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Let me preface this by saying this is a "trying to understand thread", not a "judging" thread.

There is a line that is crossed when your system gets to a loudness level where you start damaging your ears, your bass gets way out of proportion with the rest of your speakers, etc. I have one 12" Dayton HO in a small sealed box and it's all I can handle. I can feel if I turn it up anymore, I'm going to really do some damage. I also find SPL competitions a strange concept (there's no SQ element at all?). Anyway, here's my questions for people with setups like four 10"s in their trunk.

- Do you ever wear ear plugs? What's the point of playing something louder than human hearing capabilities?

- Are you really just here to annoy people at stop lights and don't want to admit it?

- Do you care about SQ, or is it really just about the drop?


PS: Get off my lawn!
 

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Its about personal preference. I like more than less, but Im not hammering around the neighborhood at all hours either. I now have 2 subs in my truck and thats so I can hear them with the front speakers when Im rolling up the highway at 70mph with the windows down. To keep the quality up with the volume you need more air moving! Its not always about SPL.

Granted Ive been the kind of guy in the past, oh 15 years ago to have 4 12's in a Focus hatchback and beat myself up every drive. Surprisingly years of that abuse and I still have the best hearing of anyone I know. Drives my wife crazy because I hear crap she doesnt like a squeak or rattle and I have to go deal with it.

Really it rolls down to preference.
 

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human hearing is very forgiving at frequencies below 100 hz so all that bass isn't doing much if any damage to hearing, nothing permanent from what I've read. I like to have more than I need because more air moving with less movement from the actual speaker just sounds better, even if its not played loud most of the time.

its kind of like driving a prius, its fine most all the time, great car, does what you ask it to do and just works..but then theres that 1 jackass you need to pass to get over a lane to exit the freeway, and you just don't have the power like your old mustang had to do it..so you miss the exit and gps beeps and says rerouting..in that 1 moment you miss that power.
 

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If you haven't been in a vehicle capable of 140+ with music, then you'll never understand.

Also, ears and senses vary. Some like 4 bangers/6 cylinder engines with V-tech and to blow off valves and guys, others like women and V8's with real "natural" muscle.
 

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If you haven't been in a vehicle capable of 140+ with music, then you'll never understand.

Also, ears and senses vary. Some like 4 bangers/6 cylinder engines with V-tech and to blow off valves and guys, others like women and V8's with real muscle.
Haha, what the hell is this?

"You'll never understand"

and

"others like women and V8's with real muscle"

So, women and V8 engines go hand in hand, and if you don't like a car with a giant motor, then you don't like women? Real muscle? Power is power, and if a turbo 4 cylinder can keep up with a V8 that has twice as much displacement, that's not saying good things about the V8.

This is the most comical gatekeeping I've seen in a long time, thanks for the laugh.


OP, multiple subwoofers doesn't mean that the intention is SPL. A speaker that moves less, produces less distortion. Using multiples will allow you to reach a particular SPL while keeping excursion, and therefore distortion lower. Multiple woofers has just as much benefit to SQ as it does for SPL.
 

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Let me preface this by saying this is not a "judging" thread.

- Do you ever wear ear plugs? What's the point of playing something louder than human hearing capabilities?

- Are you really just here to annoy people at stop lights and don't want to admit it?

- Do you care about SQ, or is it really just about the drop?


PS: Get off my lawn!
No. What did you say?
Yes. There are loads of threads on here on diyma that talk about being loud at stop lights or shaking the windows at the drive-thru.
No. SQ is never discussed on this site.

PS: If it's too loud you're too old!

But seriously, have to spent much time reading this site?
 

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Sorry, I should also attempt to provide a reasonable answer instead of just sarcasm.

In addition to the reasons gijoe provided above, some people use multiple subs to resolve nulls/dead spots that can occur when using a single sub.
 

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human hearing is very forgiving at frequencies below 100 hz so all that bass isn't doing much if any damage to hearing, nothing permanent from what I've read.
Is there medical science that supports the "bass is less harmful" idea? Have you talked with an Audiologist? Everything mine told me suggested that loud bass is worse for your hearing than loud treble (if by treble we mean above 4K).

In addition, our personal definition of "loud bass" is in reality much louder than treble, causing us to **think** we're doing no long run damage when we actually are.
 

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Haha, what the hell is this?

"You'll never understand"

and

"others like women and V8's with real muscle"

So, women and V8 engines go hand in hand, and if you don't like a car with a giant motor, then you don't like women? Real muscle? Power is power, and if a turbo 4 cylinder can keep up with a V8 that has twice as much displacement, that's not saying good things about the V8.

This is the most comical gatekeeping I've seen in a long time, thanks for the laugh.
I know this thread got necrobumped but this made me laugh. No replacement for displacement for that instant kick in the ass a healthy v8 gives you. And I bet a higher displacement naturally aspirated v8 would outlast a turbo v6 by a good margin. To top it off the girls at my Alma Matre had a thing for v8 trucks (GM mainly). Bryant, AR was redneck as hell back in the 90's before things changed and there was a mass exodus out of Little Rock. So there is a sliver of truth to guys with a v8 under the hood getting the girl;)I drove a v6 F-150 at the time:blush:
 

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Is there medical science that supports the "bass is less harmful" idea? Have you talked with an Audiologist? Everything mine told me suggested that loud bass is worse for your hearing than loud treble (if by treble we mean above 4K).

