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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I sat on this for weeks. I wasn't going to write this because I have nothing to gain from doing so. After thinking about it for a while, I have to give feedback out of duty to the rest of the forum members. I have thoroughly enjoyed this forum and its members over the last couple of months and want to protect its integrity.

I bought two zapco dc1000.4 amps from Joey. One he described with cosmetic issues, sent pictures and I accepted. The other he described "as new". Didn't send pictures, and I didn't ask for any. My fault, lesson learned. I also didn't ask about the function of the amp, because he said it was "as new". He still claims to this day that it was "as new". Here is the text from the thread:

"
SS 18w Illums, Zapco DC1000.4(x2), DC750.2, DAT/ETON DA6.6 HEX, Audiocontrol Model 11
MUST SELLLLLLLLL

DC1000.4 as new- $775"

The first little issue was Joey told me that he was missing one of the din cords and would refund me $20 since one was missing. Not a problem, but it might be relevant to the rest of the story. :worried:

Joey gave me a tracking # on march 4th. On the 6th UPS still had not picked it up. On the 7th, still not picked up. Later on the 7th Joey said that the amps were on the way and I shouldn't worry. On the 9th, UPS still says that they have not seen the amps. I called Joey and said that I needed something proving that UPS had the amps that day. He wasn't at work. Amazingly he checked and found out that they were still at his work, even though he had stated before that they were on the way. Maybe this all went down the way that Joey said that it went down. I don't know, but taken in context with the rest of the story, I have a hard time believing it. If I was shipping out $1200 worth of amps, you can guaran-freakin-ty that I would know whether the amps were sitting in the shipping department or not. I would at a minimum check with the shipping person and make sure that they confirmed that they went out. Joey confirmed at one point that they did go out, only to find out two days later they were still sitting at work. Again, I have all of the email exchanges to prove this.

The amps arrived several days later, each in separate sealed boxes inside a master box, separated by lots of paper. Well packaged.

The pictures show the condition of the "as new" amp. Joey claims "it must have happened during shipment". That simply isn't possible. There was nothing metal inside the box with the amp to gouge the finish in that way.


deep scratches (no way this happened in the box):mad:



scratches and discoloration (no damage to the box that it was in)






Worse than the scratches is the fact that the amp sometimes doesn't turn on, or takes several minutes to output sound. I talked to Robert at Zapco and, after checking the serial #, Robert says that it is possible that this amp did not have the mod to the pcb for the dsp. They had some early amps that would stay in protection mode. The mod includes swapping out a cap and one other component on the dsp board. It was an intermitten issue. It is going to cost about $120 with shipping to get the amp modded. Not what I expected for an "as new" amp. Joey claims that it never did that when he used it. Ok, maybe. I don't know. I would give him the benefit of a doubt if he wasn't out to lunch on the "as new" description as it relates to the appearance of the amp.

Finally, the amp shuts down way before it gets to clipping. The Zapco DC's have lights that show you when the output is clipping on a very dynamic passage. This amp shuts down well before that. Who knows how much it will cost to fix that problem. My old Alpine MRV-F545 played way louder than this Zapco that costs 3 times as much. In comparison the other Zapco amp, which is supposed to be identical, blows it away.

I tried to deal with Joey on this and he refused. I went so far as to say that I would keep the amp, but could he work with me on the cost of the mod. He basically said that he is remodeling his house and can't afford it. As a last resort I told him that I would file a paypal claim if he refused to work with me. To my surprise, Joey asked paypal to make a judgement before I did and they judged in his favor. The deal with paypal is that they refuse to make judgements on the quality of the product. I paid for a DC1000.4 and received one, and that is all that paypal cares about. Since this is the first issue that I have ever had with a claim with paypal, that was news to me.

Apparently, it wasn't news to Joey, because he knew that if he filed the claim it would be in his favor. Seems like he has been there before.

Ironic that Joey was also involved in the great "Robot Undergound" scandal.

Bottom line is that I am not playing the victim here. This is all my fault for not getting a clear description of quality of the amp appearance and functionality. I trusted that "as new" means looks and works like new. I was wrong. That won't happen again. Live and learn. At the same time, there needs to be consequences for Joey on this deal.

