How to find amp setting for my midbasses?

2241 Views 31 Replies 15 Participants Last post by falkenbd, Apr 25, 2009

tspence73

Discussion Starter · Apr 23, 2009

Okay,

I know there is a rating for RMS and peak wattage on my ZR800's, but I would like to know what the peak wattage would be to drive my ZR800's to their xmax if my highpass is at 50Hz @ 18db/octave.

A little help from you brainiacs would be cool.

1 - 20 of 32 Posts

ErinH

· #2 · Apr 23, 2009

have you tried winISD or the like to get an idea?

keep in mind the enclosure plays the most important role here...

TXwrxWagon

· #3 · Apr 23, 2009

max wattage crank the gain... lol.... once you have the voltage from the head unit established use a basic radio shack powered speaker, turn the source to 3/4 volume & set the gain to just below when it clips....

its a relatively new concept called SETTING GAINS...

Rob

ErinH

· #4 · Apr 23, 2009

tspence wants numbers. very odd thing... I understand wanting numbers, but solely relying on them is pretty silly to me. gotta test, too, my man.

dashan

· #5 · Apr 23, 2009

Set to normal. (12:00)

89grand

· #6 · Apr 23, 2009

You would either need to simulate it in a program like winISD or actually test the driver to know when it reaches maximum output. The rated power specs tell you nothing in that regard.

guitarsail

· #7 · Apr 23, 2009

dashan said:
Set to normal. (12:00)

Please...please tell me your joking...

subwoofery

· #8 · Apr 23, 2009

You won't be able to know exact #s coz the ZR will be in an IB alignment (unless you go sealed)...

Kelvin

shadowfactory

· #9 · Apr 23, 2009 (Edited)

xmax during what? music? test tones? audiobooks? seems pretty hard (and useless) to try and quantify or aim for an exact xmax when music is inherently dynamic and the volume knob is constantly changing

if you are unhappy with the current performance of your system, which all these useless questions suggest you are, calculator dick slapping will not change the things about your JL's you don't like (I'm guessing lack of midbass)

however taking everyone's advice when you made the driver selection (which you did not) would have yielded a better choice for your situation and a driver with better midbass performance in the first place (cough SLS8 cough)

and where's squeak9798 to defend spence? This is all junior high pedantics, right?

But seriously how the **** could ANYONE defend this guy?

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VP Electricity

· #10 · Apr 23, 2009

shadowfactory said:
xmax during what? music? test tones? audiobooks? seems pretty hard (and useless) to try and quantify or aim for an exact xmax when music is inherently dynamic and the volume knob is constantly changing

if you are unhappy with the current performance of your system, which all these useless questions suggest you are, calculator dick slapping will not change the things about your JL's you don't like (I'm guessing lack of midbass)

however taking everyone's advice when you made the driver selection (which you did not) would have yielded a better choice for your situation and a driver with better midbass performance in the first place (cough SLS8 cough)

I hurt my pancreas laughing again.

I think the worst thing I can imagine for my midbasses would be driving them to their xmax on purpose... because I then know what I would be doing by accident...

capnxtreme

· #11 · Apr 23, 2009

spence, seriously man. Have you learned anything throughout your fiasco here?

FoxPro5

· #12 · Apr 23, 2009

tspence73 said:

Not the first time; not the last. Good try. Seriously, who are you and why are you doing this to our forum? *cat pix r strong wit thiz one*

tspence73

Discussion Starter · #13 · Apr 24, 2009

I'm talking about "peak" transient here. How do I determine what wattage point the xmax is reached by say 50Hz in an IB enclosure? Right now I've set a peak of 175-watts. I'm just wondering if I could use more wattage on these midbasses. It doesn't hurt to have more power if I can use it.

shadowfactory

· #14 · Apr 24, 2009 (Edited)

tspence73 said:
I'm talking about "peak" transient here. How do I determine what wattage point the xmax is reached by say 50Hz in an IB enclosure? Right now I've set a peak of 175-watts. I'm just wondering if I could use more wattage on these midbasses. It doesn't hurt to have more power if I can use it.

again, peak during what, music? a farting noise burned on a cd? 'this american life' on the radio? how are you getting that number without using test equipment on your amplifier to verify its output? and how long of a 'peak' are you talking about? 5ms? 100ms? 3 hours?

and at what volume level will this 'peak' happen? do you always listen to music with the volume knob at the same position? does every song have the same 'peak' volume levels at the same frequencies?

in essence, what the **** are you talking about (its pretty obvious you don't even know). maybe squeak9798 can clue us in?