In addition, our personal definition of "loud bass" is in reality much louder than treble, causing us to **think** we're doing no long run damage when we actually are.
I have spoken with an audiologist and they said bass wasn’t as harmful as higher frequencies. And this makes sense if you look at the frequencies most people start to lose first. And high frequency loss is not an age issue, it is an environmental issue. This was validated with a test of indigenous people in northern Canada where the elders did not have the hearing loss of most urban citizens. With that said, it doesn’t mean loud bass can’t cause hearing damage too, just that loud high frequencies would likely cause damage much quicker.
 

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I installed car stereos 20+ years ago and now I’m more into home theater than car audio though I will be running a single 12 in my car. Here are some reasons for multiple subs.

* Multiple subs driven at the same volume as a single sub of the same type will have less distortion, so better sound quality.
* Multiple lesser subs might be easier/cheaper to amplify than a single strong subwoofer amplifier. Meaning, a 500/600w sub channel on a 5-channel amp might be cheaper than getting a dedicated mono amp, assuming you’re going to buy multiple multi-channel amps anyway. I ran into this when I switched from a pair of SI BM MK Vs powered by the 5th channel on a pair of Alpine PDX-V9s to a single SI RM-12 and had to buy a 1x1200w Alpine PDX-M12.
* Multiple subs might help reach higher output at deeper frequencies. Just because you have the capability doesn’t mean you need to utilize the full capability. A single sub may not have as much output as desired below 30 Hz, as an example.
* if your sub has much more output potential but you don’t use the potential, the sound quality will be better because the sub won’t be pushed hard.
 

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I have spoken with an audiologist and they said bass wasn’t as harmful as higher frequencies. And this makes sense if you look at the frequencies most people start to lose first. And high frequency loss is not an age issue, it is an environmental issue. This was validated with a test of indigenous people in northern Canada where the elders did not have the hearing loss of most urban citizens. With that said, it doesn’t mean loud bass can’t cause hearing damage too, just that loud high frequencies would likely cause damage much quicker.
Makes sense now. I do know I like my top end rolled off a little more than most people I know.
 

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I have spoken with an audiologist and they said bass wasn’t as harmful as higher frequencies. And this makes sense if you look at the frequencies most people start to lose first. And high frequency loss is not an age issue, it is an environmental issue. This was validated with a test of indigenous people in northern Canada where the elders did not have the hearing loss of most urban citizens. With that said, it doesn’t mean loud bass can’t cause hearing damage too, just that loud high frequencies would likely cause damage much quicker.
Interesting. The way my doc explained it... the hearing part of your ear is like a tongue with hairs (cilia) all over the top and bottom, to hear a high pitch sound, the vibrations only have to shake the first (near the start of it) area of the hairs. To hear bass frequencies it has to move further and further down (longer waves), but this is shaking all the "treble hairs" along the way as well. 4KHz is typically a point of curve and this is where volume abuse induced hearing loss begins, near 4K then as those loosen and fall off it starts spreading out from there.

Very much agreed that it's not simply aging but modern noise. I'd heard of that study as well.
 

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I have (2) 12's in infinite baffle configuration. I want lots of headroom on the subwoofer so that I can hear the cello, tympani and string bass notes in Vivaldi, Mozart and Handel, but then be able to turn the subwoofer levels down when listening to Dire Straits and other acoustical numbers. Usually I keep the subwoofer volume on the head unit at 10% maybe 20% and its all I need.
 

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As others have said, it's primarily about head room and lower distortion. There's just something about the way bass sounds coming from large cone area. It's not always about being loud or using every ounce, but the ability to have large dynamic changes with less distortion.

And sometimes it's all about the window flex... lol...

Josh
 

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There is a line that is crossed when your system gets to a loudness level where you start damaging your ears, your bass gets way out of proportion with the rest of your speakers, etc.

I also find SPL competitions a strange concept (there's no SQ element at all?).

- Do you ever wear ear plugs? What's the point of playing something louder than human hearing capabilities?

- Do you care about SQ, or is it really just about the drop?
Once bass starts getting into the 110dB+ range, it will actually begin to make noticeable changes to the atmospheric pressure in the interior of a vehicle. U can quite literally feel the music in the air. U can even get it loud enough to vibrate your whole body and make it hard to breathe. I love that feeling -- and that's the point of playing something louder than human hearing capabilities.

As for SPL competitions, u could make a similar point about almost any competition. How well do u think a top-fuel dragster would do on a road course? U think Tiger Woods could be a star NFL player? SPL vehicles are specifically designed to do 1 thing as well as possible.

All that being said, my system is actually geared toward SQ. I got into car audio for the bass, but I stayed for the imaging and staging. Still love to change the atmospheric pressure in my car though!
 

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its kind of like driving a prius, its fine most all the time, great car, does what you ask it to do and just works..but then theres that 1 jackass you need to pass to get over a lane to exit the freeway, and you just don't have the power like your old mustang had to do it..so you miss the exit and gps beeps and says rerouting..in that 1 moment you miss that power.
A Prius in never fine. I'd consider riding my sister's bike before I'd drive a Prius.
 
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