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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
im getting a new amp on monday the new kenwood excelon x1200m..cant wait >.<......anyways while im sure i can wait i HAVE to upgrade my subs next as there a PYLE of...lets leave that at that...

anyways i need some suggestion on subs, i want hard hitting subs but i want SQ for sure i can not stand muddy or fuzzy bass....its like eww...but again i want HARD hitting...

anyways id prefer to use my same box i have now ( i built it -.-) so for new subs they must be limited to 12" and the amp im getting is suposedly 1200rms cea rated..

as for budget id prefer not to go over 100-150 each but even thats getting a bit spendy for my blood....anyways suggest away ^.^
 

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Without more information on the size and type of box I think your question would be difficult to answer. My advice would be look in the classifieds section here and buy a used sub:) Best bang for you buck.

Once you find a couple that are in your price range use the search button and you will find a wealth of knowledge on how they sound, size and type of enclosure prefered, and etc.
 

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you might be surprised to find that the PYLE subs arent the reason your bass sounds like @#!%. what criteria did you use when designing the box?
Good advice. A box will make a cheap sub sound great or an expensive sub sound like crap. Is your box sealed, ported, bandpass? What is the volume and tuning frequency if ported.

Your current subs may be being asked to do more than they are able. What type of vehicle are you putting this in?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Good advice. A box will make a cheap sub sound great or an expensive sub sound like crap. Is your box sealed, ported, bandpass? What is the volume and tuning frequency if ported.

Your current subs may be being asked to do more than they are able. What type of vehicle are you putting this in?
sry for lack of responses guys...i was just wonderin about subs..as ill proly build a new box etc....iv been looking at some l7 barics..but im not sure yet...

anyways its a sealed box (i should re wire it with better 12 gauge and re seal everything...its siliconed but not 100% proly like 90-95%)

anyways...i wantded mdf...but my dad went and got high density particle board.....and since i only had the day to buil it i just used the wood....

my original specs were 36w 30D 15-16h...but i cut it down so im not entierly sure...i think its 36W 26-28D and 14-15H) so i know its like 1.9cu ft at least..its 2 chambered so its like 0.95cuft-1.03cuft per sub......and for those pyle thats WAY under what "optimal" specs would be.......

so in summary its HDP .95-1.03CuFt per sub

im planing on building som fiberglass boxes this summer (looking at kickers atm between soloclassics and the 12" L7 barics) im sure there is better off brands but idk any...

my AMP will be a 1200rms mono (kenwood excelon x1200m)

any other questions i will be glad to answer


edit: 1996 pontiac bonneville
 

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What model of Pyle subs are you currently running.

With 150 max budget I would think L7's are out unless used.

Particle board is not the end of the earth. I have seen boxes from DIY'ers out of OSB.

Dayton subs from parts express are a reasonable priced option.

ED subs are often on sale.

And brother, your dimensions show a minimum volume of over 6 cubic feet. Not 2 or less. That may be your main issue. To big of a box for those subs.

How old are you and what type of music do you play MOSTLY?

What vehicle is this going in?
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
What model of Pyle subs are you currently running.

With 150 max budget I would think L7's are out unless used.

Particle board is not the end of the earth. I have seen boxes from DIY'ers out of OSB.

Dayton subs from parts express are a reasonable priced option.

ED subs are often on sale.

And brother, your dimensions show a minimum volume of over 6 cubic feet. Not 2 or less. That may be your main issue. To big of a box for those subs.

How old are you and what type of music do you play MOSTLY?

