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jason , i think you picked the best option for the results you were after . the question is could you get a steathy pillar build that looks better . Yes for sure but will it sound better ? prob not
i like em as they are .
 
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I agree... for what you were wanting to achieve with the Pillars (most useable freq response) you made the right choice. Mark did an excellent job with the install per usual!

It changes with the trends... for years, pillars were the best, then tweeter mounted above the mid, now people say surface mounted as close to the windshield is best.... trends change, pillars will be back to “popular” soon enough.

They don’t look like tumors to me. If people don’t like the way yours look, they definitely won’t like mine! Hahaha.

All that matters is if you are happy with the install, and you are! BOOM.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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While an explanation can be helpful, please don't feel it was required. It's your car, you can do whatever you want with it.
I know what you're after and if this gets you there. Awesome. If not, try something else.
This isn't easy by any means and as we've discussed many times, there is always a compromise somewhere with some thing.

None of your installs have ever sounded bad by any stretch. In fact, as u well know, one version of the BRZ made me go home and retune my own car.
I haven't spent much time in the new car and the few times I have it's just been comparing presets.

But again. Please don't ever feel like you have to justify anything u do to your own car.
 

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Where's the "dislike" button?
Dude...I've known Jason for around a decade. We've spent lots of time together helping each other tune and improving each other's vehicles.
We've discussed this already, he knows I was joking w him as I typically do with everyone I know.
 
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Where's the "dislike" button?
Jaw Gesture News Television program Font


Intentions are now clear.

You know J, if you're trying to live up to the BRZ you may always end up disappointed.

Not that you can't get a tune as good, it's just hard to straighten memories skewed by nostalgia.

The version of the BRZ I heard is still my all time favorite listen. Clay was standing in the garage doorway with laser eyes cutting through me wondering if I was ever getting out so I could check out his 10" mid-bass on the firework track!
 

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Discussion Starter · #588 ·
While an explanation can be helpful, please don't feel it was required. It's your car, you can do whatever you want with it.
I know what you're after and if this gets you there. Awesome. If not, try something else.
This isn't easy by any means and as we've discussed many times, there is always a compromise somewhere with some thing.
Thanks Mic - I've overly busy with work right now, I was out of town this past weekend and the beginning of this week, and I have been trying to prepare for this weekend. So I have had things I wanted to post nagging at me while trying to do all the work that needs to get done.

My post above wasn't intended to be a defense.....that is certainly how it is written now that I read it again.....my intention was really to begin a discussion, if folks were following, about various speaker location options and the decision points that are involved with the final execution. How we start off with a plan, or a certain design philosophy, or a budget......and then feedback, or measurements, etc. causes us to rethink that plan/philosophy/budget........

So, if anyone wants to comment about how they approached these kinds of issues in their car, or a customer's car - it might be helpful.

Things be sensitive around here. Pillars look good and I took Mic’s comment as a joke.
One of the challenges I've had Jerry with this 'hobby' - too emotionally tied to the car / system - hard for me to be completely objective / rational with it. Even though I'm not completing the install myself like many do on this site. It is similar to my mixed involvement with competitions.....show up with a tune that I believe sounds good, score poorly - hard to just objectively state, "well, it just didn't do it today, the tune wasn't to the judge's liking, the others were so much better, maybe I didn't seat the judge correctly, etc." I think I would have reacted a little differently to Mic's post if he had provided a little context to the gif - then I would have taken it for what it was intended to be. He and I are good - he can even rip on them in person this weekend at my event ;)
 

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I have a similar location in my TSX, as u know, huge dip at 2.2k. but extends down to 1.6

"Solution" was to boost the overall output and then use EQ to cut surrounding bands back down to target (flat).
This resulted in being able to apply less boost to the affected bands.

Second solution was tune around the issue and if someone can hear the dip in the response, kudos to them and they can get the **** outta my car 😉😁.

Locations were chosen based on the white papers on best locations in a vehicle. Partially influenced by the BRZ as well. I think I screenshot the BRZ and looked at them when building too, I know I sent them to friends before who wanted to know what to do.