I don't have the time to get into a he said/he said on this. I have pages and pages of emails that I exchanged with Joey. I can back up every single thing that I have said here if anyone needs to know.

Maybe Joey is a stand-up guy most of the time, but got into a pinch working on his house and did some things he wouldn't normally do. I don't know. I am wondering if maybe Joey flipped the "as new" amp to me from someone else, and that is the reason that they didn't ship for so long... because he was waiting for it himself. That would explain the late shipping, the questionable condition of the "as new" amp, the missing din cord, and the fact that the amp shuts down before reaching rated output. He hooks them up and they appear to work OK, and he ships them out.

I don't know and I am just guessing, but it all just seems fishy to me.

When Joey sees this I am sure he will defend himself. I won't get into another RU thread battle, I can promise you that. I just have one question to ask a doubter: "Why would I spend all of this time writing this up if I was making this up?" I have nothing, absolutely nothing to gain by doing this. I really don't have the time. I would rather be finishing my never ending install! :laugh: The only reason that I am doing it is out of a sense of duty to the other forum members. I want anyone else considering buying from Joey to do their homework.

Lesson Learned. You can take this to heart, or ignore. Your choice. I am done. Thanks for listening.

Tony
 

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This post makes me very very nervous. Because I sent a certified money order to the same person for those speakers, the Illuminators, from Canada, and basically Canada Post tracking says that it got there, and so did Joey, but.. here I am a month later, with nothing. Joey, if you're out there. I have the message trail. I would love to write you a glowing review, and to say that the speakers have arrived, but at this point, this poster here makes me greatly concerned, and $450 USD is nothing to shake a stick at and is at the intense end of my budget. My inbox here hasn't seen anything from you lately, and I still have a hard time believing that Wells Fargo has what is now going on a month of difficulty processing an official Canadian Postal Money order in USD.

This would be my first experience buying stuff off of a DIYMA community member, I woud hate to have it turn into crap. So please Joey if you can send the speakers so that I can indicate here that I recieved them that would be appreciated greatly. I will indicate here that I got them.

I like you rockingridge feel queasy to out this. I don't like saying negative things about people. But in my case especially so, because I have so little rep here, being new to this car audio thing and all. All of this however, is starting to smell quite bad.
 

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wow...bump
 

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This post makes me very very nervous. Because I sent a certified money order to the same person for those speakers, the Illuminators, from Canada, and basically Canada Post tracking says that it got there, and so did Joey, but.. here I am a month later, with nothing. Joey, if you're out there. I have the message trail. I would love to write you a glowing review, and to say that the speakers have arrived, but at this point, this poster here makes me greatly concerned, and $450 USD is nothing to shake a stick at and is at the intense end of my budget. My inbox here hasn't seen anything from you lately, and I still have a hard time believing that Wells Fargo has what is now going on a month of difficulty processing an official Canadian Postal Money order in USD.

This would be my first experience buying stuff off of a DIYMA community member, I woud hate to have it turn into crap. So please Joey if you can send the speakers so that I can indicate here that I recieved them that would be appreciated greatly. I will indicate here that I got them.

I like you rockingridge feel queasy to out this. I don't like saying negative things about people. But in my case especially so, because I have so little rep here, being new to this car audio thing and all. All of this however, is starting to smell quite bad.
I am not playing devils advocate here but, 1 out of 3 packages never arrived at the USPS via Canada Post. Thats why I do not use it at all now.

That said, I am sorry you guys got the short end of the stick.

I will not buy a damn thing from "Joey".
 

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I talked to Robert at Zapco and, after checking the serial #, Robert says that it is possible that this amp did not have the mod to the pcb for the dsp. They had some early amps that would stay in protection mode. The mod includes swapping out a cap and one other component on the dsp board. It was an intermitten issue. It is going to cost about $120 with shipping to get the amp modded.
That's pretty ****ty that Zapco charges to fix their own screw up.
 

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Well, since it's a design flaw with the amp itself I would expect them to stand behind their product and fix it. I don't see Audison charging anyone anything to fix/replace all of those defective bitone's they sent out.
Yeah, but if you didn't buy your Zapco from an "authorized dealer," you're lucky to get service at all. :rolleyes:
 

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I am not playing devils advocate here but, 1 out of 3 packages never arrived at the USPS via Canada Post. Thats why I do not use it at all now.