What vehicle is this going in?

ok this is going to be diffiicult as far as i know...1Cuft box is 12in by 12in by 12in

a 6cuFt box would be 72in by 72 by 72in.......
my box is somw where around 28-30d 36W and 14-15h.....no where NEAR 3Cubic feet...

unless by 2Cuft they mean like a 1 x 1 x 2 box although acording to my calculations that would only be 1.26CuFT.....

anyways enlighten me to the above if im wrong ( to understand what im doing i supose you could think of me turning the box into a perfect square thus the 1 x 1 x 2 would give me the same as a perfect square box of 1.26ft x 1.26ft x 1.26ft. being a 1.26cubic foot box?)

as for the model of PYLE subs they are...PL1295BL....this is the sites page PL1295BL - 12'' 1200 Watt DVC Subwoofer Pyleaudio.com ::: Your source for Car Audio, Mobile Video, Neon Lighting

rated "1200" peak so im guessing 400ish rms

as for my budget that i supose can be tweaked..i found 2 L7 barics 12" 08 model 4ohm DVC for 416 NEW...abotu 208 a sub..on ebay...and thats a steal (i think)
edit: i said above lower portions a 1996 pontiac bonneville
 

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ok this is going to be diffiicult as far as i know...1Cuft box is 12in by 12in by 12in

a 6cuFt box would be 72in by 72 by 72in.......
your visualization is wrong - 1 cubic foot is 12 by 12 by 12 - then imagine to get two cubic foot you get a second box like that and place it next to the first one - so you would get 12 x 12 x 24 = 2 cubic foot - so according to your argument here 6 cubic foot is not 72 x 72 x72 - its actually 12 x 12 x 72 - thats if you placed 6 boxes all in a row - so to explain how you could manipulate that in a small way if for example you placed them in two rows of three boxes each you would get 12 x 24 x 36 etc, etc, etc - so at 15 x 28 x 36 you are actually bigger than 6 cubic foot - though it could be closer to 6 cubic foot if you begin to deduct the actual width of the board you use ie if those measurements are of the outer volume then deduct the width of the board for the calculation of the inner volume

its difficult for me to express myself in feet and inches though cos we work in cm's and metres here in my country but im sure you get the universal drift though and hopefully begin to get a clearer idea of how these things work

thats only explaining the concept though and maybe someone more clued up can explain the calculation methods for you
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 · (Edited)
your visualization is wrong - 1 cubic foot is 12 by 12 by 12 - then imagine to get two cubic foot you get a second box like that and place it next to the first one - so you would get 12 x 12 x 24 = 2 cubic foot - so according to your argument here 6 cubic foot is not 72 x 72 x72 - its actually 12 x 12 x 72 - thats if you placed 6 boxes all in a row - so to explain how you could manipulate that in a small way if for example you placed them in two rows of three boxes each you would get 12 x 24 x 36 etc, etc, etc - so at 15 x 28 x 36 you are actually bigger than 6 cubic foot - though it could be closer to 6 cubic foot if you begin to deduct the actual width of the board you use ie if those measurements are of the outer volume then deduct the width of the board for the calculation of the inner volume

its difficult for me to express myself in feet and inches though cos we work in cm's and metres here in my country but im sure you get the universal drift though and hopefully begin to get a clearer idea of how these things work

thats only explaining the concept though and maybe someone more clued up can explain the calculation methods for you

god...i cant belive i over looked that you are totaly right..god somthing so simple >.< so a 1ft by 1ft by 2ft is technicaly 2 cu ft since its 2 1cuft boxes....
so your right, going by that estimate im closer to 6.5ish and my thickness is 3/4 so a inch and a half.....

ok so i have to cut the box down........god -.- next time ill use building blocks ^.^........anyways any 1 have a sugestion on how big i should make it?...i would rather just cut the box down so if u can work with my curent measurments(36 width 26-30th deep 14-15ish height)...height cant change...width and depth can tho

edit: rember to avoid confusion this is 1 box with TWO chambers one driver for each...aka the box holds 2 drivers each seperate air space
 

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Damn, that's a big box.

Here's what I'd do. Of course I have no idea what kind of car you have, nor the EXACT dimensions of your box, but here's a quick estimate.

Two of these subs.