How it was implemented was bc I personally do not like having judges/people see speaker locations or at least I want some control over what is visual.
Too many judges over the years prejudge the vehicle based on what they see. So I'm big on, when possible, at hiding locations and speaker size and type.
Exceptions are when I need to highlight a speaker for brand exposure or bc I want the judge to see the speaker
 
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Thanks Mic - I've overly busy with work right now, I was out of town this past weekend and the beginning of this week, and I have been trying to prepare for this weekend. So I have had things I wanted to post nagging at me while trying to do all the work that needs to get done.

My post above wasn't intended to be a defense.....that is certainly how it is written now that I read it again.....my intention was really to begin a discussion, if folks were following, about various speaker location options and the decision points that are involved with the final execution. How we start off with a plan, or a certain design philosophy, or a budget......and then feedback, or measurements, etc. causes us to rethink that plan/philosophy/budget........

So, if anyone wants to comment about how they approached these kinds of issues in their car, or a customer's car - it might be helpful.



One of the challenges I've had Jerry with this 'hobby' - too emotionally tied to the car / system - hard for me to be completely objective / rational with it. Even though I'm not completing the install myself like many do on this site. It is similar to my mixed involvement with competitions.....show up with a tune that I believe sounds good, score poorly - hard to just objectively state, "well, it just didn't do it today, the tune wasn't to the judge's liking, the others were so much better, maybe I didn't seat the judge correctly, etc." I think I would have reacted a little differently to Mic's post if he had provided a little context to the gif - then I would have taken it for what it was intended to be. He and I are good - he can even rip on them in person this weekend at my event ;)
Which is why, at the end of the day (I hate that saying btw) you need to do this for you. If it sounds good to you, who cares what a specific judge thought. I tend to value GTG more (although we don't have enough around me and too busy with life to travel to one at the moment).
 

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Which is why, at the end of the day (I hate that saying btw) you need to do this for you. If it sounds good to you, who cares what a specific judge thought. I tend to value GTG more (although we don't have enough around me and too busy with life to travel to one at the moment).
I can Honestly say I've learned more from competing than any other format.
It's pushed me to improve my knowledge and my skills and improved me as a critical listener and tuner.
Without competiton I wouldn't be at whatever point where I am today
 

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let’s say I was to go to one competition

how do I look and see where they’re at in my area?
Both IASCA & MECA have competitions listed on their sites...

Not sure where you are in CO, but there used to be a place in the Springs, the Sound Shop, that kept up with and held competitions. There were several places in Denver... I'd suggest calling around the car stereo shops to see if there are other comps besides IASCA & MECA.

Hope this helps...
 

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Both IASCA & MECA have competitions listed on their sites...

Not sure where you are in CO, but there used to be a place in the Springs, the Sound Shop, that kept up with and held competitions. There were several places in Denver... I'd suggest calling around the car stereo shops to see if there are other comps besides IASCA & MECA.

Hope this helps...
definitely......

The other day someone was just telling me how they lost to someone who’s system sounded like ****, But their car was really really expensive and super amazing but the system is complete trash and he lost to that person, and this is someone who uses horns with direcBut their car was really really expensive and super amazing but the system is complete trash and he lost to that person, and this is someone who uses horns with direc...

hearing stuff like that makes me absolutely sick about the thought of competing that is the number one reason why I don’t compete because I know for a fact I would need to be up against a car like Jason‘s on this thread.

I would be so angry if I was up against the car end it was some BS and some rookie judge doesn’t even know what imaging or staging actually is And can’t even follow The simple instructions given to them..

I was an IASCA judge back in 96’-99’
I remember judging cars and it was simple follow the freaking instructions, but I remember there were there other judges that just gravitated to what they thought was cool.
 

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LOVE the car, LOVE the install, LOVE the equipment. Kudos sir, very very nice ride.
I too struggled finding that perfect door woofer and for me it ended up being the Vipera F6. I can run without a sub and not even notice on 80% of the music I listen to.
 
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Discussion Starter · #597 ·
LOVE the car, LOVE the install, LOVE the equipment. Kudos sir, very very nice ride.
I too struggled finding that perfect door woofer and for me it ended up being the Vipera F6. I can run without a sub and not even notice on 80% of the music I listen to.
Thank You! Mark did an amazing job with the install!

definitely......

