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Discussion Starter #1
Hello all,
I'm first time on this forum. My problem seems to be easy but it's not !
So, I have BMW 116d(model E87) with original BMW acoustic;
-Bmw Bussines Radio
-One woofer under driver seat (on the right side, there is just empty housing for the woofer)
-Midrange in both doors
-No tweeter in triangle, but there are place for it.

I want, that the HU remain like it is, that means bussines Radio

If you have any suggestions, how to improve sound in may car, I would be very happy.

Some ways of thinkings ;
1.Complete AUDIO System BMW X-ION 200 , plug and play, but it isn't so easy to change
2.Just change midrange with Audio System BMW CO-100, and here I see one step further, because of tweeter in CO-100 (two way speakers)
3.Install tweeter into the original positions and change woofer with Audio System AX-08 (or mybe 2x AX-08),..and install 2 channel amplifire, just for two woofers),. all the rest stay like it is.

The 3rd point is for me maybe the right way....
Please help me or give me advise, what is really good and CHEAP solution and witch components are your suggestions ?

Thanks in advance

Andrej
 

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Andrej,

If I were you I might do the first. Why do you say P&P is not easy?

As far as budget upgrades are concerned, for us...go to e90post audio forum. There are many forum members there who are knowledgeable about your car.

Edit: you should probably state your budget...
 

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Discussion Starter #4
PnP: I didn't find any install manual for Audio System BMW X-ion 200 yet.
This system have to be driven by 4 channel amplifire(recommendation), but i want to drive this system by 2 channel amplifire. There're many wires which have to be cut....,..

I'm shure that someone still upgrade exactly the same system and that there are many experiences.

If I install 2x tweeter I have to calculate with min 60 EUR
...please recomendations ...which tweeter for BMW 1 ist recommended
...Tweeter with 90dB or more and with max 30 W RMS
...going to be driver by original radio

If I change woofer with new one (for example 1x Audio System AX-08) = 84 EUR, or 2x AX-08 maybe

Possible amplifires;
- ESX xenium x-two = 169 EUR or
- DLS CA 31 = 150 EUR (used, 1 year old)
________________________________________________________________

SUM = 60 + 84 + 150 = 294 EUR max. budget !!

If someone has better idea, please inform me.

I'll be very nice if I find two (2x) the right tweeter and
1x or 2x 8"flat woofer(with max. mouting depth 52 mm) and very high efficienty(for example 92dB) and 25-30 W RMS
Target is that the system remain driven by original radio.

So..

Best Regards

Andrej
 

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PnP: I didn't find any install manual for Audio System BMW X-ion 200 yet.
This system have to be driven by 4 channel amplifire(recommendation), but i want to drive this system by 2 channel amplifire. There're many wires which have to be cut....,..

I'm shure that someone still upgrade exactly the same system and that there are many experiences.

If I install 2x tweeter I have to calculate with min 60 EUR
...please recomendations ...which tweeter for BMW 1 ist recommended
...Tweeter with 90dB or more and with max 30 W RMS
...going to be driver by original radio

If I change woofer with new one (for example 1x Audio System AX-08) = 84 EUR, or 2x AX-08 maybe

Possible amplifires;
- ESX xenium x-two = 169 EUR or
- DLS CA 31 = 150 EUR (used, 1 year old)
________________________________________________________________

SUM = 60 + 84 + 150 = 294 EUR max. budget !!

If someone has better idea, please inform me.

I'll be very nice if I find two (2x) the right tweeter and
1x or 2x 8"flat woofer(with max. mouting depth 52 mm) and very high efficienty(for example 92dB) and 25-30 W RMS
Target is that the system remain driven by original radio.

So..

Best Regards

Andrej
Andrej,

seriously hit up the one and three series threads on bimmerpost. you'll get the best answer there.

Many guys also make harnesses to ensure no cutting of wires. I would say this is a MUST for our cars. Technic for the radio harness and VP Electricity for the speaker pigtails. Both are also occasional posters on this board.
 

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If you want to mount a second woofer under the passenger seat you need to buy an adapter ring to fit the audio system woofer, to mount a tweeter i recommend a oem triangle that's prepared for tweeter mounting, these are not expensive. You don't have to cut wires just connect the wire from amp to most, audio system has pre wired harnesses for this car.. X--ion 200 bmw is a nice set, if you connect this to a mosconi 120.4 you'll be amazed... Maybe i have some pics of a 3 series install, i'll look fir it and post them if you like.. It's almost the same as a 1

Sent from my LT15i using Tapatalk
 

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Oh BTW, OEM BMW headunits have a lot of noise! even at zero volume! Without the oem tweeters it's harder to hear that, but the moment you place the tweeters it will be there 100%...
 

