[Alextaastrup]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

Delay of separate channels (front left and front right) can be made using Coneq C1. While sending FIR-files to the unit there is a possibility of chosing 0-5ms delay. You can use different delay values. In my case, I have managed to move the sceen centrum to its optimal location by implementing delay difference of about 16ms between left and right. It was funny to hear the difference. When the sceen image was in place, the whole system began to "sing".

Blutooth option and apps for smartphone - that is what I miss in this device. It was nice to have, but ... Maybe it will come in future as we know for Mosconi DSPs - addon module with AMAC protocol (up to 2 Mbit/s) - fine for streaming music files up to 48/24.

 

[Alextaastrup]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

Regarding APL3 - as far as I know, it is the same as APL1, but for 6 channels. Maybe I am wrong. After I have studied the vendor's site, I was not able to find more technical differences, so I believe that filosofy of the both devices is the same.

APL3 unit was used in the champion car at EMMA Eurofinals in Zalzburg, March 2014 - 1st place in very heavy class (MM Expert).

 

[Alextaastrup]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

Here yuo can see this program, where it is possible to set different delay values to FIR-files.

Sorry for the picture quality.

 

[Bluenote]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

Regarding APL3 - as far as I know, it is the same as APL1, but for 6 channels. Maybe I am wrong. After I have studied the vendor's site, I was not able to find more technical differences, so I believe that filosofy of the both devices is the same.

APL3 unit was used in the champion car at EMMA Eurofinals in Zalzburg, March 2014 - 1st place in very heavy class (MM Expert).

Thanks! I was interested in the 5.1 capabilities

 

[Hanatsu]

Here yuo can see this program, where it is possible to set different delay values to FIR-files. View attachment 57416

Sorry for the picture quality.

Hm... dunno if I got that program.

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[Alextaastrup]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

Sorry for the error in my previos post: delay of 16 cm, but not 16 msec, of course between left and right channels.

 

[aholland1198]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

Correct me if I am wrong, but you are required to purchase a measurement software separately from the hardware?

Also, did you set time, XO via DSP prior to using the APL1?

 

[Hanatsu]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

I use a normal DSP (Helix DSP) to set T/A, overall levels and crossovers. When I tested it I only adjusted T/A "somewhat right", it's possible it might have done that for you "from scratch". Never tested that to be honest. Anyway, it improved upon the setting I made and put the staging exactly correct. The measurement software and the hardware are separate products (as far as I can tell), you can use the software without the actual unit if you got a carPC for example. You don't need an advanced DSP coupled with it, it's basically required to split the signal and manage crossovers. That's why I recommended the MiniDSP boards...

Btw. Alex - Raimonds informed me about the c1 peq software, noticed the folder contained 2 executables just now. So I do have the delay program, I'll try it out as soon as possible. I have a few other tests I wanna try as well. Would be interesting to see an analysis of the *.fir file generated. Perhaps MATLAB can analyze that?

 

[aholland1198]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

I currently have a Helix DSP, but have plans to upgrade to the pro very soon. This sounds like a very nice product, but very odd, to me, why the software isn't included.

 

[Hanatsu]

I currently have a Helix DSP, but have plans to upgrade to the pro very soon. This sounds like a very nice product, but very odd, to me, why the software isn't included.

You should probably see it the other way around

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[Raimonds]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

Hello and thanks to everyone,
Let me join!

The minimum phase correction.
APL Workshop software generates minimum phase equalizer filters by default.
You can switch on a generation of linear phase filters for some scientific purpose.
But there is no practical reason to do that because of nice properties of minimum phase correction that is doing correction on amplitude as well as on phase.
Please take a look on Quested monitor correction example to see how it works:
delay estimation and measurement


It is almost impossible to have useful information from on point („listening position”) measurement (TDA measurement (Quested example) is exception).
Please find attached two pictures: „listening position” measurement and power response measurement of some studio monitor.