Parts Express:Dayton TIT320C-4 12" Titanic Mk III Subwoofer 4 Ohm

Then drill two 3" holes into each chamber and put an 18-24" tube of 3" PVC into the hole, thus porting the enclosure. Each tube needs to be the same length as all the others. Cover the inside of the box with some type of foam.

Either way, that gives you a VERY large vented box, which those Titanics do very well in. They'll handle what that amp can give.

If you really want to go crazy, and do it right, then two 4" pieces of PVC tubing at 36" each. Two per chamber. That would completely eliminate any port noise (i.e. huffing) at low frequencies.

With cabin gain, these things will crush your skull, and they'd sound good, given your car holds together.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 · (Edited)
EDIT: my car is a 1996 pontiac bonneiville

Damn, that's a big box.

Here's what I'd do. Of course I have no idea what kind of car you have, nor the EXACT dimensions of your box, but here's a quick estimate.

Two of these subs.

Parts Express:Dayton TIT320C-4 12" Titanic Mk III Subwoofer 4 Ohm

Then drill two 3" holes into each chamber and put an 18-24" tube of 3" PVC into the hole, thus porting the enclosure. Each tube needs to be the same length as all the others. Cover the inside of the box with some type of foam.

Either way, that gives you a VERY large vented box, which those Titanics do very well in. They'll handle what that amp can give.

If you really want to go crazy, and do it right, then two 4" pieces of PVC tubing at 36" each. Two per chamber. That would completely eliminate any port noise (i.e. huffing) at low frequencies.

With cabin gain, these things will crush your skull, and they'd sound good, given your car holds together.
ok from what i gather your telling me to drill TWO holes...ONE into each chamber?.....i assume at the back of the box...
and by 36 inches how much of the tubing actually goes into the box?...


...................now im light years away from the knowledge u probably have..but wouldnt it be worth the xtra $100 to go with the 2 barics( 2008 4ohm DVC solobaric L7..rated at 750rms)?...the titans being about 312..and the barics being 416?

i can see using the titans i would have excess power which can be a good thing using the barics i "could possibly" overdrive my amp..although i wouldnt let myself do that( i think)


edit: and i plan on making some fiberglass boxes htis summer to fit my trunk better...and i was goign to go sealed (with proper airspace)..i heard glass is a pain and hard to tune ports
 

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wHAT MODEL IS YOUR CURRENT SUBS?

EDIT: Just saw the model of your subs in the initial post.
 

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EDIT: my car is a 1996 pontiac bonneiville



ok from what i gather your telling me to drill TWO holes...ONE into each chamber?.....i assume at the back of the box...
and by 36 inches how much of the tubing actually goes into the box?...


...................now im light years away from the knowledge u probably have..but wouldnt it be worth the xtra $100 to go with the 2 barics( 2008 4ohm DVC solobaric L7..rated at 750rms)?...the titans being about 312..and the barics being 416?

i can see using the titans i would have excess power which can be a good thing using the barics i "could possibly" overdrive my amp..although i wouldnt let myself do that( i think)


edit: and i plan on making some fiberglass boxes htis summer to fit my trunk better...and i was goign to go sealed (with proper airspace)..i heard glass is a pain and hard to tune ports
Ok,

Where to start?... To port an enclosure, you take your given volume and you have an opening ( circle, rectangle, triangle etc) of a given area (square inch
es or whatever you normally measure in for you metric system people) And a specific length makes the port tuned to a certain frequency for a given volume. EX: A 1 cubic foot box tuned to 40 hertz has a circle port 3 inches ID 9.67 inches long. Same box with a slot port 1 inch by 7 inches to stay close to the same area as the 3 inch circle port is 9.55 inches for the same 40 hertz.

Small ports with speakers on large amounts of power can make whats called port noise. It is a kind of chuffing sound. In your trunk, you should be ok as well its in your trunk and port noise is generally not an issue. As MVM said, to do it right, a larger port would be ideal.