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It sounds like you have the system that uses the head unit for an amp, too. That means just putting in new drivers/speakers may actually make things worse -- since the HU is underpowered, and heavily EQ-ed to accommodate the low power and mediocre drivers. (I'm basing this on the BMW info attached, but you will want to confirm this applies to the 116. From what this BMW doc indicates, you have the so called "Stereo" system. If you have this system, you will want to be aware of the fact that to compensate for the lack of tweeters and less woofer output than other versions of the OEM BMW stereo, the head unit front speaker signal is heavily eq-ed in the bass and treble to sound better than a flat signal would with these speakers and the amount of power available in the head unit.)

When you browse on the forum several members here have recommended, you'll see the first thing to do is get the signal out of the HU and into something that can remove the whacky equalization -- then into an aftermarket amp (almost anything is going to be a big improvement).... and then you'll want to think about driver/speaker upgrades, especially adding tweeters....
 

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Get the harness by technic. That will get you wires to tap line out without cutting oem wires.

There is no eq on your signal.
Next get a summing product like the audio control LC6i

With a full signal you can do anything you want.

I run a pair of hybrid audio L3's with a pair of Boston type M tweeters. Works very well in my logic 7 E60. Powered by a four channel amp. I power the underseat woofers with the other 2 channels. I lucked out and the hat L3 roll off is perfect for the 8kHz crossover for the tweeter.

Add a second u set seat woofer. oEM is fine.

Lastly add a small 8-10" sub.

It will sound very good. You may want to add an eq to tune it all in.
 

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Get the harness by technic. That will get you wires to tap line out without cutting oem wires.

There is no eq on your signal.
Good to know! I didn't know that.

The tweeterless systems in the e82 are typically heavily eq-ed at the head unit. So I learned something new about the 116. If the 116 is not like that, that makes upgrades easier.

And I agree, technic's harness is the way to go. Super easy, plug and play, and invisibly reversible down the road.
 

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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
Hello,
Now I finally bought LOGIC 7 TOP DSP original BMW Tweters.
May I ask someone, how further..., because, now I have no tweeters and Woofer+MID are connected paralell. If I add tweeters in System Impendance(R=Ohm) will drop to 2 Ohm and there could be problem for Radio output ?

Have someone experiences in this way ?

Next. I spoke with Autoacoustics "expert" and he said that in my case, the easyest way will be, to;
..elminitate JUST woofers from the System and connect them through the two channel Amplifier and
..add tweters to the System(paralell to MID) and to normal radio output.
in this case (I suppose) the Impendance(Ohm) will be the same again ?
Am I right or ?

If someone have some experiences please give me instructions ?

Inf:my System diagram
http://tis.spaghetticoder.org/images/1/10/09/28.jpg


Thanks in advance

Andrej
 

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Tweeter will plug into mids. It will not change impedance as they are playing separate frequency ranges


Yes you could power your underseats separately on thier own channels. You will need a jumper to do this. Go look at my install on e90post.com
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Hello, thanks !

So if I understand, parallel connection of tweeters will not change the impedance of front system(also with the woofer) and this will be than OK ?

I understand that this will be OK even if I connect tweter and not disconnect Woofer ?

If I disconnect Woofer(JUST ONE I HAVE) and Hi-RADIO OUTPUTS connect directly to AMPLIFIER Hi-Inputs, and Amplifier outputs back to Wofers(in this case TWO woofers, because I'm going to install both new woofers), this is OK to ?

What JUMPER you think about ?

Thanks

Andrej
 

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Hello, thanks !

So if I understand, parallel connection of tweeters will not change the impedance of front system(also with the woofer) and this will be than OK ?
Correct

I understand that this will be OK even if I connect tweter and not disconnect Woofer ?
Correct, tweeter midrange and woofer play different freq's therefore they present a unifom load to the Stock HU

If I disconnect Woofer(JUST ONE I HAVE) and Hi-RADIO OUTPUTS connect directly to AMPLIFIER Hi-Inputs, and Amplifier outputs back to Wofers(in this case TWO woofers, because I'm going to install both new woofers), this is OK to ?
I am not sure here. I don't think you can use the HU signal to power speakers and an amp on the same channels at the same time
What JUMPER you think about ?
2011 e90 335d Base Audio Upgrade that Rocks! - BMW 3-Series (E90 E92) Forum - E90Post.com


Thanks

Andrej
There you go
 

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I also have an e87 118i that I am working on the quickest way to improve what you have is to take these steps.

1-Get the Oem tweeters.
2-find a pair of the earthquake sws 8s or a pair of the audio systems 8" built for the BMW.
3- get a small amp like the arc audio 125.2 mini and run it on the woofers. (you will need a good line level adapter like an MTX ReQ to get the proper bass signal to the woofer amp though)

The business deck will power the stock mids and tweeters very well but it will still need some help for the woofers.

