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Discussion Starter #1
Hi All,

I have begun getting together components to install on my 04 GTO. So far I have purchased Focal components, 165 KR2 for the front and 165 CVX for the rear. Any suggestions on 4chan or 5chan amps and sub to complement this setup? I have read a ton of threads and am a bit confused at this point, but have some interest in the following brands - ARC Audio amps (KS 300.4 - ARC Audio 4 Chan), Alpine PDX 5, JL 500/5 or HD600/4, Fi SSD10 sub, Boston Acoustics G312-44....
I'm looking for more quality sound than slam....all suggestions would be appreciated.

THANKS!!!
-
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thanks mimibox!! I'll look into that also.
BTW...I forgot to mention that my head unit is the PIO AVIC-F90BT.
 

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The amps have the least to do with sound quality compared with any other item dollar for dollar...so get what you find good to you and you'll probably be happy.

ARC, Zapco, PG, JL, Audison, etc. all provide lots of clean reliable power, and some of these amps are very efficient so they'll draw your system down less than others. Some people claim they can hear the difference in a class G or ICEpower amp (like the Alpine) but I can't. Can you? I can't say that for you but if you hate it you can always try something else and recoup most of your cash here.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
The amps have the least to do with sound quality compared with any other item dollar for dollar...so get what you find good to you and you'll probably be happy.

ARC, Zapco, PG, JL, Audison, etc. all provide lots of clean reliable power, and some of these amps are very efficient so they'll draw your system down less than others. Some people claim they can hear the difference in a class G or ICEpower amp (like the Alpine) but I can't. Can you? I can't say that for you but if you hate it you can always try something else and recoup most of your cash here.
Good thinking. I'll keep that in mind, because I want to get this installed soon.
 

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Yeah, I've gone the route of high dollar amps (PPI Art series back when they were new) and I've used fairly cheap JBL amps. I can tell no difference. The JBL's sounded just like any other good amp except I paid way less for them.

I'm even running a pretty cheap Sony amp (XM-4S) and have no issues with the sound quality, although I admit I bought it simply because it was the only 4 channel amp that would fit under the seat of my Jeep Wrangler.

I have PDX amps that will go in my Magnum when ever I finally get the motivation to start the install. Again, I choose those mainly on size, otherwise I would have used cheaper amps.
 

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I disagree with the argument that amps aren't important.....it blows me away that some people claim to be unable to hear the difference!

If you like a thin sound, weak on midrange/midbass then fine it doesn't matter...a # of the modern amps are like that. They put up great #s (measured wattage rating), and can get pretty loud, but lack a powerful, effortless sound....and a sound that's "more in the cabin". If you truly, 100% are a lover of midrange there is no substitute for getting the right amp.

I had a JL 300/4 & an Alpine MRV T-320 bi-amped to run a Morel front stage, then switched to a Phoenix Gold MS1000, and the difference was night & day. The only downside of these amps is that they draw a lot more current, but don't worry, your GTO's alternator can handle it. I have one myself, so I know. :)

If the above doesn't convince you, keep in mind that you will spend MORE for a newer Alpine or JL amp than an older PPI, Phoenix Gold, A/D/S/, etc.
 

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I still stand by my belief that amps are the least important part of the system, not counting speaker wire and cable.

Speakers, speaker mounting, placement and system tuning are all a lot more important to the overall sound quality of the system than a particular amplifier.

To suggest that anyone that doesn't share your view on amplifiers, likes thin sound and weak midrange and midbass is ridiculous...but in case you are correct, you could save all of us the trouble and money of buying numerous amps until we find that magic one by providing us a list of which amps are acceptable to use, and which ones aren't?
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Thanks fg79....I realize that there are so many good amp out there it's making the decision harder to make. Was hoping to get feedback from someone with a similar setup and get suggestions for pushing the Focals, but I will keep researching.
What do you have in your Goat now?
 

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Thanks fg79....I realize that there are so many good amp out there it's making the decision harder to make. Was hoping to get feedback from someone with a similar setup and get suggestions for pushing the Focals, but I will keep researching.
What do you have in your Goat now?
Morel Elate 6.5" 3 way up front, 4" Integra coax for center channel. 6.5" coax rear fill.

