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i have a 2018 altima that doesn't have the bose sound system. i mounted a 2-way passive components in the doors and in the dash where the stock 3.5 finch mid location is. should i keep those tweeters in the dash or try to mount them where the windowsill is? i looked at that windowsill and it's not really optimal for doing a flush mount. i could drill a hole running speaker wire and just have the tweeter laying against the windowsill if it's better off axis.

right now using the passive crossovers. tweeters are very bright and doesn't sound that great. i'm thinking possibly because the reflecting off the windshield.

in the very near future i will be installing a JL audio twk and replacing the 4-channel amplifier with a zapco STX.P. when i get the new amp and the DSP i will be removing the passive crossover in the network and going full active.

components: Pioneer TS-Z65CH

261761
amp: phoenix gold RX2 400.4 (amp is new but i think it sucks. only channels 3 and 4 can be bridged. garbage amp stay away from)
 

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Phoenix Gold makes great amps, the inability to bridge a pair of channels hardly makes it a garbage amp.
Regarding the tweeters, you’ll want to test them in both places. Sometimes the windshield helps, sometimes it hurts, it depends on the tweeters distance to the glass, and the angle of the slope of the glass. You’ll want to find a way to temporarily mount them in different places and compare. Have you used the tweeter attenuation circuit in the passives to try and tame the tweeters?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Phoenix Gold makes great amps, the inability to bridge a pair of channels hardly makes it a garbage amp.
Regarding the tweeters, you’ll want to test them in both places. Sometimes the windshield helps, sometimes it hurts, it depends on the tweeters distance to the glass, and the angle of the slope of the glass. You’ll want to find a way to temporarily mount them in different places and compare. Have you used the tweeter attenuation circuit in the passives to try and tame the tweeters?
yes, i have it set at -3 DB on the crossovers. when the speakers were first installed a couple weeks ago they were at +3db which was way too bright. i had to take the head unit out to get access to the crossovers. this installer sucked.
 

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Before moving anything, try this...


...it might cure your problem, it might not, but at least you'll know if the location is a problem.

I might be about to buy those components very soon, so I'm interested in your thoughts
 

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...
... i'm thinking possibly because the reflecting off the windshield.
...
I doubt it. Many cars do the windscreen bounce, and it should be brightening it up. There is nothing to suck up the low freqs and leave the highs untouched ... at least nothing that I can imagine.
But it is possible.

You could probably undo them and tilt them towards you as a test to see if that is better or worse.
Is that easy to do?
(Then at least you would know the difference between direct versus reflected.)
 

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When you get the dsp that should help set up the tweets. I have a set in the same position in my daughters 2011 Camry and they sound great. I had to time them down a bit and After level matching and TA they sound great. The dsp will help a lot.

there is nothing wrong with the Phoenix gold amp. They are great amps. It would be a waste of funds to take a loss on it just to by a zapco. Just a few thoughts
 

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I run the exact same set of component speakers in two different cars, one with the tweets near the mirrors and the other with them up in the dash aimed at the windshield. After proper equalization, I haven't had anyone say the ones reflecting off the glass sounded any worse than the direct radiators. In fact, I'd argue that one sounds BETTER as far as imaging, but a lot of that is probably owed to the rest of the cars' interior designs/size. My vote would be to do whichever is easier or gives you the install look you prefer.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I run the exact same set of component speakers in two different cars, one with the tweets near the mirrors and the other with them up in the dash aimed at the windshield. After proper equalization, I haven't had anyone say the ones reflecting off the glass sounded any worse than the direct radiators. In fact, I'd argue that one sounds BETTER as far as imaging, but a lot of that is probably owed to the rest of the cars' interior designs/size. My vote would be to do whichever is easier or gives you the install look you prefer.
how do you like these speakers? i think i have mine a little underpowered and of course it's not properly tuned how i would like it. i just ordered a JL audio twk and haven't gotten a chance to install it. My biggest concerns with these speakers is its efficiency. i'm thinking one 15 sealed or ported in my trunk will completely overpower the speakers. i wonder if they will be loud enough with 80 Watts RMS going to each speaker for channel zapco STX. p active.
 

