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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I currently have pionner 51-0t amp, and I blew up my type r sub =( no clue how, so im currently looking for a sub like a type r but a little cheaper. Any help? Thanks
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Im looking for a 12 inch sub. Enclosure hmm I bought the box from crutchfield I want to put it back in the same box I had my type r. Thanks guys I aprreciate it
 

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Not sure if feeding a 1500 watt sub with his 125wpc amp is gonna be the best bet though. It didn't seem to work out real well with his last one. ;)
He didn't blow up his sub sending it too little power. He may have burnt it sending it a clipped signal though (trying to wring too much power out of the amp).
 

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Not sure if feeding a 1500 watt sub with his 125wpc amp is gonna be the best bet though. It didn't seem to work out real well with his last one. ;)
You don't feed a sub into an amp, it's the other way around. Besides, the Type-Rs are really only about 300 Watt subs.

He didn't blow up his sub sending it too little power. He may have burnt it sending it a clipped signal though (trying to wring too much power out of the amp).
No he didn't. Might want to do some searching on clipping. Clipping does NOT hurt speakers.
 

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No he didn't. Might want to do some searching on clipping. Clipping does NOT hurt speakers.
Too Little Power Blowing Speakers

This from bcae seems to suggest that clipping (or driving in a square sine wave) CAN hurt speakers if they're rated for the same power-handling as the amp is capable of producing cleanly.

"If your speakers are rated for the same power handling as your amplifier is capable of producing cleanly, driving them with a square wave signal for extended periods of time will likely cause speaker damage."

That doesn't apply here, but it does seem to suggest that clipping can hurt speakers in rare circumstances, doesn't it? That page confuses me since the first sentence would seem to agree with quality_sound but the last sentence kinda softens his position a little. Or it could be that I'm not understanding fully.
 

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Simply, BCAE is WRONG. During normal operation, only two things will EVER hurt a speaker. Exceeding its thermal limits and exceeding its mechanical limits. If, and only if, the clipping sends more power to the driver than it can handle it'll be damaged.

Basically, clipping itself is fine. One of the by products of clipping can damage speakers. But that's no different than simply turning up the volume when using a larger amp.
 

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Simply, BCAE is WRONG. During normal operation, only two things will EVER hurt a speaker. Exceeding its thermal limits and exceeding its mechanical limits. If, and only if, the clipping sends more power to the driver than it can handle it'll be damaged.

Basically, clipping itself is fine. One of the by products of clipping can damage speakers. But that's no different than simply turning up the volume when using a larger amp.
BCAE seems to agree with you. He indicates that under powering a sub with a clipped signal may lead to exceeding the thermal limits as "... the power is double but the cooling of the voice coil will not increase in proportion with the power increase (since the voice coil isn't moving as much as it needs to be for the given power dissipation). This will lead to the voice coil overheating."

Quality, do you know if this is true?

Sorry to hijack the thread.
 

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I think you we are arguing semantics. Does clipping hurt a speaker?? The answer is NO! Can clipping cause a speaker to perform in such a way that exceeds its thermal limits? YES!!
 

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Not sure if feeding a 1500 watt sub with his 125wpc amp is gonna be the best bet though. It didn't seem to work out real well with his last one. ;)
BCAE seems to agree with you. He indicates that under powering a sub with a clipped signal may lead to exceeding the thermal limits as "... the power is double but the cooling of the voice coil will not increase in proportion with the power increase (since the voice coil isn't moving as much as it needs to be for the given power dissipation). This will lead to the voice coil overheating."

Quality, do you know if this is true?

Sorry to hijack the thread.
There is no DC component to a clipped waveform also, the weight of the cone and the compliance of the suspension prevent it from stopping at the top or bottom of the wave. It cools exactly the same clipped as is does unclipped.

Try this, take a 100 Watt amp, hell, even a 500 Watt amp, feed it into a 13W7 and clip the holy piss out of it and see if the sub has any problems. It won't because you're not exceeding the sub's limits, even though you're clipping it like mad.

I think you we are arguing semantics. Does clipping hurt a speaker?? The answer is NO! Can clipping cause a speaker to perform in such a way that exceeds its thermal limits? YES!!
So will turning up the volume. What's your point?
 

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There is no DC component to a clipped waveform also, the weight of the cone and the compliance of the suspension prevent it from stopping at the top or bottom of the wave. It cools exactly the same clipped as is does unclipped.

Try this, take a 100 Watt amp, hell, even a 500 Watt amp, feed it into a 13W7 and clip the holy piss out of it and see if the sub has any problems. It won't because you're not exceeding the sub's limits, even though you're clipping it like mad.



So will turning up the volume. What's your point?
Ahh come on, you know exactly what I and the others mean. You are correct that if you drive a clipped 500 watt amp to a 13W7 it will not exceed its limits. However, take that same clipped 500 watt amp to a sub rated at 500 watts for an extended length of time its thermal limits could be reached.
 

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Simply, BCAE is WRONG. During normal operation, only two things will EVER hurt a speaker. Exceeding its thermal limits and exceeding its mechanical limits. If, and only if, the clipping sends more power to the driver than it can handle it'll be damaged.

Basically, clipping itself is fine. One of the by products of clipping can damage speakers. But that's no different than simply turning up the volume when using a larger amp.
The pictures explain it beautifully, even if you can't understand them :p

Perry is Right as Rain :)

quote>
At points a, b, d, e, f and h the voltage is changing causing the voice coil to move in the gap and therefore pull in fresh cool air. At points c and g, the voice coil may still be moving a little due to momentum but may not be moving enough to cool properly. Remember that during the clipped portion of the waveform current is still flowing through the voice coil. Since the displacement of the voice coil (and therefore the airflow around the voice coil) is no longer proportional to the heat being generated, the voice coil can overheat. This excess heat may cause the voice coil former to be physically distorted and/or melt the insulation off of the voice coil wire and/or cause the adhesives to fail
Quote>

Definately , the recipe for aroma of voice coil ^^^^^^^^:cool:
 

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Ahh come on, you know exactly what I and the others mean. You are correct that if you drive a clipped 500 watt amp to a 13W7 it will not exceed its limits. However, take that same clipped 500 watt amp to a sub rated at 500 watts for an extended length of time its thermal limits could be reached.

Exactly. It's not the clipping that's hurting anything. it's power, plain and simple. How we get that power doesn't matter or you'd have to say simply that amps blow speakers. It's the same argument.
 

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The pictures explain it beautifully, even if you can't understand them :p

Perry is Right as Rain :)

quote>
At points a, b, d, e, f and h the voltage is changing causing the voice coil to move in the gap and therefore pull in fresh cool air. At points c and g, the voice coil may still be moving a little due to momentum but may not be moving enough to cool properly. Remember that during the clipped portion of the waveform current is still flowing through the voice coil. Since the displacement of the voice coil (and therefore the airflow around the voice coil) is no longer proportional to the heat being generated, the voice coil can overheat. This excess heat may cause the voice coil former to be physically distorted and/or melt the insulation off of the voice coil wire and/or cause the adhesives to fail
Quote>

Definately , the recipe for aroma of voice coil ^^^^^^^^:cool:
Obviously he's never observed a subwoofer in operation.
 
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