Your simplest option is head into BMW and have them install the alpine upgrade which includes an amp and replacement speakers for the highs and mids. You will still need the passenger side woofer though.

I have replaced my business deck with an Alpine cde126bt and have installed the earthquake sws woofers in mine with the Arc audio mini amp. It sounds 100x better than it did but it is just not enough for me

Where are you located?



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By the way, there is some great info posted about E90 installs above but the only thing that the e90 and the e87 have in common with the audio is the speaker size, locations and types. E90 owners do not have the space restraints that the e87 has. It is almost impossible to hide an amp in an e87 unless it is TINY!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
 

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Discussion Starter #18 (Edited)
Thanks to all,

1 case:
Oh NO, don't understand me WRONG, radio outputs will drive just MID and Tweeters.
In this case I'm going to DISCONNECT Woofers completely from the system !
Radio Outputs which drive WOOFER (see the picture above), will be total eliminated, This outputs(part of the signal) will be used just for Hi-Signal for the Amplifier and Amplifier will drive JUST two Woofers and nothimg more !
Is it now OK ?

2 case:
In case if I want to run(drive) complete front system(2xWoofer+2xMID+2xtweeters) with amplifier(I told that I have 2 chanel MOSCONI GLADEN ONE 120.2, very small and strong), I will COMPLETELY eliminate front radio OUTPUTS from speaker system and just use them for Hi-Signal for Amplifier.
Is this OK ?

Now I have just ONE 160m Woofer under driver seat. I don't know exactly If this Woofer is just connected to left Radio channel and right channel is(for woofer) prepared to connect additional woofer and is at the moment "free" ?

I'm from SLOVENIJA !

Audio System BMW X-ion is good I heard about ist, just for woofers is Earthquake even better but I bougt 1 week old 2x217m original BMW woofers for just 80 EUR and two LOGIC 7 original BMW tweeters for 65 EUR and TOTAL NEW MOSCONO 120.2 for 100 EUR.

Best Regards

Andrej
 

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no experience with that
By the way, there is some great info posted about E90 installs above but the only thing that the e90 and the e87 have in common with the audio is the speaker size, locations and types. E90 owners do not have the space restraints that the e87 has. It is almost impossible to hide an amp in an e87 unless it is TINY!

E87 HiFi/ Top HiFi amp location is under the left rear trunk trim; hidden behind a piece of plastic
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Thanks to all,

1 case:
Oh NO, don't understand me WRONG, radio outputs will drive just MID and Tweeters.
In this case I'm going to DISCONNECT Woofers completely from the system !
Radio Outputs which drive WOOFER (see the picture above), will be total eliminated, This outputs(part of the signal) will be used just for Hi-Signal for the Amplifier and Amplifier will drive JUST two Woofers and nothimg more !
Is it now OK ?
I dont know. The problem is that you are still using the same CHANNEL (front outputs) to drive speakers AND provide a signal for the amp...this might work it might not. I am not sure the amp presents any load/impedance to the OEM hu.
2 case:
In case if I want to run(drive) complete front system(2xWoofer+2xMID+2xtweeters) with amplifier(I told that I have 2 chanel MOSCONI GLADEN ONE 120.2, very small and strong), I will COMPLETELY eliminate front radio OUTPUTS from speaker system and just use them for Hi-Signal for Amplifier.
Is this OK ?
Yes although not optimal...you still need to provide some sort of crossover network so you send the right frequency ranges to the mids and highs as well as the woofers
Now I have just ONE 160m Woofer under driver seat. I don't know exactly If this Woofer is just connected to left Radio channel and right channel is(for woofer) prepared to connect additional woofer and is at the moment "free" ?

I'm from SLOVENIJA !

Audio System BMW X-ion is good I heard about ist, just for woofers is Earthquake even better but I bougt 1 week old 2x217m original BMW woofers for just 80 EUR and two LOGIC 7 original BMW tweeters for 65 EUR and TOTAL NEW MOSCONO 120.2 for 100 EUR.

Best Regards

Andrej
 

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Discussion Starter #20
I am not sure the amp presents any load/impedance to the OEM hu.
Hmm, yes..., I think that AMP presents some impendance for the radio ?
Good question, that need answer !

Crossover
Also good question...
So, for the original installed WOOFER is all OK, it seems that he play complete spectrum that he can, but before MID is CAPACITORS which eliminate LOW spectrum to come in MID !
If new original 217m WOOFERS plays the same spectrum as the old one(160mm) there will be all OK, but I don't belive that... so If I want to use 2 chanel AMP I have to build between WOOFER and MID crossover which have to block MID frequencies from the Woofers. I thing that woofers sholud be limited to max 120 Hz(better with 12 dB as with 6dB)?

Inf. I know with the 4 channel AMP would be easier but....

Andrej
 
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