Subwoofers will NEVER overdrive your amp. You will be the one to overdrive your amp. with how loud you play your system and how much boost you ask of the amp. The power rating that the manufacturers give you are generally just guidelines for a specific box design. It's the overall system that has to be considered for power handling. The system being the subwoofer and enclosure together.

Again what type of music do you MOSTLY listen to? Rap? Hip hop? metal? SQ CD's?

What volume do you listen to your music set at? Are you looking to be noticed by people 3 blocks away? Or do you listen to music at levels you can talk to your friends over? That is important to know when trying to factor a design that YOU are happy with. Your current subs may work for you just fine in the right box unless you need to get some new ones to make a statement to your friends.
 

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EDIT: my car is a 1996 pontiac bonneiville



ok from what i gather your telling me to drill TWO holes...ONE into each chamber?.....i assume at the back of the box...
and by 36 inches how much of the tubing actually goes into the box?...


...................now im light years away from the knowledge u probably have..but wouldnt it be worth the xtra $100 to go with the 2 barics( 2008 4ohm DVC solobaric L7..rated at 750rms)?...the titans being about 312..and the barics being 416?

i can see using the titans i would have excess power which can be a good thing using the barics i "could possibly" overdrive my amp..although i wouldnt let myself do that( i think)


edit: and i plan on making some fiberglass boxes htis summer to fit my trunk better...and i was goign to go sealed (with proper airspace)..i heard glass is a pain and hard to tune ports
The Titanic is a better all around sub than the Solo Baric. The Solo Baric is is really designed for SPL applications. Low end extension just isn't the strong suit. For example a typical 12" SoloBaric install would have a mid 30's tuning, where the tuning for the Titanics are in the low 20's. Coupled with cabin gain, you get A LOT more bottom end from the Titanics than the Solo Barics. Will the Solo Barics get louder? That's a good question. I haven't seen a side by side. However, the Titanics get very loud. They're not your typical car audio subwoofer. In fact, they're not really designed for a car specifically. They have great low end extension, very good output, but with the sacrifice of a much large box volume needed.

If you do plan on going sealed later, the Titanic, again is a better solution, given you have the space to give them a lot of box volume. With cabin gain, the Titanics will still have better low end than the Solo's.

There is no reason to spend the extra $100.00 for a Solo Baric. If you were going for straight SPL, and had minimal volume to work with, then the Solo Baric would be a good choice. However, you have a lot of space to work with, thus you can build a large enough enclosure to take advantage of what the Titanic has to offer.

If you port your current box. Drill an appropriate diameter hole that lets the round PVC pipe fit snugly into it. Curve the PVC around as much as you need to get the 36" to fit inside the enclosure. Keep one end flush with the outside of the box. In other words, you should be able to run your hand over the face of the box and just feel a hole, not the edge of the PVC. Make sense? Don't know if I can explain it any simpler.

Then, MAKE SURE you set your gains appropriately. DO NOT use bass boost. In fact, don't even hook it up. Don't set it on your amp, or your head unit. That box will have those subs going full tilt. It will be LOUD, and it'll be loud UNDER 30 hz. A Solo Baric couldn't do that.

Sealed will give you a flatter response, and better overall sound quality. I still don't know what kind of music you listen to, but the Titanic is just a great solution for you. They're inexpensive, very high quality, and you can take advantage of them, because you have a trunk the size of the Atlantic Ocean.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 · (Edited)
The Titanic is a better all around sub than the Solo Baric. The Solo Baric is is really designed for SPL applications. Low end extension just isn't the strong suit. For example a typical 12" SoloBaric install would have a mid 30's tuning, where the tuning for the Titanics are in the low 20's. Coupled with cabin gain, you get A LOT more bottom end from the Titanics than the Solo Barics. Will the Solo Barics get louder? That's a good question. I haven't seen a side by side. However, the Titanics get very loud. They're not your typical car audio subwoofer. In fact, they're not really designed for a car specifically. They have great low end extension, very good output, but with the sacrifice of a much large box volume needed.

