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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey guys,

I'm thinking about upgrading my system from one 12W6V2 to 2 DIYMA 12's or RE SE 10's. I'm currently running a 500.1 but want to jump up to 1000 RMS when I make the move. I would also like to keep my electrical system factory.

Will using an amp loaded to run at 2ohm matter vs running at 1ohm?? Will it matter to my electrical system? My lights already start to dim very slightly when I crank the 500.1. Any help would be great.

Oh, and I'm highly considering the AudioQue 1200 for the job.
 

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OK, think for a second about just how close to a dead short one ohm is. Just say NO to one ohm sub loads!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks Benny but I'm pretty much a noob when it comes to this particular subject. Why would running at 1 be so different than 2??
 

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I believe the quality of the amp you choose is important for longevity of 1-ohm use. I run my subs at 1-ohm for bass under 50Hz and I also use a slight -3db adjustment @45Hz and have my sub amp set to barely clip "if" my sub volume knob is at "max" and my HU volume is at the clipping point. Only about 20-30% of my music has substantial enough information under 35Hz to warrant any concern about my sub amp.

My sub amp doesn't get hot, it only produces major output moments intermittently. My 1-ohm use is the exception, not the rule. Most people play bass, bass, bass. I admit there is a day here or there each week where I push the sub but the amp hasn't gotten really hot yet.
 

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I just want to throw something out there regarding longevity. Many amplifiers claim to be 1 ohm stable whereas some are actually designed to run @ 1 ohm daily. Regardless, with 1 ohm being close to a theoretical short, I will try to put things into perspective.

One of my vehicles can do 0 to 60 in 5 seconds flat. If I did that every single time I took off, how long would it be before something broke? Keep in mind, this is a Ford. Better yet, look at how many thousands of dollars are spent to keep track only 1/4 mile racers going.

The point I am trying to get at is just because the amp is "capable" of running at 1 ohm doesn't mean it is always a good idea. If you insist on running at 1 ohm, my suggestion would be to purchase a quality amplifier with a decent warranty AND make sure you have the electrical system to provide adequate current for the power you are producing.
 

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also everyone is forgetting that besides being bad for your amp no matter what, running at 1 ohm simply sounds like **** compared to 4 ohms

and if you can't hear the difference, maybe you shouldn't be into "SQ" car audio, caraudio.com is waiting for you *hint* tspence *hint*

but if you are like tspence, and either too inept or too much of a giant ***** to try out 4 ohms DESPITE the non-existent purely theoretical power loss (and the FACT that the amp does not double its power directly related to ohm load), then maybe you deserve lower quality bass anyway
 

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also everyone is forgetting that besides being bad for your amp no matter what, running at 1 ohm simply sounds like **** compared to 4 ohms

and if you can't hear the difference, maybe you shouldn't be into "SQ" car audio, caraudio.com is waiting for you *hint* tspence *hint*

but if you are like tspence, and either too inept or too much of a giant ***** to try out 4 ohms DESPITE the non-existent purely theoretical power loss (and the FACT that the amp does not double its power directly related to ohm load), then maybe you deserve lower quality bass anyway
Can I sig all that?
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thanks guys. A lot of great info here. Think I'm just going to stick with 2ohm or higher. Should do the trick anyways.

My main question is will my factory electrical system be ok off of 1000 at 2ohms or higher??
 

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also everyone is forgetting that besides being bad for your amp no matter what, running at 1 ohm simply sounds like **** compared to 4 ohms

and if you can't hear the difference, maybe you shouldn't be into "SQ" car audio, caraudio.com is waiting for you *hint* tspence *hint*

but if you are like tspence, and either too inept or too much of a giant ***** to try out 4 ohms DESPITE the non-existent purely theoretical power loss (and the FACT that the amp does not double its power directly related to ohm load), then maybe you deserve lower quality bass anyway
Tspence is an idiot, but i will never believe that you will hear the difference in the sub channel despite the ohm load.
 

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"The human ear, as it is connected to the human brain, is not very smart and easily fooled. If something is wrong with a speaker, people have a hard time telling what it is. Those who don't measure, don't know. Period."

What about your signature? Talk about over-analysis. The whole point of this endeavor is to "fool" the human ear. If the human ear is so easily fooled, then mission accomplished. I don't think it needs to be over-complicated at some point to achieve fidelity on playback.

I go on what I hear and in my estimation, the ear is not really easily fooled. I've never heard a recording, not one that made me believe I was hearing 'real' sounds. I've heard a few that come real close but not total realism. The problem hasn't been the playback, the problems I've heard have been with the recordings themselves. IMO, the complications come with the recordings and production, not so much the playback equipment.

The reason is playback equipment can be adjusted, calibrated and controlled. Microphones and recordings often aren't engineered to sound like the ear really receives sound and hence, you get a 'phony' sounding facsimile.

I think you should setup your system on what sounds best to 'you'.
 

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Thanks guys. A lot of great info here. Think I'm just going to stick with 2ohm or higher. Should do the trick anyways.

My main question is will my factory electrical system be ok off of 1000 at 2ohms or higher??
You probably will want to upgrade "the big 3": 1) alternator positive to battery positive, 2) battery negative to chassis, and 3) engine ground to chassis. Use wire at least as heavy as the wire running to your amps.
 

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tell that to chad
And I too shall co-sign this.

