[Todd Cinci]

Looking for some guides help. Have a 2016 GMC Sierra. 3 way active focal running on JL 800. Jl stealth box with two Jl 10 running on Jl 600. Jl fix 86 and Jl TWK 88. My issue is in Room Wizard. I have read all the training and referred to Andy’s approach etc. and try to follow all 24 LR.
Sub-60
Midbass- 80-500
Midrange- 500 - 2400
Tweeters- 2400

If you look at graph, the 1/6 RTA is my right channel... the green is left channel and yellow is curve. My struggle is on the twk 88 i have to lower the levels to -9 and -10 on midbass to get to curve and tweeters -12... I have read and that you should be leveling with gains verse levels on DSP. Is that the case. Wouldn't it be same outcome. Just doing it by level may have a little more noise since gain is higher etc. any advantage or disadvantage? Once I have that piece figure out, how do you guys level sides as I have read different things. I have just looked on RTA and tried to level match each channel side by side to look level on graph. I have also just used a DB meter and set each tweeter and midrange to same DB and tried to get midbass close. but matched both sides and then EQ.. is that correct? Just confused as I read so many things. Also I have been using 1/3 RTA to get to curve. If I use 1/6 or 1/12, I feel I eq a ton more but not sure how to determine which ones to leave alone. I even did Mic in 5 locations and averaged and still confused on what to change and what not to... I can always get to curve and it matches both sides perfectly, but some eq are -12.. Just trying to cut to the chase as this is becoming so very time consuming and I guess want to know in my mind that I am at least doing it correctly and maybe just the crappy song.. have all the test CD' as well and center imagine is good. just when I play music seems shallow and not the power.. when I run without eq the power is awesome but all over the place...

Final question is what is the preferred RTA... I see people say 1/6 or 1/12.. but it i feel I have a millon eq's to adjust verse 1/3. Is spectrum easier to work with and get closer will less EQ... I feel like I understand quite a bit but missing something for sure.. also, so I tried to switch slopes... I am all 24... today switched the sub and midbass to Butterworth 24 and seemed more power but didnt look at RTA... Just struggling as maybe this is too much or what an I missing.

 

[ckirocz28]

Looking for some guides help. Have a 2016 GMC Sierra. 3 way active focal running on JL 800. Jl stealth box with two Jl 10 running on Jl 600. Jl fix 86 and Jl TWK 88. My issue is in Room Wizard. I have read all the training and referred to Andy’s approach etc. and try to follow all 24 LR.
Sub-60
Midbass- 80-500
Midrange- 500 - 2400
Tweeters- 2400 View attachment 329480

If you look at graph, the 1/6 RTA is my right channel... the green is left channel and yellow is curve. My struggle is on the twk 88 i have to lower the levels to -9 and -10 on midbass to get to curve and tweeters -12... I have read and that you should be leveling with gains verse levels on DSP. Is that the case. Wouldn't it be same outcome. Just doing it by level may have a little more noise since gain is higher etc. any advantage or disadvantage? Once I have that piece figure out, how do you guys level sides as I have read different things. I have just looked on RTA and tried to level match each channel side by side to look level on graph. I have also just used a DB meter and set each tweeter and midrange to same DB and tried to get midbass close. but matched both sides and then EQ.. is that correct? Just confused as I read so many things. Also I have been using 1/3 RTA to get to curve. If I use 1/6 or 1/12, I feel I eq a ton more but not sure how to determine which ones to leave alone. I even did Mic in 5 locations and averaged and still confused on what to change and what not to... I can always get to curve and it matches both sides perfectly, but some eq are -12.. Just trying to cut to the chase as this is becoming so very time consuming and I guess want to know in my mind that I am at least doing it correctly and maybe just the crappy song.. have all the test CD' as well and center imagine is good. just when I play music seems shallow and not the power.. when I run without eq the power is awesome but all over the place...

Final question is what is the preferred RTA... I see people say 1/6 or 1/12.. but it i feel I have a millon eq's to adjust verse 1/3. Is spectrum easier to work with and get closer will less EQ... I feel like I understand quite a bit but missing something for sure.. also, so I tried to switch slopes... I am all 24... today switched the sub and midbass to Butterworth 24 and seemed more power but didnt look at RTA... Just struggling as maybe this is too much or what an I missing.

You should record the rta at 1/48 octave then smooth with "variable" smoothing, or 1/3 octave.
Regarding cutting with eq or amp gain, when level matching the speakers should mate up nicely at the xover point before eq, then use eq. Don't worry about cutting with eq, you really don't want to boost with eq.

 

[Todd Cinci]

You should record the rta at 1/48 octave then smooth with "variable" smoothing, or 1/3 octave.
Regarding cutting with eq or amp gain, when level matching the speakers should mate up nicely at the xover point before eq, then use eq. Don't worry about cutting with eq, you really don't want to boost with eq.

