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Can I ask why did you angle the midbass? At that frequency it shouldn’t matter? Or am I wrong?


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It won’t matter… but it kinda looks cool mirroring the mids I think… that was the only reason I could come up with
 

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It won’t matter… but it kinda looks cool mirroring the mids I think… that was the only reason I could come up with
Just seems to take up leg room… unless the magnet depth of the Brax made it impossible to mount flat?


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Discussion Starter · #105 ·
Can I ask why did you angle the midbass? At that frequency it shouldn’t matter? Or am I wrong?


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Why yes you may ask.

I wanted to do a DIY experiment to see if it does indeed delivers a positive benefit .

The goal was to have the drivers in the same arc as the main stage to align the voice coils as much as possible to try and obtain the
  1. The best frequency and phase response from the driver for the passband I was interested in
  2. on-axis alignment
  3. Have the driver integrate seamlessly with the above dash stage to maximize sound staging.
and this is supposed to be a DIY site and not buy from a professional and have it all built.

And most of all I am curious and do not always follow the dogmatic statements :geek:
 

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Discussion Starter · #107 ·
Okay the enclosures are built but not beautified so that means it was time for a test this weekend.

I hooked up my test system and installed the front 3-way stage.

I spent the weekend just playing and listening to tunes no building.

And there is more leg room than the picture illustrates, the angle are not flattering 🙄

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Why yes you may ask.

I wanted to do a DIY experiment to see if it does indeed delivers a positive benefit .

The goal was to have the drivers in the same arc as the main stage to align the voice coils as much as possible to try and obtain the
  1. The best frequency and phase response from the driver for the passband I was interested in
  2. on-axis alignment
  3. Have the driver integrate seamlessly with the above dash stage to maximize sound staging.
and this is supposed to be a DIY site and not buy from a professional and have it all built.

And most of all I am curious and do not always follow the dogmatic statements :geek:
I'm also curious on this. Is an A/B test with off-axis in the works, or is this going to be based off of impressions from the previous car?

Really enjoying the thread, keep up the great work!
 

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Discussion Starter · #109 ·
And for giggles a rta hit showing the potential

Seamless transition across the 40-20khz response of the system and the listening sessions i did where a lot of fun. i could stare right at the Ml8’s and i could hear no sound localized to the driver. The bass was super solid, punchy, clean and delineated extremely well.

Experiment a success so in am going to keep going!!!

Left , right and both sides ( after about 11 minutes of eq setting)

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Discussion Starter · #111 ·
I'm also curious on this. Is an A/B test with off-axis in the works, or is this going to be based off of impressions from the previous car?

Really enjoying the thread, keep up the great work!
No off axis at this point as it would be way to much work , lol. So I am using my previous car as a baseline and all other cars I have heard with MB integration in the doors and under the seats, etc.
 

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No off axis at this point as it would be way to much work , lol. So I am using my previous car as a baseline and all other cars I have heard with MB integration in the doors and under the seats, etc.
That’s phase and timing, but I’m guessing you have that nailed as you’re a female me 😂 personally I don’t see any advantage to having drivers on axis playing those freqs, I am going to be putting hybrid 6x9 in the kicks as I can detect a very subtle pull down to only the right underseat in mine, your angled baffle puts the voice coil deeper into the corner vs it being flat in the door is the only advantage I can see, but I’d still do IB kicks over doors any day… I did measure the phase of kicks vs under seats in mine and kick is a lot nicer, kicks aren’t issue free, but a lot smoother with half as much of a null in the midband 😎

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Discussion Starter · #113 ·
thats alright dumdum you are not forced to build anybody else's build :ROFLMAO:

Well In my install I see no advantage at all to kicks or cutting up the car to get it. My voice coil position is almost there already and i have great freq. response with no dips at all in the current location which I have shown. The left and right side are basically identical in response between the two sides as well. the mid bass plays down to 40 Hz solid and that is pretty good for a 3way front stage. I will always choose proper alignment of drivers over assumptions it does not matter :D. Everything matters and you pick your compromises that you can live with.

I can move my head inches in either direction and rotate ( swivel) my head and the stage is solid and does not collapse or shrink. it is pretty cool to listen to out of phase stuff as it really messes with the head with no apparent location or center to anything.

I can hardly feel any vibration in the enclosure as it sits and the door is a non-event. It is about speaker location to me door or not.