If you do plan on going sealed later, the Titanic, again is a better solution, given you have the space to give them a lot of box volume. With cabin gain, the Titanics will still have better low end than the Solo's.

There is no reason to spend the extra $100.00 for a Solo Baric. If you were going for straight SPL, and had minimal volume to work with, then the Solo Baric would be a good choice. However, you have a lot of space to work with, thus you can build a large enough enclosure to take advantage of what the Titanic has to offer.

If you port your current box. Drill an appropriate diameter hole that lets the round PVC pipe fit snugly into it. Curve the PVC around as much as you need to get the 36" to fit inside the enclosure. Keep one end flush with the outside of the box. In other words, you should be able to run your hand over the face of the box and just feel a hole, not the edge of the PVC. Make sense? Don't know if I can explain it any simpler.

Then, MAKE SURE you set your gains appropriately. DO NOT use bass boost. In fact, don't even hook it up. Don't set it on your amp, or your head unit. That box will have those subs going full tilt. It will be LOUD, and it'll be loud UNDER 30 hz. A Solo Baric couldn't do that.

Sealed will give you a flatter response, and better overall sound quality. I still don't know what kind of music you listen to, but the Titanic is just a great solution for you. They're inexpensive, very high quality, and you can take advantage of them, because you have a trunk the size of the Atlantic Ocean.
the music i listen to is located in my signature...basicaly rock/metal....but i do listen to all music except RAP....very very very rarly do i listen to rap and thats "if" i like the song which rarely happens.

i listen to my music at a decent to loud volume in the cabin...if i want to turn it up so u can hear it 3 blocks away its only when im seeing how loud can i really go..as well as show my friends but only for minimal amounts of time.

ok i guess ill take your word for it and try these subs...but before i make a full hearted comitment...when i do go fiberglass i plan on going sealed like above, about how much air space am i going to need? my trunk is HUGE.....but my seats dont fold down and when i make the fiber glass boxes im planing on putting them in the back of my trunk inside the wheel wells
so the subs are faraway from my back seats and in my wheel wells....but i have to combat the bars that my trunk swings on so i was going to build them similair to audi intergrations "perfect fit" designs..thus i may not be able to get all the air space i need and wont know till i start building.....

after i get my mold done i plan on measuring and tweaking my air space with packing peanuts...buy 1-2CuFT and poor them in..ill do this before i put resin over w/e fabric material ill be using to form the shape

so in summary to my endless blabing....
when i go sealed about how much air space am i going to need?(note problems above)
i listen to rock/metal 80-90% of the time
i listen at a reasonablie level to avoid NIHL(noise induced hearing loss) but do ocasionly show off again to a reasonabl level
when i make my sealed boxes they will be in the rear of my trunk and my seats DO NOT fold down

and finaly
some one mentioned i should foam my box...with what exactly? how thick?
by bending the pvc i assume u mean using elbows?if not that might be a good thing to know since i have never ported a box (i would be putting a total of 4 pieces of pvc 36" long in the box, 2 in ea chamber?
 

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the music i listen to is located in my signature...basicaly rock/metal....but i do listen to all music except RAP....very very very rarly do i listen to rap and thats "if" i like the song which rarely happens.

i listen to my music at a decent to loud volume in the cabin...if i want to turn it up so u can hear it 3 blocks away its only when im seeing how loud can i really go..as well as show my friends but only for minimal amounts of time.

ok i guess ill take your word for it and try these subs...but before i make a full hearted comitment...when i do go fiberglass i plan on going sealed like above, about how much air space am i going to need? my trunk is HUGE.....but my seats dont fold down and when i make the fiber glass boxes im planing on putting them in the back of my trunk inside the wheel wells
so the subs are faraway from my back seats and in my wheel wells....but i have to combat the bars that my trunk swings on so i was going to build them similair to audi intergrations "perfect fit" designs..thus i may not be able to get all the air space i need and wont know till i start building.....