Wow. Thank you. Just went out and tried. Still have to fine tune, but going to 1/48 and knocking down the exact peak and flipping back to 1/3 helped a lot. Way less eq to get to curve. I think that’s what was confusing me, because for example if I used anything but 1/3, I just stayed there and that extra resolution made me eq everything. But going back and forth helped a lot. Thank you.

 

[ckirocz28]

Wow. Thank you. Just went out and tried. Still have to fine tune, but going to 1/48 and knocking down the exact peak and flipping back to 1/3 helped a lot. Way less eq to get to curve. I think that’s what was confusing me, because for example if I used anything but 1/3, I just stayed there and that extra resolution made me eq everything. But going back and forth helped a lot. Thank you.

You want as much resolution in the measurement as possible to see those narrow problem areas that may need special attention, but generally you want smoothing for the overall eq curve, too little smoothing will cause you to eq things that should be left alone. Apply smoothing in the "all spl" window or the eq window.

 

[Todd Cinci]

You want as much resolution in the measurement as possible to see those narrow problem areas that may need special attention, but generally you want smoothing for the overall eq curve, too little smoothing will cause you to eq things that should be left alone. Apply smoothing in the "all spl" window or the eq window.

That makes sense. Thank you. Only other question would be getting all levels aligned before eq. I spoke to JL and they said the level controls should be all at 0. And for the most part your mid and tweeter should register a little higher on RTA prior to EQ. In my case, the midbass and tweeter are both higher than mid range. So JL told me to lower the midbass gain and tweeter gain at amp to get more level. Wouldn’t lowering the level control on DSP do the same thing? I know I may have more noise with lowering inputs verse lowing gain. But not sure if I am missing something else. I only lower the midbass by -7 and tweeters by -4 to get in line. Then a little fine tune.

 

[tjk_bail]

2400hz for those tweets may be a little to low. I would bump up the LP on Mid-Range to 3k, and bump up the HP on those tweets to 3k.....

 

[Todd Cinci]

2400hz for those tweets may be a little to low. I would bump up the LP on Mid-Range to 3k, and bump up the HP on those tweets to 3k.....

I was trying to staying in 2x FS which FS for those tweeter is 1,200.. But yes, I will try 3k and see for sure... I tried 5k and didnt look good on REW... I am sure some of it because I have midrange in factory location on dash. They are angled but still factory and I have the tweeter in front of the mid in a POD next to the A Pillar. Wanted to put in A pillar but didnt want to go that far with fabrication etc.

 

[tjk_bail]

I looked up the specs on www.Crutchfield.com. This is posted there in regards to the tweets.. >>

' The crossovers use 2nd order high-pass and low-pass filters (12 dB/octave). The crossover point for both is 3 kHz. '

That FS calculation sure is a moving target..... I've seen people recommend to use 2.5 to 3 times the FS on tweeters. As the speaker gets larger, the crossover can be played closer to the speakers FS rating....Subs can be crossed below their FS.

 

[Todd Cinci]

I looked up the specs on www.Crutchfield.com. This is posted there in regards to the tweets.. >>

' The crossovers use 2nd order high-pass and low-pass filters (12 dB/octave). The crossover point for both is 3 kHz. '

That FS calculation sure is a moving target..... I've seen people recommend to use 2.5 to 3 times the FS on tweeters. As the speaker gets larger, the crossover can be played closer to the speakers FS rating....Subs can be crossed below their FS.

Makes sense. Thank you.

 

[Todd Cinci]

You want as much resolution in the measurement as possible to see those narrow problem areas that may need special attention, but generally you want smoothing for the overall eq curve, too little smoothing will cause you to eq things that should be left alone. Apply smoothing in the "all spl" window or the eq window.

Thank you again. Tried again today and worked out really well. Much better than what I have been doing. Wish I talked to you 8 months ago. So much information out there and trying to sort through what works and what doesn’t is hard. Still have trouble leveling volumes between channels to make sure equal before eq. Started by getting same db level for tweeter mid and midbass for both sides. Then look at it in smoothing. Line up and then eq and continue to look. Sounds good. Still need to fine tune but way better this time. Thanks again for help

 

[tjk_bail]

Have you heard of the 'Jazzi tuning companion' Excel spreadsheet? Its available on this web-site. It will create a speaker level curve file, that is used with REW, that you tune each speaker to. By using it, it will perfectly match each and every speaker in your system to perfection. You dont really need to try and level match very precisely at the beginning when tuning, something close like you have now would be close enough to get started, and using the speaker curves will bring each speaker to match levels with all other speakers,

 

[Todd Cinci]

Have you heard of the 'Jazzi tuning companion' Excel spreadsheet? Its available on this web-site. It will create a speaker level curve file, that is used with REW, that you tune each speaker to. By using it, it will perfectly match each and every speaker in your system to perfection. You dont really need to try and level match very precisely at the beginning when tuning, something close like you have now would be close enough to get started, and using the speaker curves will bring each speaker to match levels with all other speakers,

Thank you. Yes I have been using that. It’s very helpful for sure.