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how do you like these speakers? i think i have mine a little underpowered and of course it's not properly tuned how i would like it. i just ordered a JL audio twk and haven't gotten a chance to install it. My biggest concerns with these speakers is its efficiency. i'm thinking one 15 sealed or ported in my trunk will completely overpower the speakers. i wonder if they will be loud enough with 80 Watts RMS going to each speaker for channel zapco STX. p active.
If the tweeters are already too loud and too bright, then it seems that you may have enough power and volume to keep up with a loud subwoofer?
 

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You mentioned not enjoying your installer. Aside from that, lets focus on things that might help with the brightness issue.

First thing I would try is reversing the polarity of the tweeter. BUT BEFORE THAT....

  • Are you running the stock stereo yes or no?
  • How are you getting a signal to your amplifier from the head unit?
  • You said you are planning to upgrade. What is the time frame?
  • Are you going to keep the stock stereo?
from the response graph listed below, it seems that at about 3,200Hz to 7000Hz there is a hump in the cone tweeters response.




also..


261840


Sure A hood is still held up with a stick on cars that cost 4 million dollars. So.. Don't judge I guess :)

since it's essentially a balanced Dome Tweeter or basically a very small 29 mm cone driver I would suggest simply mounting it and treating it as such and that might help with some issues of it being a little bit bright. however most tweeters in this price range experience the same resonance or FS frequency so that's probably what's going on.

you can fix most of these things at the DSP later. so if you're going to go down that route I wouldn't bother fixing anything until you get your DSP and then you can start to go ahead and experiment with what you really want to do with placement of the Tweeter.


Now I'm not sure why people take off the grill of the tweeters, and why its a Nissan owners thing.... But the dude that told all of you to do it? He was pulling a fast one on everyone.
261844
 

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Discussion Starter #11 (Edited)
You mentioned not enjoying your installer. Aside from that, lets focus on things that might help with the brightness issue.

First thing I would try is reversing the polarity of the tweeter. BUT BEFORE THAT....

  • Are you running the stock stereo yes or no?
  • How are you getting a signal to your amplifier from the head unit?
  • You said you are planning to upgrade. What is the time frame?
  • Are you going to keep the stock stereo?
from the response graph listed below, it seems that at about 3,200Hz to 7000Hz there is a hump in the cone tweeters response.




also..


View attachment 261840

Sure A hood is still held up with a stick on cars that cost 4 million dollars. So.. Don't judge I guess :)

since it's essentially a balanced Dome Tweeter or basically a very small 29 mm cone driver I would suggest simply mounting it and treating it as such and that might help with some issues of it being a little bit bright. however most tweeters in this price range experience the same resonance or FS frequency so that's probably what's going on.

you can fix most of these things at the DSP later. so if you're going to go down that route I wouldn't bother fixing or a me anything until you get your DSP and then you can start to go ahead and experiment with what you really want to do with the driver's you own
my head unit is a Sony XAV-AX7000. i'm waiting to have the JL audio twk installed and everything tuned until i get either a sound integrity rm15 or a stereo integrity SQL 15. i just think this 10" fi audio SSD in a ported enclosure ain't cutting it for me. it just doesn't sound right for very fast double kick drum. tuning might help but i think i need to go with a 15 that has a strong motor suitable for SQ that can play loud.

i normally do my own installs but i got into a bad trucking accident a little over a month ago and my neck is all messed up. the one shop that i normally go to was booked up and i was impatient and i went with a shop that's all about SPL that doesn't have a clue about SQ.

this what kind of idiots i'm having to deal with... i asked them to run new speaker wire to the doors and dash all the way to the trunk along with the passive crossovers. this idiot installed brand new wire to the doors and dash and spliced the wires with 9 wire and stuffed the crossovers behind the head unit. totally defeated the purpose of running good 12 gauge ofc speaker wire by splicing it to cheap thin 9 wire. now i have to run wire like i was wanting to from the beginning and re wire the head unit. i also told this installer not to connect rear fill speakers to the 4-channel at all. i asked him to bridge to get maximum power left to right. later on we found out that the AMP they sold me you cannot bridge channels 1 and 2 only 3 and 4. they don't even know their own equipment!

this car audio shop thinks DD audio is the best of the best. their idea of a good system is 6 bullet tweeters mounted to the dash with 2 18"s with about ten thousand Watts going to it.





