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Discussion Starter #1
Ok I am thinking of going with the following drivers:
tweet: LCY 108
mid: Aura NS3
low: Peerless XLS 8"

All will be installed in an older honda accord. mid/tweet in kickpanels and 8's in the doors (yes they will fit). Any suggestions, comments, concerns?
thanks!
 

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The drivers sound great, but the proposed mounting solution for mids and tweet sucks, unless yours ears are somewhere about your ankles.

Don't waste great components by firing them at your feet.
 

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best place to mount those is in the kicks........

and i've never seen any kick panels aimed at ankles....

usually up around the dome light depending on the car....

but nowhere near the ankles....
 

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The Aura NS3 is rather inefficient ( 80db/watt) with low power handling.
It might be tricky level matching it with the rather efficient LCY ribbon.
If you like your music very loud this set up might be difficult to do.
Perhaps NPDang can chime in? :D
 

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Looks lilke a great setup to me... just be aware that the Aura NS3 has a fairly low sensitivity and may not be as dynamic as you expect. Shouldn't be an issue for most people, but for some installs or listening preferences it may not be "loud" enough.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I dont really like to listen at very loud levels. Do you think if I fed it more power that would even things out a bit? Or are there any other drivers of similar size that you could suggest?
 

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May want to consider the LPG titanium dome mids... they're considerably more dynamic and similar in tone to the Aura. The little Vifa mg10md is also a good choice, if not a bit warmer in sound than the Auras.
 

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npdang-
Are we talking about the 26na? I thought that was an Aluminum dome. What would you cross that system over at? 300 and 4000?

I have been thinking about using 2 Aura N3 per side as mid ranges crossx @ 300 and 4000 because of my limited door space, how do you think the Aura N3 would sound as compared to a Morel WR-4?

Also, is there an update 'Product List' on this site somewhere?
 

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Discussion Starter #10
npdang said:
May want to consider the LPG titanium dome mids... they're considerably more dynamic and similar in tone to the Aura. The little Vifa mg10md is also a good choice, if not a bit warmer in sound than the Auras.
interesting! didnt even think about dome mids. What do you charge for those LPG's?
 

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Discussion Starter #11
mitchyz250f said:
npdang-
Are we talking about the 26na? I thought that was an Aluminum dome. What would you cross that system over at? 300 and 4000?

I have been thinking about using 2 Aura N3 per side as mid ranges crossx @ 300 and 4000 because of my limited door space, how do you think the Aura N3 would sound as compared to a Morel WR-4?

Also, is there an update 'Product List' on this site somewhere?
he's talking about the 2" dome mid. the 26na is a 1" tweeter
 

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Derek said:
best place to mount those is in the kicks........

and i've never seen any kick panels aimed at ankles....

usually up around the dome light depending on the car....

but nowhere near the ankles....
Kicks aren't the best place for anything, except for perhaps stray feet.

Putting an 80dB/w/m widebander at your ankles is NOT a smart idea. Actually, it's a really stupid one. To use the NS3's properly would require putting them on top of the dash, in the upper doors, or in custom A-pillar pods if you can swing that aesthetically. Anything else is a waste of an excellent drive unit. You might as well go to the flea market and buy a $0.99 "full range" thingy for all the difference you'll hear with them biting at your ankles.

It doesn't matter where the drivers are "aimed", there's still the whole matter of legs between you and the drivers. Also, where are you supposed to rest your left leg between shifts if your dead pedal is occupied by speakers?

Besides, who wants a stereo that changes DRASTICALLY in character when somebody sits in the passenger seat, as ALL kickpanel installs do? Not me!

The ONLY reason kickpanels are popular is because they give installers custom work that's easy for the buyer to see and relatively easy to do. Transmitting music has nothing to do with it.
 

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Well, the reason for kick panels is to minimize the distance between speakers. (I am sure everybody knows about pathlengths issue) So, do you think mounting speakers on dash board is better?
Besides, who wants a stereo that changes DRASTICALLY in character when somebody sits in the passenger seat, as ALL kickpanel installs do? Not me!
What is your proposed solution on the drivers location that DO NOT change the characters when you move from driver seat to passenger seat? I am sure all thousands of competitors will thank you.
 

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dual700 said:
Well, the reason for kick panels is to minimize the distance between speakers. (I am sure everybody knows about pathlengths issue) So, do you think mounting speakers on dash board is better?
And everybody who can hear knows that "[the] pathlengths issue" is overblown to the point of farce.

Do I think dash-mounted speakers are better than kicks? There should be no question about that. I can think and I can hear, so I gravitate towards solutions that WORK as opposed to doing what everybody else is doing just because everybody else is doing it no matter how nonsensical it is.