89grand

· #15 · Apr 24, 2009

What do you expect to gain by knowing how much power it takes for this mid to reach it's mechanical limit at 50hz?

How did you determine that you have setup the amp now to give the mid 175 watts at 50hz?

squeak9798

· #16 · Apr 24, 2009 (Edited)

shadowfactory said:
and where's squeak9798 to defend spence? This is all junior high pedantics, right?

You're about as brilliant as tspence, apparently. My point in the other thread was that his posts in that thread weren't really all that awful, yet he was continually berated because he is tspence.

And yes, feeling the need to degrade the guy every time he asks a question or makes a post is pretty ****ing petty and childish. If he's been such a problem for so long, why do you even read his posts? Why respond? Why not just skip it and move onto the next? You said you had put him on ignore, and yet here you are responding to his thread berating him. Does it make you feel better about yourself to point out how stupid he is rather than just leave it alone and ignore him?

But seriously how the **** could ANYONE defend this guy?

I'm not so much defending him as I am pointing out how moronic you guys are for always chasing him around and bashing him at every opportunity.

You apparently enjoy it though, as you haven't stopped yet........

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pontiacbird

· #17 · Apr 24, 2009

save yourself time and aggravation (with your setup and HERE as well).

Set it by ear...

1) Use a ball park setting, set the xovers at the usable range. The Xover settings will change.

2) If you have level matching, use it. Independent L / R would really help.

3) Reset the gain at the amp if necessary, if you have any noticable distortion at peaks.

Midbass gain settings, IMO, can get touchy. What sounds like emphasized midbass could easily be distortion characteristics....

It should not take too much power to reach 'maximum transients' in an IB setup (even for midbass).

Get a HU that lets you level match by driver (if you don't have one already).

If you set it by ear, you avoid all of the complicatedness you are putting yourself through in order to get maximum 'transients'.

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tspence73

Discussion Starter · #18 · Apr 24, 2009

89grand said:
What do you expect to gain by knowing how much power it takes for this mid to reach it's mechanical limit at 50hz?

How did you determine that you have setup the amp now to give the mid 175 watts at 50hz?

I used a 0db tone with a multi-meter for 50Hz, 60Hz, 70Hz, etc. I verified it didn't get anymore than 26.4 volts even with the highpass and lowpass filters on.

The reason for determining the mechanical limit is so that I can maintain/push the limit of the driver and keep mechanical distortion as low as possible.

89grand

· #19 · Apr 24, 2009

tspence73 said:
I used a 0db tone with a multi-meter for 50Hz, 60Hz, 70Hz, etc. I verified it didn't get anymore than 26.4 volts even with the highpass and lowpass filters on.

The reason for determining the mechanical limit is so that I can maintain/push the limit of the driver and keep mechanical distortion as low as possible.

You probably won't take this advice, but here's what I do. I set the gain on the midbass, or mid in a 3 way front stage, specifically the Infinity mid in your case, with an average level recording to get the maximum undistorted output near, but not at the volume controls maximum (to leave some volume adjustment for lower level recordings).

Then, I level match the rest of the system around it. You may find by level matching correctly that the JL midbass doesn't need to be within an inch of its life to blend with the system. There's no point in trying to do that other than to ruin the driver, or have a frequency unbalanced audio system.

Now, if the JL's are the weak link, although I doubt it, well then you're going to have to bring everything else down to it's safe level.

Again I ask though, what are you trying to achieve beyond getting max output from it? If it keeps up with the rest of the system, then leave it alone.

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ca90ss

· #20 · Apr 24, 2009

89grand said:
Now, if the JL's are the weak link, although I doubt it, well then you're going to have to bring everything else down to it's safe level.

Considering how low they're crossed I'd say the JL's are definitely the weak link as far as maximum output is concerned.

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