The rotary 16 position preset switch for APL1 can be installed anywhere in a car by use of an unshielded 5 wires cable of any length (flat cable, cable for security systems).

The APL3 is simple stack of 3 PCB of APL1 to save a space. The new version of an APL1 thin stainless steel enclosure will allow stacking APL1 as it is to get more processing channels.

I have looked around and I haven't seen any prices for the hardware yet.

You can find useful information in this thread:
http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/car-audio-classifieds/167151-apl1-equalizer-system-acoustic-power-lab.html

The APL Workshop software and APL1 unit are set of two products for solving equalizing tasks in different environments.
You can use APL Workshop just as measurement tool or with software equalizer – VST plagin APL EP1.
You can use just APL1 unit if you are able to generate FIR filter yourself. It supports wav format FIR filter coefficient files.
You do not need to purchase more than one copy of APL Workshop software if you are representing tuning studio and installing lot of APL1 units.

You do not need to analyze FIR filter generated by APL Workshop because the yellow curve already represents it fully. The FIR filter file format used by APL is proprietary, closed format. I can convert it to any specific format you like on order.
But anyway, you can check how accurately APL1 unit creates that curve by measuring just unit with respective FIR file uploaded to it…

Anyway, please feel free to ask me more questions!

BR,

Raimonds
Acoustic Power Lab :: Home

 

[Bluenote]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

So is the APL3 discontinued? Or is it the same price as 3 APL1's?

 

[Hanatsu]

Ok. Then I won't attempt to read it. One question, the other files... the .*DAT which can be opened in notepad. What different data do they represent, I assume that PR is power response.

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[Alextaastrup]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

Right, and PRS - power response smoothed on your own demand from 1/3 to 1 octave

 

[Raimonds]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

So is the APL3 discontinued? Or is it the same price as 3 APL1's?

APL3 is still available on order. It costs little bit more than 3 APL1 due to specific production.

 

[Hanatsu]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

Got a question how to load the VST plugin in foobar2000. Here's how:

 

[Jcharger13]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

I was the one that had troubles with the VST plugin. Thanks Han.

I figured out what was going on. I didn't have a VST plugin drop down in my components like Han does in the example above. I originally thought you just put the APL VST plugin into the component file of foobar but foobar wouldn't recognize the plugin. I finally figured out I needed a VST plugin just to be able to load the VST for APL that's called (Foobar 2000 VST 2.4 adapter). Now all is working well.

 

[CDT FAN]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

I was looking at the flat response curve and how it was able to remove the null. If a null is caused by certain frequencies cancelling each other out (I guess that is the opposite of a resonance frequency), then how does it adjust the level to counteract that?

 

[Hanatsu]

I was looking at the flat response curve and how it was able to remove the null. If a null is caused by certain frequencies cancelling each other out (I guess that is the opposite of a resonance frequency), then how does it adjust the level to counteract that?

It fixes areas which are minimum phase. So phase cancellations between drivers will not be much of an issue. Modal dips can't be EQed, but you can lower the adjacent frequencies to gain a 'flat' response. Doing it this way will cause a higher demand of power at the modal dip though. In my example there were major peaking at 100Hz and 50-60Hz which made it look worse than it was.

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[sqnut]

Re: Comprehensive Review: " APL1 " - Advanced DSP / EQ / Phase Correction Unit

Modal dips can't be EQed, but you can lower the adjacent frequencies to gain a 'flat' response......

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.....and since you're now attenuating a range, everything else will need to fit in with this range to keep tonal balance. Each null that one addresses means you're cutting across ranges.

On the power of eq......One doesn't need to 'treat' every null. Deep and narrow nulls are less of an issue. Shallower nulls spread over a 1/3 of an octave or more are a bigger issue specially in the mid range. More than the units ability to flatten out the response, I would value the L/R balance across 2000 odd points. A eq at 1/6 octave with nice slider controls for each channel/side (assuming you stack these units), would be the cherry on the cake. Of course 1/3 to 1/6 would be a two year learning curve