KEF 10" subs in rear quarter panels.

Phoenix Gold MS1000 for front stage & subs. Alpine PDX was running the rear fill and center, but that amp has been damaged for a few weeks so looking to replace. Not sure what I'm looking to replace it with at this point.

As for the amp list that 89grand asked for, it's more or less categorizing an amp as very modern or old school. In many cases this is true.....new Zapco, new Macintosh are decent amps but cost more. New Alpine (except for F#1), new JL for what you pay for are not good enough IMO. $600, $700 is a decent chunk of change....you get watts, fancy crossovers, eq, bass boost, small frame size, light weight, etc. Old school amp gives you about the opposite of all that, but gives you a better sound.

My favorites have been the Phoenix Gold MS series...MS275 is a nice strong 2 channel that doesn't take up a ton of room, simple elegant and strong.

Here's some more that are old school and inexpensive:

Soundstream MC140
Phoenix Gold M44
Precision Power 4050AM
a/d/s PQ10
a/d/s PH15
Carver M4060

I feel strongly about this, and don't want to push my views on the subject ....but when I see comments like "amps are the least important part of an SQ system"......it's almost impossible to stay quiet. If you were to have made it a #2 or #3 item I could have let it slide.

:D

ps - TNT, whatever you do, don't do custom door pods up front....I did and I've sacrificed some midbass punch in the process. They look great, but come with a price.

Pics:

GTO System Install :: Fotopic.Net
 

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It is quite simple, and try not to get it any more complicated than this:

The amplifier's job is to amplify whatever it takes in. The distortion produced beyond this is known as THD, total harmonic distortion. As you know, most amps produce an inaudible amount of distortion (below 1%) up to their clipping point, which is when an amp is asked to produce more power to the speaker than it can make for any given reason. Clipping cuts the wave into more of a squarewave, lopping off the top and bottom of the crests of the wave. ASSUMING an amp is not into clipping, it should sound exactly the same as another providing it is not introducing distortion to the signal. PERIOD. If you hear something different, then there is a setting that is different and all bets are off. LOUDER is perceived by the human ear as better, but it is not better...it is louder and louder alone. If you are claiming that you hear better sounds from your amp, and the distortion specs are the same, AND you are not driving into clipping, you should not hear a difference. If you do, someone was lying in their specs.

Why is this not common knowledge?!
 

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I think his point was more like "all the extra crap in newer amps alters the sound." I doubt it affect distortion plots but I'd be willing to bet the freq. response is different. That's the audible difference.
 

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If the response is different, isn't that total harmonic distortion incarnate?

Thus, isn't it NOT the original signal?

This is why I feel that an amp running flat with the proper gain is undetectable to another amp in the same situation... we're talking the same response graph unless there is THD involved, which by definition THD is any distortion from the original signal, correct?
 

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Is say, a 1dB boost at any freq. distortion? It's not accurate but I wouldn't call it distortion.

If we use your definition you might as well not change speakers because they are more "distorted" than anything else in the car.

Yes, running 2 amps that have been eq'd to the same response will sound the same, but by definition that also means they sounded different to begin with or there wouldn't be any eq needed to make them sound the same. Hence, all amps level-matched, but un-eq'd do NOT sound the same.

I will concede it's a MINOR difference, but it IS audible. Once you start eq'ing though it's a non-issue.
 

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If the response is different, isn't that total harmonic distortion incarnate?

Thus, isn't it NOT the original signal?

This is why I feel that an amp running flat with the proper gain is undetectable to another amp in the same situation... we're talking the same response graph unless there is THD involved, which by definition THD is any distortion from the original signal, correct?
Then humor me this. Why don't you sell your PG amps, buy Jensen or Sony Xplodes instead, and put a big wad of cash in your pocket at the same time? ;)
 

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^^^One reason I don't like classD amps. I don't think they sound worth a crap on subs and they're even worse on mids and tweeters. Having said that, I am also open to listening to new class D designs like the new JL HDs in hopes that one day we can have a great sounding class D.
 
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