Honestly, there is no need for 1ohm loads. 1 ohm loads became popular in the early 90's with SPL comps and amps that produced major power at 1 ohm loads. Keep in mind, sound quality was not a concern at SPL comps.

Instead of so many of the newbs thinking power is the answer to all ills concerning subwoofer and output, I would challenge you all to start learning to look at the numbers(T/S P) modeling subs, and looking at enclosure types for given results. It's a lot cheaper, less stress on your electrical system, with the added output some of you all are looking for.

The craze of small box subs and big output has it drawbacks, but it's all marketing. The number one drawback is efficiency, meaning you need more juice to run such set ups. More juice means more money=more stress on your electrical system.
Study up on Hoffmans Law.

Before you run out and drop more $$$ for another high dollar sub and more $$$ for a larger amp, why don't you try modeling that JL 12W6v2 ported first. Wood or MDF is cheap!!!!!!!

FYI- JL 500/1 puts out a little more than 700 rms.
 

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You are the perfect example of my sig. You just said you have never heard playback that sounds real and that is much more likely due to flaws in the reproduction system than the recording, and since you know next to nothing about speaker technologies and electrical systems or amps, then you have no idea what you don't like about it and settle for less than is optimal. You have also obviously never heard a reference or top studio class reproduction system if you think the recordings are the weak link. That or you only listen to ****ty, horribly recorded music. You also don't know how to attribute things you don't like to their actual causes due to your complete lack of both knowledge and understanding, and try to fix problems with solutions that don't fit.

You also like to quote random dB figures and frequencies in your system yet have never taken an RTA to your car to see what it is actually doing and what peaks are present due to reflections, resonances, etc.

If running your amp at 1 ohm and reducing the damping factor and increasing distortion in your system 'sounds best to you' for a nearly non-existent mostly theoretical power increase to your woofers, then you clearly aren't qualified to make vast judgments about product selection and performance or doll out advice to serious SQ enthusiasts.

Good job at misreading yet another piece of useful advice (my sig, which is actually a quote from Zaphaudio who many here use as a guide for speaker selection). You seem to have a great talent for that.

Why don't you aim your scat-filled word cannon at this piece of writing and proceed to not understand it:
http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/diyma-tutorials/31-real-deal-8-ohm-drivers.html

Notice he said 8 ohm speakers actually have an advantage over 4 ohm, but this is impossible for you to comprehend because:
1. you run 4 ohm speakers and in your twisted mind anything you run is never bad
2. you think wattage figures are the only important figure of any type of audio system
3. this article was written just for you, as you actually chose not to get 8 ohm speakers for the exact reasons disproven in this article


And for ****'s sake keep this in mind before you start spouting off this **** about how everyone here is against you and hopelessly wonder why all your posts get flamed
PEOPLE WHO POST ACCURATE/GOOD ADVICE/INFORMATION NEVER GET FLAMED. DO THE MATH.

"The human ear, as it is connected to the human brain, is not very smart and easily fooled. If something is wrong with a speaker, people have a hard time telling what it is. Those who don't measure, don't know. Period."

What about your signature? Talk about over-analysis. The whole point of this endeavor is to "fool" the human ear. If the human ear is so easily fooled, then mission accomplished. I don't think it needs to be over-complicated at some point to achieve fidelity on playback.

I go on what I hear and in my estimation, the ear is not really easily fooled. I've never heard a recording, not one that made me believe I was hearing 'real' sounds. I've heard a few that come real close but not total realism. The problem hasn't been the playback, the problems I've heard have been with the recordings themselves. IMO, the complications come with the recordings and production, not so much the playback equipment.

The reason is playback equipment can be adjusted, calibrated and controlled. Microphones and recordings often aren't engineered to sound like the ear really receives sound and hence, you get a 'phony' sounding facsimile.

I think you should setup your system on what sounds best to 'you'.
 

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Honestly, there is no need for 1ohm loads. 1 ohm loads became popular in the early 90's with SPL comps and amps that produced major power at 1 ohm loads. Keep in mind, sound quality was not a concern at SPL comps.
a-****ing-men
 

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I have not read all this above but I can say this:
- same power, lower ohm load = more current, lower voltage
- same power, higher ohm load = higher voltage, lower current
- copper (voice-coils, cables...) have a (low) resistance, making them warming up when current is running trough them, more current = more heat, wich is a bad thing
- voltage drives the driver, current depends on the ohm load and the voltage, is has a reason why the official way the spec sensitivity of a driver is in dB/2.83V/m, not in dB/x.xxA/m
- Here in Europe, where we can't sue anybody for anything (so also not the energy supplier for delivering a 'dangerous voltage'), we have 220-240V in our homes to keep the current and automatically also the voltage losses low.

Higher voltage > higher current
--> go high impedance!

I never heard a sq system with it's subs running at 1 ohms, I did hear systems with their subs running at 2 ohms, 4 ohms and 8 ohms, I can't say there was a huge difference in sound, but I can say a 4 or even 8 ohm sub-system can be just as loud as a 2 ohm system and in theory, higher impedance should mean more control -> better sound quality.

There is absolutely no reason to go low impedance in an SQ system, even if you are a bass head. Keep the low impedances for people who need dozens of kilowatts for a couple seconds to reach spl levels noone can listen at without permanent hearing damage, not for SQ(L).

greets,
Isabelle
 
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