That said, I am sorry you guys got the short end of the stick.

I will not buy a damn thing from "Joey".
Except he said that it had arrived. Now if anyone could chime in and indicate how long it takes for Canada Post money orders to clear the bank in your experience, I would be most appreciative.

Edit after the fact: the other thing is that Canada post has been reliable for me. I have done most of my shopping through ebay. There at least I have 100% feedback at 77 transactions.
 

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Yeah, but if you didn't buy your Zapco from an "authorized dealer," you're lucky to get service at all. :rolleyes:
Who cares where it came from, the amp left the factory defective. They're charging to fix something that shouldn't have to be fixed in the first place.
 

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Yeah I feel like a total goof.

I hate to bring my private dealings up here, as I would rather solve my problems in private, but I think that it's about time that I took a few next steps because in the end. I am now out $450 US dollars with no speakers to show for it. I spoke with Joey over the phone, and he insists on refunding me via paypal as he apparently has spent my cash and needs to pay me back via credit card. Something that I have not accepted, due to the flaky nature of the transactions to date. He confirmed over the forum pm that he had received and cashed the money order. In addition, I spoke with a paypal rep who in essence said that if he were to pay me back via paypal, he could lodge a dispute via VISA, which means that the money would get sucked back out faster than... faster than... well I'll leave that to your imagination. So basically, he got my money, he spent it, and now wants to refund me with paypal. Bull$****e.

The kicker is that he claims that the speakers are now broken. Sound familliar? Given the tough economic times, I asked him whether he had a job, and the answer was yes, so he has the ability to pay me back. But to date I have heard nothing, and he was supposed to call me weeks ago. I am on the verge of resorting to some kind of legal or law enforcement means.

Frankly for a first experience with buying something from a forum member, this has been more than dissapointing. I am happy that the second, a DIYMA sub from npdang came in though. That was positive.

In the end, I really ought to post the entire sordid PM trail that I have with him. But I will wait and see after my consultations.

If any of you have advice that would be appreciated.
 

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vicw, Canada Post money orders are considered cash, and don't need to "clear"
That's not true at all actually. All money orders need to clear. The money will be in your account immediately but the bank or whatever institution you deal with will tell you that the authenticity of the m/o isn't known immediately and if it is a fraudulent m/o the bank will debit your account

Banks will tell you exactly how long to wait for the m/o to clear after you've cashed it. all you gotta do is ask. It's around a week or so.

Also another guy mentioned canada posts bad delivery. I ship tonnes of stuff with them and have had no problems. I think that they are quite good actually.
 

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Well regardless, this dude said that it finally cleared, and now refuses to ship saying that the drivers are damaged, and refuses to refund but by paypal after having spent money which wasn't his.

Hey somebody from Simcoe. I used to live down near there. Hope that you're enjoying that toyotetsu plant.
 

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Well regardless, this dude said that it finally cleared, and now refuses to ship saying that the drivers are damaged, and refuses to refund but by paypal after having spent money which wasn't his.

Hey somebody from Simcoe. I used to live down near there. Hope that you're enjoying that toyotetsu plant.
Ya, totally agree. Just letting people know about the m/o situation since alot of people don't understand it.

Hey, a fellow Simcoe boy! Your the first guy I've talked to on diyma from anywhere close to my area. I actually just found out where that plant was built a few weeks ago. Guess I don't get out much ; )
 

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Discussion Starter #18
It appears that Amapro (Joey) needed some cash and two of us fell victim to his scam. Vicw - I know where he works if you need the info.
 

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sorry to hear about this Tony. Good luck.
 

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Yeah, but if you didn't buy your Zapco from an "authorized dealer," you're lucky to get service at all. :rolleyes:
True. BUT, at the same time, if you bought a used car and there was a known issue the dealer has a recall to fix the issue. They dont say "no, you have to pay for it" because you bought it on a used car lot.
Defective product design should warrant a free fix by the manufacturer. Anyway you want to shake a stick at it, someone bought that amplifier from Zapco and Zapco was paid their price. It is their duty (IMHO) to fix a design flaw.


As to the OP, sucks man. I hope this gets resolved for you. Mojo your way.
 
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