Absolutely. I run BG Neo3 tweets. They are efficient and usually require just a few watts to scream. I've also used some much less efficient tweets and they still only required 10 - 20 watts, give or take, depending on listening habits. You shouldn't have any trouble using the HU to power your tweets.

 

Thanks. I'm still debating which amp to purchase and this helps. I'm looking for a single amp solution power everything and have been torn between the Memphis MCA-5004 and the Baby Belle. I want the extra power of the 5004, but want to still be able to attempt an active set-up. If I can power the tweets with the head unit, I should be in good shape...

 

at least 500RMS each!


j/k I plan on running 50+ RMS to my Hiquphons someday. Already got the amp and just need the tweets...

 

at least 500RMS each! ...

I wouldn't want to ride with you.

 

I'm sure they'll run off the HU, but I feel better knowing I have an amp on mine.

 

This topic seems pretty debateable, so I ordered the Baby Belle, just to be sure I have enough for the tweets... Now I can only hope that it has enough power for the mids! Decisions, decisions...

 

if all else fails you can get the mca150 for the tweets later and bridge the belle to the mids. that said i'm sending around 60rms to each of my lotus tweets and it's almost not enough.

 

I like headroom .. but tweets really do not need a lot of power to get loud. I have 2 extremes between my 2 cars right now ... 30w to the tweets in the vette and 165w to the tweets in the truck At some point if the truck ends up a 3 way I will find another small 30-50w amp to run them on and put the 165w on the mids and midbass.

I am not a fan of the HU power thing simply because so few of those watts are "clean" watts ..especially when you get up in the db's. 14w on a tweet works for many people and that is roughly the useable watt total you get from a HU amp in my experience. I think you have to consider the crossover point a little as well as if you are trying to play 2k-20k out of a tweet the 14w might not get it done very well.

 

I run a set off my headunit. and I have a set amped. You can usually get tweets pretty loud from headunit power.

 

There's a lot of confusion with this issue, because most people have difficulty distinguishing between average power and power requirements for transients. When you decide on the size of an amplifier, you're not concerned with the average power that the speaker will dissipate. You're concerned with the peaks. Yes, it's true that a sensitive tweeter mounted in close proximity will probably use single-digit watts (average power) even at loud volumes, but the transients will require several dB more.

Most people take this into consideration when deciding what amplifiers to use on the midbass drivers. How come no one ever thinks of it when they're looking to power their tweeters? Is there a (mistaken) assumption out there that high frequencies in music don't have a transient nature?

With so much emphasis placed on harmonic distortion, it's surprising to me that people love to use small amps. It's very easy to clip a speaker, and when you do, you're introducing much more distortion than the inherent harmonic distortion attributes of the speaker.

Anyway, the answer to the question requires knowing the sensitivity of the tweeter, where it's going to be mounted in relation to the listener, the xover parameters, and the listening habits of the listener. For most applications, I would recommend more than the ~20w coming from most head units.

 

With so much emphasis placed on harmonic distortion, it's surprising to me that people love to use small amps. It's very easy to clip a speaker, and when you do, you're introducing much more distortion than the inherent harmonic distortion attributes of the speaker.

I hate small amps. I have a 600 watt mono sub amp and 100x4 amp on my mids and tweeters for a total of 1000 watts, and there are times I wish I had twice that much power.

 

Its interesting to see the different opinions on this subject, and many others. Everything from running the tweeters off a head unit to someone who planned on running them off a 400 watt x 2 at 4 ohm amp.

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15663

 

I ran a bridged 4150XXK to mine, but it was passive so that soaked some of it up.

 

Some of us have small cars and/or electrical systems. Also, isn't it true that higher frequencies require less power?

 

Sure, I still wouldn't run a tweeter on a 15 watt amp though.

 

This has been pretty interesting, to say the least... I'm half tempted to start another thread... How much power does a mid really need?

 

Do one for midbass also

 

Yeah, I'm a weirdo, in my Jeep, I run my MB Quarts and Focal tweeters through a passive crossover with my PPI A600.2, then I use my PPI A200 to power my 2 JL Audio 10" subs.

What I had found was that running the system using conventional wisdom, the A600.2 on the subs and A200 on the mids and tweeters was that I wasn't using anywhere near the A600's potential because it's a fairly balanced SQ oriented setup.

Now, when I switched amps and used the much more powerful A600.2 on the mids and tweeters was the system had so much more dynamics and got considerably louder, yet the subs with the smaller A200 seemed to be as loud as they where before, obviously that's because the A600.2 was just loafing along.