 

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A ported box will be louder, but will always suffer when it comes to very fast bass notes. The sound that comes from the rear of the subwoofer, and comes out the port will always lag behind the original note. The decay of a note is longer than natural in a ported box. If you want the extra output of a ported box, you have to accept what that comes with. By design, a ported box is louder, but will suffer from delay that a sealed box does not suffer from.
 

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later on we found out that the aunt they sold me

'=" \So.... How much? he didn't make you give up the Bentley did he? or bargain you out of the Rolls-Royce!
depending on the year make and model of the Aunt.,, they can fetch a pretty high price.

My Cousin Vinny's stepbrother Gupta once paid two whole camels for an aunt once. He said he got a screaming deal.
I'm a little bit surprised the aunt that you bought has four inputs. In fact , most of the time they only come with three...
maybe he was talking about a different kind of bridging?


I'm new here and I'm kind of need a car audio but I'm a construction worker. you see I know a thing or two about bridges...
261845


You know.. When I just have a shitty day or dealing with a shop. Its important to realize.. First world problems.
Before you know it? If you start letting pain and other people get to you? Next thing you know?
Your ON top of the couch.
261867




Bascily.. Think of your System in you car like and Investor. (No. I won't be showing the best Comic EVER created in Playboy) But.. I will tell you this.

Siri is NO goddamn HELP sometimes..Due a BIT of Areola, And Questionable Obesity, THis is a link..

The Back pain will get better. Keep Doing your Physical therapy, and I wonders of Wonders... I have not yet met a MAN in a single Youtube Channel that helps guys with recovering from Back Injuries. Its comical in fact that so much demand, and then we all go to the Magical pill that does @#All good for us.

If you got the know how? Let me tell you something that works. There is a SHIT ton of Kids /Young men and even Young women before they get all messed up from the school system that have a DAMN good Aptitude out there.


What you could do is offer to teach your skills on how to do it. And lets be honest man. Your going to be the BEST teacher out there. No school can come close to what you can do. If you get a young women over? Have your wife there to guard your back from any False allegations. Sucks. But as a Business owner? You know how it is. When you got money, Even the guys on Wallstreet have to protect themselves.

But have a Young kid come on in and learn something. Hell. Pay him in Old gear. Give that "Aunt" away. Plenty of young men like Mosfets , Inductors, Linear Field Semicondutores. :)

It would be a great way to get it done for you, and have it done right the first time. Its a WIN WIN for everyone.

That's how I would go about it. You have to use the Noodle to think your way out instead of settling for something you don't want. People got different tastes. That's a given. But that's why the SMART people... GET SOMEONE ELSE to do it FOR THEM. And under their direction. Again, Stereophile had an article on this YEARS ago about giving the customer what HE or she wants. And its been working GREAT for shops that do just that.


Don't let the Bad work of the shop get to you. A computer can't replace a Truck Driver. So get a better tool to do the job. In this case? Hire a set of hands that can help out. Everyone wins. And you get EXACTLY what you want. Your Back gets time to heal. And you get to sit and enjoy the fact that the knowledge you have gets put to good use.

Just my 2 cents.


ANYWAYS>..... About the Subwoofer.. If you like Music, and you have good speakers up front? I actually tend to prefer the sound of Large subwoofers as they don't have to move much from a travel point of view to get the same output since cone size. Just like Quarter wave antenna, nothing beats the signal quality you can get with one that is matched up to do the job. Mass of the cone for a 10 Inch driver due to stiffness needed and dampening can be more than that of the Moving part mass of a large driver. "There is no replacement for Displacement" makes a strong argument here as you get design in better linearity thus you can get better low end resolution in theory.

I would go with the larger woofer. You also get better sensitivity often as well. There is also that strange fact of life that you can't really HEAR the low notes but feel them due to wavelength of the lower Frequency band. Kind of amazing how physics work where you think inside the car it is not loud. But then outside of the car.. Its Perceived to be louder then when you are in it or it "Carries" a lot further.

Anywhoo.. Its' a GREAT Sunny day.. Smile. Your life's good man. Time for me to mow the lawn. And enjoy some time in the sun while the rain clouds are on a Coffee break.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
'=" \So.... How much? he didn't make you give up the Bentley did he? or bargain you out of the Rolls-Royce!
depending on the year make and model of the Aunt.,, they can fetch a pretty high price.