The other day someone was just telling me how they lost to someone who’s system sounded like ****, But their car was really really expensive and super amazing but the system is complete trash and he lost to that person, and this is someone who uses horns with direcBut their car was really really expensive and super amazing but the system is complete trash and he lost to that person, and this is someone who uses horns with direc...

hearing stuff like that makes me absolutely sick about the thought of competing that is the number one reason why I don’t compete because I know for a fact I would need to be up against a car like Jason‘s on this thread.

I would be so angry if I was up against the car end it was some BS and some rookie judge doesn’t even know what imaging or staging actually is And can’t even follow The simple instructions given to them..

I was an IASCA judge back in 96’-99’
I remember judging cars and it was simple follow the freaking instructions, but I remember there were there other judges that just gravitated to what they thought was cool.
I get it.......and I feel the same......I often give an analogy that may / may not make sense......I give a demo to a friend who is a judge and has really good ears on Saturday....he/she says the car is on point....strong 80's car....I go to a MECA show on Sunday, and a 'judge' gives the car a 63.....So the guy I trust and I know that he/she knows what they are talking about gives their assessment, but the one with the scoresheet judges it totally different (and for argument sake, there wasn't a 30 degree drop in temperature or anything like that). Now, a lot of guys are able to shrug that off and say, 'well, that judge didn't know what they were talking about....', but I can't help but take it personally....so I don't really like competing...I'll do it occasionally to get a reality check from a judge I trust, but that is it.

Many of my friends love it.......they love the feedback, they love the competition, they can keep everything in perspective, and they have a good time with it. I wish I were like them, but I'm weird.
 

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What I wan
Thank You! Mark did an amazing job with the install!



I get it.......and I feel the same......I often give an analogy that may / may not make sense......I give a demo to a friend who is a judge and has really good ears on Saturday....he/she says the car is on point....strong 80's car....I go to a MECA show on Sunday, and a 'judge' gives the car a 63.....So the guy I trust and I know that he/she knows what they are talking about gives their assessment, but the one with the scoresheet judges it totally different (and for argument sake, there wasn't a 30 degree drop in temperature or anything like that). Now, a lot of guys are able to shrug that off and say, 'well, that judge didn't know what they were talking about....', but I can't help but take it personally....so I don't really like competing...I'll do it occasionally to get a reality check from a judge I trust, but that is it.

Many of my friends love it.......they love the feedback, they love the competition, they can keep everything in perspective, and they have a good time with it. I wish I were like them, but I'm weird.
Haha ..... not weird...
when I listen to my own car I usually keep a tune for a few months then retune or actually just re calibration in Dirac just to get a freshie... speaker wear, new mic, etc.

But during when I do have a good tune going , every day seems a little different. Some days my center pulls left at 1.2k, most days it’s dead on balls. Some days I just hate my car, some days it’s the best ever....

i know Ive had to work 5X as hard to have the reputation as someone that, in my opinion had a good sounding car and got lucky. And then does that over and over to win multiple times. Multiple time winning does say something... but it’s absolutely nothing compared to hands on building cars. Yet for some odd reason these guys get mad respect, even by vendors. Even if they didn’t build or tune there car!!!

the guy who built the car should be given special privileges from vendors not the ppl getting a trophy....

like the multiple time winners or top 3 placers in multiple shows do and should get some recognition, all I’m saying is they should not be assumed as a god and there voice is the only voice to listen to in the industry or on the diy side of things... but it’s just not that way....

I definitely respect guys that do compete, amd stick with it.... so there’s a dibble sided feeling on it. Because it takes a lot, it’s just the notion that winning a sq comp makes you a expert is so so so so so so so far from reality it makes me sick. And then to try amd talk to us guys that build our cars and try to give us “advice” or tell us about imaging cues and install problems without ever hearing how a car sounds is downright absurd.

as a builder , I know as much as anyone, cars acoustics are freaky amd sometimes things that shouldn’t work do, and things that should work don’t.....
 
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