after i get my mold done i plan on measuring and tweaking my air space with packing peanuts...buy 1-2CuFT and poor them in..ill do this before i put resin over w/e fabric material ill be using to form the shape

so in summary to my endless blabing....
when i go sealed about how much air space am i going to need?(note problems above)
i listen to rock/metal 80-90% of the time
i listen at a reasonablie level to avoid NIHL(noise induced hearing loss) but do ocasionly show off again to a reasonabl level
when i make my sealed boxes they will be in the rear of my trunk and my seats DO NOT fold down

and finaly
some one mentioned i should foam my box...with what exactly? how thick?
by bending the pvc i assume u mean using elbows?if not that might be a good thing to know since i have never ported a box (i would be putting a total of 4 pieces of pvc 36" long in the box, 2 in ea chamber?
Yeah, I meant use 90 deg bends. You could also shorten the port length to no less than 27" per port. Between 30-36" is good though.

The biggest you'd want to go is about 1.25 cubic feet PER sub sealed. So, a total volume of 2.5 cubes for two subs. You can go bigger but you start to run into over excursion around 25 hz if you have your amp at full bore. Not a huge deal, and something a subsonic filter can easily rectify. In fact, if you want a bit more low end, you can raise the box volume and apply a subsonic around 30 hz. A box volume of around 3.5 cubes for both subs could be done this way. That will give you GREAT low end down to 30 hz with a roll off below that. You'll be hard pressed to find music that really has content below 30 hz anyway.

A lot of ways you could do this.
 

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If you Google "sub box calculator" there are many free utilities out there that you can use to get the exact box volume.
 

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Rockford Fosgate has one on their site that is pretty helpful.
Rockford Fosgate® - Woofer BoxWizard


After modeling the L7 I see why it is so popular in the SPL lanes. It peaks early but is significantly efficient. if you ran an L7, Tuned @40 you would get in car response pretty much flat from 80-30 with a 90db+ efficiency at the headrest. This takes into account the roll off and the cabin gain.

The titanic runs flat to like 25 tuned @like 22 or 27. Can't remember but at much reduced efficiency. The nice thing is that it runs flat out of the car. In car with cabin gain the lows below 50 hertz will start to rise fast. It will definitely pound out the low end.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
ok so just to make sure everything is right and we got a good understanding i went and measured my box exactly here are the EXACT dimentions i was a lil off and i dont think i mention my front end is sloped so my dementions are

D1 (top)=18.5"
D2(bottom)=24"
height= 14.5"
width=36"
slope(front of box) 15.5"

looks like this from the side


assuming its important i need to know what foam to put inside box.....
and from what i gathered before i need 4 pieces of 36" pvc 2 in each chamber of the box making 4 holes....(i assume opposite ends of the chamber on the back sides)

so i gave exact measurments to make sure once i port, i cant go back and i should be able to port it wensday or thursday
 

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ok so just to make sure everything is right and we got a good understanding i went and measured my box exactly here are the EXACT dimentions i was a lil off and i dont think i mention my front end is sloped so my dementions are

D1 (top)=18.5"
D2(bottom)=24"
height= 14.5"
width=36"
slope(front of box) 15.5"

looks like this from the side


assuming its important i need to know what foam to put inside box.....
and from what i gathered before i need 4 pieces of 36" pvc 2 in each chamber of the box making 4 holes....(i assume opposite ends of the chamber on the back sides)

so i gave exact measurments to make sure once i port, i cant go back and i should be able to port it wensday or thursday
Ok, after figuring what you have and figuring that you have it divided with a 3/4" thick piece of material, I see you have a total internal volume of 4.95 cubic feet. So you have 2 chambers of 2.475 cu/ft each. figure after displacement you have 2.375 cubic feet.
 
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