[Stumbo]

Greetings! Long time reader, first time poster!

The time has come for the next step in my little project. I am currently running a 2 way setup in my silverado (diy peerless) with 225 watts RMS per channel. Ive been running it for a couple months with no sub and I do enjoy it, however I am ready for more, deeper bass from my setup.

Im having a hard time deciding between the high output and high fidelity version of the Dayton Reference 12" sub. I am planning on running two through my HiFonics BX1500D (1000watts RMS).

I cant decide between two sealed HF woofers, or two ported HO woofers. It is a single cab, so I do not have too much room to work with, my last sub was a 12" nakamichi in a ported 2.75" enclosure, and i had no problems making that fit.

Im mostly wondering if there is really that much SQ difference between the HO and HF woofer. This is my daily driver, i dont compete, and I just like good, clean sound. Ive read a couple people say that the HO is the way to go in a car setup due to small enclosure requirements. I am currently leaning that way.

BTW, what size enclosures/ports would you guys reccomend for these subs in a daily driver sq setup? Or is the Dayton sub my best option for the price range? (~$250 that can handel 1000watts rms)

Any input would be greatly appriciated!

 

[MiniVanMan]

Well the HO prefers a ported enclosure. About 2 cubes per sub, tuned to about 26 hz. The HF prefers a LARGE sealed box. Again about 2 cubes per sub. So, either way you're looking at 4 cubes. Ported will obviously be bigger because of port volume.

Also 2 subs will only yield a 2 ohm load. That being said, go with the HF. It'll match up with your amp better.

 

[AzGrower]

Nice to have you on board. Since you own a Chevy, I have to be a postwhore here and add in a plug for another one of my favorite forums... Fullsizechevy.com
there are a few others on here who are members there, in fact thats how I came to find this "golden nest egg".

 

[racerraul]

I would have thought the HO would work in small sealed as well... heck the latest PE flyer has The Drake project in it using a 12" in less than .7 IIRC...

 

[newtitan]

yeah I winisd'd the 12mm xmax verison and it said only .75 cu ft sealed

 

[Stumbo]

Thanks for the input guys!

MiniVanMan; My amp is 1000 watts at 2 ohms, and 1500 at 1 .

AzGrower; I am a member over there as well, great forum. I have a SCSB 99 Z71

Ive almost made up my mind to go with a pair of ported HOs, however, im tempted to buy a 3rd ho and run all three in a sealed enclosure, allowing me to run a lower ohm load for more total power, and tune them a bit lower.

Im torn!

 

[Stumbo]

BTW, I dont really have a HU, Im running an Ipod through a pioneer deq9200.

Dont ask.

 

[AzGrower]

Just a thought, if you are willing to go to some 10s, the TC2 subs are going for $99 each, there is a thread already started about where you can buy them.

 

[Stumbo]

Im not too sure the tc2s would work well for me, they seem awsome but with 2 of them i would have 1600 watts going to the pair, I would end up destroyting them

 

[Stumbo]

OK, by looking at the specs on the drivers, here is what I really want to know...

Does the HF compromise a lot of SPL for the increased sound quality...

OR

Does the HO compromise a lot of quality for the increased SPL...

or is a pretty even trade?

 

[racerraul]

If you are concerned with SPL maybe you are looking at the wrong drivers for the job... I have no doubt they will be loud... How loud is loud enough for you, needs to be specified by a number in db's...

130-135db's is plenty of output for me... & I have no reason to believe they wont get close to that number with ease... I currently have a single 12" Diamond in the 126-130 range so I expect the Dual Dayton 12" to be louder with less effort.

 

[DS-21]

OK, by looking at the specs on the drivers, here is what I really want to know...

Does the HF compromise a lot of SPL for the increased sound quality...

OR

Does the HO compromise a lot of quality for the increased SPL...

or is a pretty even trade?

Actually, neither. IMO, the names of these woofers are misnomers. The "High Fidelity" ones will get louder than the "High Output" ones, period. They have a longer throw, hence greater volume displacement, ergo higher SPLmax. However, in a car I'd go with the HO one, simply because it's less efficient, i.e. it requires a smaller box for a given value of Qtc. Ignore the fact that both are rated at 87dB/w/m; efficiency in the bass is almost entirely determined by box size, and a woofer's midband sensitivity has nothing to do with it.

 

[Stumbo]

Would you say that the HO sacrifices a good deal of quality for it?

Ive never had a delima like this. I actually just put in my order with partsexpress for a pair of HO woofers, however its not too late to change.

eek.

 

[DS-21]

Having never played with either, I can't answer that. However, I doubt it. Both have copper Faraday rings in the motor and low Le. My hunch is that you'll be very very happy with the HO.

 

[Stumbo]

I think i will be too. Its hard to drop a few hundred bucks on somthing that I may not really like, ya know?

 

[Jim85IROC]

I doubt that the HO sacrifices quality. It uses a heavier cone to make it work better in a smaller enclosure and I believe it uses a 4 layer voice coil instead of a 2 layer to increase power handling, since it would need additional power to reach xmax in a smaller box.

I've plotted both, and personally for sealed applications I prefer the plot of the HF units. They need a somewhat bigger box, but have a much lower F3.

 

[DS-21]

I've plotted both, and personally for sealed applications I prefer the plot of the HF units. They need a somewhat bigger box, but have a much lower F3.

In car, I don't think that's an advantage. IMO there's something to be said for matching the transfer function of your enclosure to the transfer function of your cabin. That means, if cabin gain starts at 70Hz or so, your sub should start rolling off at that point!

In practice, my favorite-sounding car sub installs have used Peerless XLS12's or similar in low-Q sealed enclosures with anechoic F3's in the 60 or 70 Hz range. That provides outstanding balance through the crossover range, where most cars have jacked up response to "hit hard". Also, the shallow roll-off of the low-Q alignment usually (depends on placement, etc.) provides a decent in situ extreme LF boost, making the overall soundfield a little bit fatter and providing a useful degree of compensation for LF road noise.

'Course, I'm only talking about the kinds of cars and hatchbacks that civilized people would consider driving, not megatrucks or SUVs with cabins the size of some Toyko flats.

 

[Stumbo]

I have no idea what you just said DS, but i totally agree!

 

[JWSewell]

Hey there everyone! I too am a lurker, been reading up all I can about all yall' have posted. I get lost in alot of yalls' tech. momo jumbo! LOL!

Anyway.......

This is for Stumbo and everyone elses benifit.......

A Hifonics BX1500D will not do 1000W rms at 2 ohms nominal, period.
You would be lucky to see 450W rms from that amp @ 2 ohms.

Loyd, (bigbassman), A very well respected and trusted memeber from splbassx.com tested this exact amp and was only able to get 931W rms @ 1 ohm nominal w/ I belive was 12V applied.

Now before everyone thinks I am bashing Hifonics newer line of amps please know....

I used to have a BX1500D running a pair of Dayton DVC 15's in 12 FT3 net tuned to 21Hz.
The amp was running at 2 ohms nominal, I would guess around 450W rms.

I also ran the same exact amp at 1 ohm nominal on a pair of Kenwood Db+ 10's.

I never had a problem w/ this amp and it was still working when I sold it.
I still have a Hifonics ZX6000 running a set of CDT audio CL-61a's



Sorry to go off topic, but I felt it was important to address the inflated output claims of the Hifonics Brutus line.