Lesson here:
Never underestimate the importance of high power to your mids and tweeters, and that subs can get quite loud with relatively low power.

 

AMEN BRUTHA! as Patrick Bateman has pointed out, the cabin-gain in the sub freqs make those easy, especially from a large, properly-enclosed sub driver. It's the midbasses which are frequently only around 6.5" that have to take over from the 10-12" sub right around 100hz where cabin-gain starts to drop off... This is exacerbated by typically poor midbass enclosures due to space constraints up front in a car.

I have a 'mere' 300W to my 12" sub, 600W to a quad of 6.5" midbasses, and 150W to a pair of tweeters, and I don't listen to my music very loud. My SBAcoustic tweets can handle a fair amount of power (something like 45watts or so), but my biggest reason for the tweeter power overkill? I don't want *any* chance they'll receive a clipped signal as that is the most likely way they will get damaged...

 

Resurrecting this thread from the dead because of the "search".....

I am toying with the idea of using the MS-8 internal amplifier to power the two tweeters when I start my build. This would allow me to free up two channels of an amplifier and I could get away with a single 5 channel amp for a 3-way active + sub. Maybe a JL HD900/5 or something...

Any thoughts or experience with 20 watts to some nice tweeters?

 

Andy from JBL has recommended against this. Since the MS8 will attempt to level match the front speakers to the same relative output, you may end up sacrificing overall output as it brings the midrange/midbass down to match the output of the tweeters. This can be further compounded if, in doing this attenuation and the equalization, the MS8 runs out of cut in a specific frequency range.

Have you considered using a passive xover between the midrange and tweeter as an alternate solution?

 

I missed that note considering i've read many pages of that thread. I have thought about doing the passive crossover for the mids/tweets which was recommended on that thread in order to have the rearfill accounted for in two of the 8 channels.
i'll have to reattack my build plans. Thanks!

 

Any time. For reference, I am using a JL 450/4 for my front 2 way, and running the rear off the MS8 amp. After a bit of testing, I found it to work well thus far. I am probably going to add another JL 300/4 eventually do handle center channel duty. The crossover on the amp will allow me to do this without using 2 outputs on the MS8.

 

Would work if the crossover point is high enough.

 

FWIW I run my tweets of the 25W/Ch section of a Jay eL 500/5 and they NEVER EVER show signs of under powering, not even when being stupid.

I suspect the MS8 channels will be more than enough.

If I had a MS8 I'd do exactly the same and add a big 4 channel for the mid/bass and bridged to the sub on 2 other channels.

Golden.

 

If I had a MS8 I'd do exactly the same and add a big 4 channel for the mid/bass and bridged to the sub on 2 other channels.

Golden.

I think I might go ahead and try this. If it does not work out, then I'll have to buy a small 2 channel. Otherwise, it might be a win to tap into that power without buying additional equipment.

 

All depends on the crossover point. If I had to guess, even a small tweak from 4kHz down to 2.5kHz is probably on the order of doubling the power for a lot of music.

 

even then, 25W on a sensitive tweet, even moderately sensitive will JUST rip.

Example, my PA, big fuggin horns with JBL2445's bolted to them granted. A 225W/Ch amp at 8 ohms, driving 16 ohm horns. AT EAR BLEEDING LEVELS crossed at 1.2K... It occasionally illuminates the signal present indicator on the amp fully

 

even then, 25W on a sensitive tweet, even moderately sensitive will JUST rip.

And you probably don't hear the clipping when you're doing it. The one percenters won't approve.

 

I'm running my 4inch mids & tweeters with 75 watts. I've run these tweeters with 75 watts by themselves I just turn the amp down.

 

Re-read my post about average power vs. peaks. When determining amplifier sizes, we care about peaks, not average. Tweeters most certainly will see peaks in the neighborhood of (or in excess of) 25w.

 

I don't know of any reason to believe high frequency peaks tend to be proportionally any higher (relative to average power) than low frequency ones. In fact I suspect the opposite is true because people do not find loud high frequency sounds to be very pleasant. In addition, tweeters tend to be at least as efficient as midbasses and often much more efficient.

 

Is there a rough 'Rule of thumb' for the distribution of power over the spectrum ?

Kinda like this poor hypothetical example that I whipped up just now.....?

Does anything like this or any reference material such as this exist for real, something easy to understand for dummies, rather than formulas and such ?.....lol