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heya!

From my sparse understanding midbass can play a bit lower than midrange. So can a midbass replace a midrange?
I've been following some of the sale threads for the AD W800NEOs and have become curious about them.

Would the midbass be part of a 3-way component? Would it work in a 2-way?
In my case, would a W800 be a straight up replacement for a GS60? I mean sure, might need to tweak gains and crossovers, but would it be fine as a replacement or would i lose out on high end?

Thanks in advance for your input and time,

-B
 

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heya!

From my sparse understanding midbass can play a bit lower than midrange. So can a midbass replace a midrange?
I've been following some of the sale threads for the AD W800NEOs and have become curious about them.

Would the midbass be part of a 3-way component? Would it work in a 2-way?
In my case, would a W800 be a straight up replacement for a GS60? I mean sure, might need to tweak gains and crossovers, but would it be fine as a replacement or would i lose out on high end?

Thanks in advance for your input and time,

-B
The W800's fall off too soon on the top end for use in a two way system, most two way systems use a maximum size of 6 1/2 inches because 6 1/2's start beaming around 2700 hz which is just above the lower limit of most tweeters. There is a review (with Klippel testing) of the W800's here Audio Development W800NEO Drive Unit Review
 

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heya!

From my sparse understanding midbass can play a bit lower than midrange. So can a midbass replace a midrange?
I've been following some of the sale threads for the AD W800NEOs and have become curious about them.

Would the midbass be part of a 3-way component? Would it work in a 2-way?
In my case, would a W800 be a straight up replacement for a GS60? I mean sure, might need to tweak gains and crossovers, but would it be fine as a replacement or would i lose out on high end?

Thanks in advance for your input and time,

-B
I believe Audiofrog is selling or is going to sell some 8" midbasses.
 

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This gets into a 2-way vs 3-way discussion, which is to say tweeter/midrange vs tweeter/midrange/midbass. Technically you'd want the fewest number of speakers to reproduce the range so 2-way would be great and is often used in home bookshelf speakers. The problem is that with a home bookshelf, you'd usually have more control of the placement. With the car, placement becomes difficult and this is where a 3-way starts to look a little better for a vehicle.

In a 2-way, the midrange is usually down in the bottom of the door. And a tweeter is normally not next to the midrange so you get separation. Then you have beaming issues where a 6.5" starts beaming if it plays too high, which means it starts to become directional vs it being omni-directional at lower frequencies. And you have to go with a larger tweeter (larger than 1") to get a tweeter that can play low enough to meet a 6.5". Essentially, it is difficult to get a tweeter and midrange to work well in a 2-way. Even components sold as a set usually don't cover the full frequency range well enough to mitigate the problems just discussed.

And this is where a 3-way comes in. You bring a 2.5-3.5 midrange into the mix, usually up high next to the tweeter and then that makes everything work better because the tweeter doesn't have to play too low and the midrange doesn't need to play too high. Then you can buy a dedicated 6.5/8/10 midbass and don't have to worry about it playing very high.

But realize even with a strong midbass, the car acoustics, specifically the width of the car, causes problems with the midbass frequency range that you often have to use a subwoofer to play higher to help address midbass issues. ErinH covers that in his video.
 

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A nice PA 8" like the B&C 8ndl44, Beyma 8g40 or Stevens MB8 can play up to 2k pretty comfortably/omnidirectionally and still go low enough, 75-80, for the sub to integrate well. Most standard 8" midbasses won't do well past the lower midrange area.

At that point you'd need a tweet with an FS around 800 so it was comfortable playing down to the 2k crossover. Something like the SB Acoustics SB29RDNC would do, low fs, good sensitivity.
I'm going to disagree. An 8" speaker will start to have problems with beaming around 1.7khz, pushing it higher than that would not be ideal. At 1.7khz it is no longer omnidirectional, even before 1.7khz it will stop being omnidirectional. It won't be the end of the world to stretch the response up to about 2khz, but that's really pushing it, especially considering how sensitive our hearing is in that frequency range. Being a PA speaker doesn't change the physics of beaming, the cone diameter dictates the beaming frequency, not the type of speaker.
 

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I'm going to disagree. An 8" speaker will start to have problems with beaming around 1.7khz, pushing it higher than that would not be ideal. At 1.7khz it is no longer omnidirectional, even before 1.7khz it will stop being omnidirectional. It won't be the end of the world to stretch the response up to about 2khz, but that's really pushing it, especially considering how sensitive our hearing is in that frequency range. Being a PA speaker doesn't change the physics of beaming, the cone diameter dictates the beaming frequency, not the type of speaker.
This was my understanding of use a 8 inch in a 2 way. You cant get around beaming issue. The only way around this would be to use a full range/wide band or a tweeter with the capability to play low enough so you dont have the issue. I would assume a really nice wide band playing on axis could be the answer
 

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This was my understanding of use a 8 inch in a 2 way. You cant get around beaming issue. The only way around this would be to use a full range/wide band or a tweeter with the capability to play low enough so you dont have the issue. I would assume a really nice wide band playing on axis could be the answer
Or, place the 8" directly on axis, which is not easy to do in a car. Hell, even putting a 5 1/4" directly on axis in a car is a challenge, unless you want giant bulky pods ruining visibility on the dash, or have tons of room on the floor to build kicks.
 

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There are a couple of charts out there in regards to beaming, but I find this one to be the most useful.

The line graph references the middle left drawing. At this frequency you're already seeing -3 to -5dB on the driver side speaker in a car door install.


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A nice PA 8" like the B&C 8ndl44, Beyma 8g40 or Stevens MB8 can play up to 2k pretty comfortably/omnidirectionally.
They cannot play omnidirectionally up to 2k. An 8" diaphragm will start off axis roll off at a hair below 500hz.

8" has a wavelength of about 1700hz. Off axis roll of STARTS at quarter wavelength the diameter of the cone, which is about 425hz for an 8" diaphragm

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I strike my omnidirectionally comment, an 8 beams at 2100. Sure it starts falling off before that, just like like all drivers do.

It can still be played off axis up to 1700. Will the FR look perfect, no but thats the fun of audio in a car, nothing looks perfect because a car is a hell of a place for a stereo.

At least with the sensitivity of a PA driver, its loud enough usually to be more cutting than bumping. And the speakers I had mentioned are capable of midbass AND midrange, the AD 8s are more for midbass and severely lack midrange even on axis.
 
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