I can pull the enclosure off and put the original door panel back on and the car is back to stock in 20minutes with no extra holes or damage done so I view that as a win in my books. same with the pillars. the stock pillars can be put back in with no damage at all. So I am good with being able to do a bit of crazy but be able to put the car back to stock in very little time :cool:
 

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Dumdum, hard to say without an experiment of normal aiming of the midbass but is it possible like you saw with kicks, that the nulls are shifted since the driver isn't playing primarily across the short side of the car but the longer length of the car? So it is possible the nulls were pushed OUT of the midbass frequency and into the subwoofer frequency so the nulls were no longer an issue. Again, that is a potential benefit but isn't able to be validated without a comparison of the ML8 in the same vehicle with normal door driver placement.
 

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Dumdum, hard to say without an experiment of normal aiming of the midbass but is it possible like you saw with kicks, that the nulls are shifted since the driver isn't playing primarily across the short side of the car but the longer length of the car? So it is possible the nulls were pushed OUT of the midbass frequency and into the subwoofer frequency so the nulls were no longer an issue. Again, that is a potential benefit but isn't able to be validated without a comparison of the ML8 in the same vehicle with normal door driver placement.
You can’t aim a midbass to lose the across the car null, it plays omni directional at freqs below well over 500hz with an 8”, to suggest otherwise is never going to happen

however…

What you can do is play it in such a narrow band you avoid the nulls with steep slopes, I’m fairly sure measurements with smaart at 1/24octave in the phase plot will show a standing wave/kink at some freq in the pass band in at least one midbass in this instance… unless it’s one of those freakish cars like my friends very special car that happens to have both the length and the across the car nulls line up and cancel each other out so the response at the listening position is unaltered from the nearfield of the driver
 

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Finding acoustic car treatments in Canada at a reasonable cost is not easy these days. The price is horrendous to say the least.
Ok good. I thought it was just me that noticed this. It would be swell to find a decent supplier in canada.
 

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Amazing to see another Canuck do everything in the spirit of what this site exists to exemplify, the diy aspect. Wish I had the commitment to really try some crazy things like this, but not in the cards for me now. Looking forward to seeing more progress. This site has some really inspiring people on it. Great work so far.
 

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Discussion Starter · #118 ·
Amazing to see another Canuck do everything in the spirit of what this site exists to exemplify, the diy aspect. Wish I had the commitment to really try some crazy things like this, but not in the cards for me now. Looking forward to seeing more progress. This site has some really inspiring people on it. Great work so far.
Thank you for the kind and supportive words 🤗🤗
It is never to late, one just needs to start and bite off the elephant one bite at a time!!!

I have made more progress in that the pods have been painted with custom fine texture paint and they have been mounted — pics to come

The midbass enclosures have been mounted as well but they are unfinished at this point - weather is getting to cold - and i will need to finish up the beauty work next year.

I built a temporary amp rack to house the amps, processor, router and a couple other things so i can get the system up and running in the car. The amp
rack is also a prototype test idea that is a cantilever design bolted down between the rear wheels that still allows me to access the spare tire and all access panels. No panels or plastic has been cut so the car can be returned to stock in no time.

The system is set up as a 3-way with no external sub( not needed) as the MB ‘s play down to 33 hz at the target curve as it sits now.

The system as a starting baseline is sounding great and the vertical on axis alignment of all
drivers is producing an incredible 3 dimensional sound stage as hoped for…

I am super happy with the minimal & overkill system that is setup as a basic 3-way.

I am so tempted to just leave it as a 3-way , maybe add rear fill and call it a day. I had a number of ideas i am/ was wantIng to try out but i may just enjoy this for a while.

I will forward pic’s when i get a chance.
 

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Discussion Starter · #119 ·
I should add that it is and has been fun testing ideas and challenging myself on building ideas, skills and making mistakes and fixing them.

imho the gold is in building a vision, trying out new things and seeing it through to a working system that hopefully delivers on your vision. That has been the basis of what gives me motivation to try the crazy stuff …. so far so good … haha 🤓
 

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Discussion Starter · #120 ·
Plain jane amp rack installled for winter!

It allows access tol my spare tire and i have almost all my cargo capacity in check.

Lots of options to beautify in the spring and summer months when i rebuild the rack and put in the rest of the system 😎

One C4 for the left side and one for the right side pretty simple eh!!


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