Related, but I have been wondering this as I explore fail safes in my system. Does have two filters like this create any phase issues?
8+ Blown Tweets in 10 Months??? WHY?
I need ideas on what might be the cause of this issue my buddy is having with his system I’ve installed and continue to upgrade as he get new equipment. 2015 Infinity Q50, originally I installed an Alpine dsp along with a active 3 way front system, 6 channel Crecendo amp, real fill and subs. First speakers to go were both Morel 2.5” dome mids that were maybe 6 months old, going within a couple days of each other. A Steg tweet, both Focal Flax tweets were toast within a month, a high end set of Pioneer tweeters lasted less than a month, and a couple months ago he finally took my advise and got the Hertz Mille Legend ML280.3 tweeter ML700.3 3” and ML1800.3 7” setup and let me move the tweeters from behind the small plastic factory grills on the doors to a-pillar pods. I had installed the same setup a couple of times in other cars and with those 3” and tweeters in the pillars and dash locations they can nearly make your ears bleed without breaking a sweat. After the first 2 or 3 sets blew, He had me add a set of 2.2k caps to the tweeters as an extra backup to the 2k setting on the amp and 2.5k setting on the DSP. I also swapped the Crecendo 6 channel out for the Audio Control 6 channel and ran dedicated wires straight from the amp to the speakers, trying to eliminate any possible causes. Last week we swapped out the Alpine DSP for a Helix 10 channel as one of the RCA jacks on the Alpine was noisy and required a ground to be soldered on to eliminate it. Anyway, he called yesterday and one of the Hertz tweeters wasn’t working, and sure enough I checked today and it’s completely dead. He doesn’t over cook his system and knows it’s limits so I don’t think it’s him and the volume knob causing it. I originally thought that because the stock grills had such small holes and not many of them that the tweeters were actually getting overworked and we just weren’t getting enough sound past the grills, and every tweet prior to today had a power rating of 25 to maybe 40 watts RMS, and the combination of the much bigger and beefier Legend tweeter in a pod right in your face with probably double the power handling had me convinced it wouldn’t happen again. I know tweeter power rating are wushy washy, but I even moved the mid/tweet crossover point to 4k when I installed the Helix DSP to compare the sound. Any ideas of what might be causing this rapidly growing graveyard of tweeters??? TIA
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As long as they're outside of the passband of the crossover: not really. Having cascaded filters as close to one another as OP does will change the acoustic slope of the crossover which will result in improper summing. You primary fail safe should be a capacitor higher than the resonant frequency of the tweeters. 1.5-2x will offer more protection in case you don't remember to turn an XO on. A cap will also protect against an amplifier fault which could send DC to a tweeter and kill it.Related, but I have been wondering this as I explore fail safes in my system. Does have two filters like this create any phase issues?
Got it, thanks. I just installed caps in my car after a losing a set of tweeters due to a failed DSP. Was wondering if that was my only means of protection.As long as they're outside of the passband of the crossover: not really. Having cascaded filters as close to one another as OP does will change the acoustic slope of the crossover which will result in improper summing. You primary fail safe should be a capacitor higher than the resonant frequency of the tweeters. 1.5-2x will offer more protection in case you don't remember to turn an XO on. A cap will also protect against an amplifier fault which could send DC to a tweeter and kill it.
What about now broskee?I thought about that too, i think its not him, but someone with a similar mindset.
What about now broskee?
still a no for me. He would have been banned by now.What about now broskee?
You already said it - volume is cranking at 15 out of 30. The gains are too hot.
It should be sufficient. If you want an additional fail safe set the XO on your amp close to where the caps are as well. As long as the rolloff for these is far away (close to an octave) from the actual crossover point it shouldn't have an audible effect.Got it, thanks. I just installed caps in my car after a losing a set of tweeters due to a failed DSP. Was wondering if that was my only means of protection.