My Cousin Vinny's stepbrother Gupta once paid two whole camels for an aunt once. He said he got a screaming deal.
I'm a little bit surprised the aunt that you bought has four inputs. In fact , most of the time they only come with three...
maybe he was talking about a different kind of bridging?


I'm new here and I'm kind of need a car audio but I'm a construction worker. you see I know a thing or two about bridges...
View attachment 261845

You know.. When I just have a shitty day or dealing with a shop. Its important to realize.. First world problems.
Before you know it? If you start letting pain and other people get to you? Next thing you know?
Your ON top of the couch.
View attachment 261867



Bascily.. Think of your System in you car like and Investor. (No. I won't be showing the best Comic EVER created in Playboy) But.. I will tell you this.

Siri is NO goddamn HELP sometimes..Due a BIT of Areola, And Questionable Obesity, THis is a link..

The Back pain will get better. Keep Doing your Physical therapy, and I wonders of Wonders... I have not yet met a MAN in a single Youtube Channel that helps guys with recovering from Back Injuries. Its comical in fact that so much demand, and then we all go to the Magical pill that does @#All good for us.

If you got the know how? Let me tell you something that works. There is a SHIT ton of Kids /Young men and even Young women before they get all messed up from the school system that have a DAMN good Aptitude out there.


What you could do is offer to teach your skills on how to do it. And lets be honest man. Your going to be the BEST teacher out there. No school can come close to what you can do. If you get a young women over? Have your wife there to guard your back from any False allegations. Sucks. But as a Business owner? You know how it is. When you got money, Even the guys on Wallstreet have to protect themselves.

But have a Young kid come on in and learn something. Hell. Pay him in Old gear. Give that "Aunt" away. Plenty of young men like Mosfets , Inductors, Linear Field Semicondutores. :)

It would be a great way to get it done for you, and have it done right the first time. Its a WIN WIN for everyone.

That's how I would go about it. You have to use the Noodle to think your way out instead of settling for something you don't want. People got different tastes. That's a given. But that's why the SMART people... GET SOMEONE ELSE to do it FOR THEM. And under their direction. Again, Stereophile had an article on this YEARS ago about giving the customer what HE or she wants. And its been working GREAT for shops that do just that.


Don't let the Bad work of the shop get to you. A computer can't replace a Truck Driver. So get a better tool to do the job. In this case? Hire a set of hands that can help out. Everyone wins. And you get EXACTLY what you want. Your Back gets time to heal. And you get to sit and enjoy the fact that the knowledge you have gets put to good use.

Just my 2 cents.


ANYWAYS>..... About the Subwoofer.. If you like Music, and you have good speakers up front? I actually tend to prefer the sound of Large subwoofers as they don't have to move much from a travel point of view to get the same output since cone size. Just like Quarter wave antenna, nothing beats the signal quality you can get with one that is matched up to do the job. Mass of the cone for a 10 Inch driver due to stiffness needed and dampening can be more than that of the Moving part mass of a large driver. "There is no replacement for Displacement" makes a strong argument here as you get design in better linearity thus you can get better low end resolution in theory.

I would go with the larger woofer. You also get better sensitivity often as well. There is also that strange fact of life that you can't really HEAR the low notes but feel them due to wavelength of the lower Frequency band. Kind of amazing how physics work where you think inside the car it is not loud. But then outside of the car.. Its Perceived to be louder then when you are in it or it "Carries" a lot further.

Anywhoo.. Its' a GREAT Sunny day.. Smile. Your life's good man. Time for me to mow the lawn. And enjoy some time in the sun while the rain clouds are on a Coffee break.
[/QUOTE
wow! you have a way with words i'm very impressed. i'm definitely not the best installer but i know the basics. this shop here is an embarrassment. yes, i should have got my nephew to help me. i will most certainly get this finished on my own account not somebody else's. and you are right about going with a larger woofer. thanks for your insight
 

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I use a set of comps that people don’t like on this forum in my daughters car. I will admit that I ran them active and they sound awesome but I had to hook the up using the supplied crossovers and I did not care for them when a channel went out on her amp. However, after getting the amp repaired and installed they sound amazing again running active with the Dayton dsp. I guess what I’m saying is that you might be shocked when you run the active and get rid of the passive stock crossovers.
 
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