Though obviously drivers firing directly at the listeners (e.g. in A-pillar pods and the like) rather than reflecting off a surface is a better idea, there are legitimate aesthetic, security, and safety constraints that often keep people from designing their systems thusly. To say nothing of the time (or cost) investment in designing and properly finishing bespoke a-pillars vs. throwing some carpet over fiberglass and MDF glop in an area that will rarely catch one's gaze.

dual700 said:
What is your proposed solution on the drivers location that DO NOT change the characters when you move from driver seat to passenger seat? I am sure all thousands of competitors will thank you.
If some competitor reads my posts and a lightbulb goes off, that's wonderful, but I'm not looking to curry favor with car audio competitors. What they do is neat but - mostly for institutional reasons, not through the fault of any given individual - NOT directed at getting the most natural possible reproduction of music in a car, so their goals and mine do not mesh.

However, perhaps I was too parsimonious with my words. To elaborate, if you've wasted time and money having drivers bite at your ankles there's a drastic difference in the reproduction when there's someone in the passenger seat vs. when you're driving alone. For me, that is unacceptable. While I thought that interpretation should be obvious, it occurs to me that not everybody else evaluates their car audio system in the only context that really matters - in a moving car.
 

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I dont know why you always seem so angry with everybody elses preference. Every install has its advantages and disadvantages and like in life, everyone picks their own set of problems.

This is all that really matters:

DS-21 said:
..and for me, my car sounds, stages, and images great while its moving. the truth is, i cant truly enjoy My music if anyone else was in the car anyways - no matter how the speakers are setup. even in my home, i cant truly enjoy my music if someone else was in the room..

thats the way it is "for me," anyways....

btw, with most of my passengers, they know how to sit or will naturally sit to where their leg will not obstruct the drivers to where it still sounds good! and depending on who it is, i can tell them to simply move their legs or the music wont be my point of focus...
 

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i didn't realize things were supposed to change just because the car is moving...................................


my kick panels aren't obstructive at all....they don't fire into anybody's legs....

i don't build my cars for the passengers...as i don't sit there....unless i'm drunk and somebody else is driving....

you like dash stuff.

that's good.

got any pics of your work?
 

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Derek said:
i didn't realize things were supposed to change just because the car is moving...................................


my kick panels aren't obstructive at all....they don't fire into anybody's legs....

i don't build my cars for the passengers...as i don't sit there....unless i'm drunk and somebody else is driving....

you like dash stuff.

that's good.

got any pics of your work?
X2.
Show us your work, DS21.
You are a very knowledgeable person, please educate us.
 

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Derek said:
i didn't realize things were supposed to change just because the car is moving...................................
Are you kidding? The addition of engine noise, tire noise, wind noise, HVAC noise, etc. all have their own effects, and should be intelligently compensated for (within reason) in a moving vehicle. In a Lexus LS430 there will be a less pronounced difference than in my Miata with the hardtop off and soft-top down. But there will still be a difference.

If you're not a sensitive enough listener to understand that these varying conditions impact the sound of your system, maybe kickpanels are indeed right for you.

Derek said:
you like dash stuff.
A more thoughtful way to phrase my position is that I favor direct sound (i.e. what the mastering engineer intended) over getting a hint of direct signal along with a hundred random reflections all at the same time (i.e. the Bose effect). If you prefer Bose to Burmeister, well, that's that.

I have no truck with putting midbasses in the kicks. As long as there's enough airspace and the enclosures are well-made, that's a fine place for midbasses. However, speaker placement gets much more important in car above ~300Hz or so, and if one's doing custom work anyway one might as well do it right. Then again, most people haven't been to enough real (i.e. unamplified) concerts in venues with top-notch acoustics to know what music really sounds like, so perhaps that argument is lost before it's begun.

At any rate, at this point both sides have presented their arguments, and I've no desire to repeat myself for those who can't read English the first time around. The original poster can now decide for him- or her- self the merits of his/her chosen drive-unit and mounting choices.
 

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DS-21 said:
I have no truck with putting midbasses in the kicks. As long as there's enough airspace and the enclosures are well-made, that's a fine place for midbasses. However, speaker placement gets much more important in car above ~300Hz or so, and if one's doing custom work anyway one might as well do it right. Then again, most people haven't been to enough real (i.e. unamplified) concerts in venues with top-notch acoustics to know what music really sounds like, so perhaps that argument is lost before it's begun.

At any rate, at this point both sides have presented their arguments, and I've no desire to repeat myself for those who can't read English the first time around. The original poster can now decide for him- or her- self the merits of his/her chosen drive-unit and mounting choices.
I myself worked for the Los Angeles Philharmonics for 4 years and have listened enough live concerts, thank you.
Let's face it. There is almost no way for you to have speaker locations in a car like you do at home without major overhaul to the car's interior.
How many of us are willing to do that? Not many.
Now, rather than mounting the speakers in stock locations, kicks are much better alternative, you agree?
If you like putting your speakers on axis on your dashboard, please do so.

But yeah, why don't you show us how you mount your speakers in your car?
Giving a suggestion is good, but being bitter is another.
 
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