So you’re saying that if the DSP hp is set at 3600, having the amp hp set as close as 500-750hz lower would change the slope in a negative way? But the 2.2khz caps I added would be fine being the fs of the tweeters is 900hz? So no amp crossover, turn it to full range?As long as they're outside of the passband of the crossover: not really. Having cascaded filters as close to one another as OP does will change the acoustic slope of the crossover which will result in improper summing. You primary fail safe should be a capacitor higher than the resonant frequency of the tweeters. 1.5-2x will offer more protection in case you don't remember to turn an XO on. A cap will also protect against an amplifier fault which could send DC to a tweeter and kill it.
not on this car. Volume can be pegged and output is considerably lower than other systems with same speakers and far lower than what it should be capable of.You already said it - volume is cranking at 15 out of 30. The gains are too hot.
Why would you use the crossovers on an amp AND a DSP?So you’re saying that if the DSP hp is set at 3600, having the amp hp set as close as 500-750hz lower would change the slope in a negative way? But the 2.2khz caps I added would be fine being the fs of the tweeters is 900hz? So no amp crossover, turn it to full range?
Failsafe in case the DSP settings are lost or corrupted, or other DSP failure.Why would you use the crossovers on an amp AND a DSP?
As someone who had this happen, and lost tweeters, I can see why you'd do it. I have caps on my tweeters now.
He said he also has caps on the tweeters. Using the amp XO along with a DSP just seems redundant and pointless.Failsafe in case the DSP settings are lost or corrupted, or other DSP failure.
As someone who had this happen, and lost tweeters, I can see why you'd do it. I have caps on my tweeters now.
Yes. Absolutely. From a SQ perspective the easiest way get symmetric crossovers is to use LR24 on a dsp and then EQ down to target. The 6 db/octave cap at 2.2khz would have some effect on a crossover of 3600 but would be 100 percent workable contrary to what anyone tells you.So you’re saying that if the DSP hp is set at 3600, having the amp hp set as close as 500-750hz lower would change the slope in a negative way? But the 2.2khz caps I added would be fine being the fs of the tweeters is 900hz? So no amp crossover, turn it to full range?
If you are running amp crossovers in this system as well as dsp crossovers AND caps i would eliminate the amp crossovers just to eliminate a variable that might be causing you to clip gains or some other type of shenanigans. Idk there's been a lot of helpful info posted here i imagine between all the feedback you could test and report back what was going on.
Could the owner of the car change the tweeter or eq settings on the deck or are there any eq settings turned on in the phone or alternate sources?
Who knows what he has from said...
10db equals double the loud which equals 10 times the power, but wait there is a compression ratio. What Im saying is there is a point where you can add more gain but efect will be lesser due to compression factor eg. "Lossing output"...
Dsp and amplifier crossovers can stack; considering which slopes and types you stacked probably the result was something like cheb type crossover with high slope where big peak occured before roll off.
10db equals double the loud which equals 10 times the power, but wait there is a compression ratio. What Im saying is there is a point where you can add more gain but efect will be lesser due to compression factor eg. "Lossing output"...
Dsp and amplifier crossovers can stack; considering which slopes and types you stacked probably the result was something like cheb type crossover with high slope where big peak occured before roll off.
Are you making eq boost adjustments on the tweeters? If you are, don't. Just make cuts to flatten the peaks. If you are and they are over 3db that's an issue.
I bet your friend is turning on loudness or some sound settings to get louder or he is turning up gains.
I bet your friend is turning on loudness or some sound settings to get louder or he is turning up gains.
Has he always had that crescendo amp? If so, that is probably the problem if you are setting gains correctly which I believe you are. And not making eq boosts. I've never heard anything good about crescendo amps
Without o-scope readings, eq adjustments, headunit settings, etc we're just guessing.Are you making eq boost adjustments on the tweeters? If you are, don't. Just make cuts to flatten the peaks. If you are and they are over 3db that's an issue.
I bet your friend is turning on loudness or some sound settings to get louder or he is turning up gains.
Th OP said the Crescendo amp was swapped out at some point.Has he always had that crescendo amp? If so, that is probably the problem if you are setting gains correctly which I believe you are. And not making eq boosts. I've never heard anything good about crescendo amps
OP doesn't seem like he's going to provide any of that. Idk i have a distaste for taking the time to troubleshoot when it's taken in bad faith.Without o-scope readings, eq adjustments, headunit settings, etc we're just guessing.
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