find that spot! And which driver itís on

When you find the exact spot turn it back up to 0 and now you know where the problem is , , now try different crossovers , steeper slopes or move it up or down and try to get the other speaker to cover that band more (if you can)

If you canít , you might try steeper or shallower slopes to take the load off and let adjacent speaker do more there...


If all else fails , try using your target and creating a notch in that band and that should (hopefully lessen its effects) the latter will only put a small dip in response, I would start with -2db and work that area

Quote:
Originally Posted by oliverlim View Post
Are you in on the beta 2.0? I understand that one of the main upgrades on 2.0 DL is a better phase correctiOn between pairs of speakers.

ďIn addition to the usability upgrades, the new Dirac Live also includes an enhanced phase correction algorithm for improved stereo reproduction. Where the previous version of Dirac Live individually measured the phase of each stereo speaker, this new version also analyzes speakers in pairs, which ensures that the pair's phase responses are matched to each other.Ē

I am still hoping they release it soon. So that I can stop tinkering so much in my car. Wife is going to wonder soon why I am always sneaking to my car with my laptop in tow.....


Yes beta .... I was able to load filters into my ddrc22d as I got a set of measurements made in the C , literally the next day they ended the beta so I got super lucky to have clean measurements and working filters that work with my C .....

The beta had ended so I canít take any new measurements until the release




So, to clarify , the current version makes both sides have as close as possible the same impulse (within its parameters) and does nothing about how the stereo pair interact.

In 2.0 (which is hot diggity dog for us) it looks at combfiltering between the stereo pair caused by one side being farther and having to use signal delays (which cause a whole new set of comb-filters) so it addresses some of that.

It doesn't do anything about comb-filtering caused by multiple reflections and compound reflections (copies of copies of sound arriving late) because that is just not possible.

Yeah the ddrc should be first to release, Iím anxiously waiting!

Itís only a slight improvement over what we have now. But still an improvement,
And the auto target is very intuitive, the auto target is actually really bad ass, where the auto target on ours now is the same for everything and everyoneís systems, and has nothing to do with the target and how it sounds on your specific measurements. In 2.0 the auto target is the cats meow

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Old 07-17-2019   #575
 
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Default Re: Minidsp CDSP-DL 8x12 Dirac live upgrade or new release help

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Originally Posted by Truthunter View Post
Right... I did it over three times turning the sub up 4db at a time and saw no difference on the filter design screen. Bloody Wonky


I donít think giving sub more gain and than measurements is going to change anything, it will just add or subtract gain to match the target, (unless Iím not understanding you right)


I do my sub measurements with my sub bass knob very very low (1/8th way up)

That way I have the added gain at the end,



I know you guys want to stick to a target and not deviate, but honestly,
Heat changes the sub output, and different recordings have different bass.


I know what you meant in previous posts to have good bass and not have to crank it up , I do know what you mean. I agree with that also, and I too like sq bass , Iím not a bass head , I just like to hear it right compared to the rest of the music. but in my experience, and tell me what you think about this .


Like , Iíll measure with Dirac, set my targets , Iíll be super happy , the next day on way to work when itís about 50deg hotter in my car, the bass just seems whimsy compared to last night, almost as if something changed.

The sub is almost purely minimum phase behavior, so turning it up with a bass knob to restore just enough so itís sounds right again dosent make any ill effects on the sub. It just restores the bass for the conditions.

Iíve had excellent luck doing that. , itís super easy to hear when the blend is right, I know you can hear it come together within a dB or two, itís super obvious when the level is back, the ambiance comes back, the midbass is enhanced almost when the Harmonics between sub and midbass are just right and play together.


I still think maybe this is all that is needed. I had the same issues and this solved it for me , and gave me control over every different recording type and current road noise conditions.

Am I off base?

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