Unless its an older car that it would be questionable where the tag originally was I would not do it. Altering or transferring a VIN tag is actually a federal offense. If you get the wrong inspector and he calls the cops you could go to jail for it. I would try to fiberglass around the opening and make some sort of window down to the original location so you can still see it thru the windshield.

I did a VIN swap between 2 truck cabs once. I pulled a rust free cab out of the junk yard and I swapped it with the original cab. The original VIN was what I wanted so I swapped. I got a long education from the inspector when I re-registered the truck.

 

Technically tampering with the VIN plates on a vehicle is illegal. Will the car still pass inspection? That all depends on who does the inspection and how much of a stickler they are.

 

Most car's and trucks have the vin code on the driver's side door as well, plus on the dash. Lot's of vehicle's i work on i can't see the vin code on the dash so i open the driver's door and look for it there. G.m Ford Dodge All have a sticker with the vin info affixed to the door, most import's have a plate riveted to the door area as well. my hyundai has pod's on the dash that block the dash vin plate never had a problem at test time. ymmv

 

So it all comes down to when in doubt, leave it as is and play it safe.

 

Haha, or... It's better to ask for forgiveness than to ask for permission.

With all of the other VINs throughout the car, I don't think it's a big deal at all. I think that there is a very small chance of ever having it come up, and if it does come up, I think the consequences would be small. However, that's why I posted the topic, it's very possible that others have made the same changes and gotten into trouble that was greater than the benefit from doing the modification. The VINs will all still match, one will just be 2" from where it was originally. I don't usually have a problem breaking a rule as long as the intent of the rule isn't being broken.

I'm looking to see if there is anyone who did it and suffered real consequences.

 

When dealing with classic/collector cars, I've seen DOT inspectors "freeze" cars that have had the vin plate removed, car painted, then reattached with new rivets, in the exact same location.
Personally I would never tamper with a vin plate. Period.
It may never come up, during an inspection, but if you sell the car, and the buyer sues you because the vin tag has been illegally tampered with, pretty sure you are liable.

I like NavyChief's window idea.

 

It's illegal. You don't ask for forgiveness with the DMV...you better ask first.

But no way I would move or alter a VIN or VIN location.

 

This is one of those things where intent doesn't come into play.

Chances are you won't get caught by someone who cares. But if you do, the standard procedure is impounding the car, and possibly arrest. You will then have to prove in court that you didn't do it for purposes of fraud, pay major fines, and pay to have it re-attached in the stock location by your state highway patrol in order to get the car back. In fact, they use special rivets, so even if you remove it and place it back in the same place, cops who know what they are doing can tell and that's enough to impound it.

 

So you want to ask for forgiveness first or ask if you can do it first with the chance of going to jail and haven't your car taken?

 

They do use hollow rivets to attach it.
If I remember correctly Colorado law said VIN must be unobstructed, nowhere it says it must be in one designated spot. right lower corner is a spot it`s expected, not required.
State emission station look at the vin on B pillar, barcode they scan, never read vin manually. so technically you can cover your vin and go to emission station to verify their standard procedure.

 

Per NHTSA:
The VIN for passenger cars, multipurpose passenger vehicles, low-speed vehicles, and trucks of 10,000 lbs. or less gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) must be located inside the passenger compartment and readable, without moving any part of the vehicle, through the vehicle glazing (windshield) from outside the vehicle adjacent to the left windshield pillar.18 This is commonly called the “public VIN.”

Officers of the law know that cars in the US have a VIN viewable from outside the vehicle adjacent to the left windshield pillar.
IMO, move it and you just gave them probable cause to confiscate your vehicle.

 

If it makes you feel any luckier I bought a 93 Bonneville SSE. I was supposed to get the title from the guy but he ended up going to jail for a long time. So I couldn't get him to go order a copy to give me. I took the title from another Bonneville I owned told the DMV I changed the color and registered it. I drove it for a coulpe years, then sold it to a friend who was also aware of the title issue and he drove it for a few years. As I was a teenager I was issued several tickets with no issue. My friend actually destroyed it in an accident and no one ever noticed the vin discrepancy. As I am now much older now I can't suggest these type of actions but I can tell you authorities are not as observant as they should be.

As you not altering your vin, just moving I would call your local salvage title inspection station and see what is acceptable for your state. They are the experts for homemade and modified vehicle legalities.

 

Sound advice right here.

 

The problem is its governed by federal law. So your local guys might be fine with it, but get pulled over for anything by a state trooper, and they are more likely to nail you for it.

There are exemptions for custom vehicles, but to be a custom vehicle, you must modify the vehicle to the point that its not recognizable as any production vehicle, or be a true custom vehicle.

 

Cant speak to Colorado but here in Georgia, removing or altering the VIN is a FELONY. I wouldnt mess with it. You get pulled over and the cop goes to run your VIN, youre gonna go to jail. The law does state that youre guilty of a felony if you alter it in order to conceal or misrepresent which you obviously wouldnt be doing so you would likely beat it in court but youd still get a ride to the county jail with a hefty bond and since its not a common charge, I doubt it would have a preset bond so you would most likely have to spend the night in jail til you could get in front of a magistrate to have a bond set and then it would be around $2500 or more.

Again, I only know Georgia law so it may be different in Colorado but I wouldnt risk it.

 

^that mirrors federal law. So if you get caught anywhere in the country by a cop that decides to enforce it, that's what will happen.

I cancelled an entire build design because of this. Where the vin is mounted in my old neon prevented me from taking full advantage of my dash.

Permanently removing airbags is a felony too.

 

It's a federal offense to open someone else's mail, but you can go to the post office and get a exemption. This is the United States of America the land of catering to every individual. I am sure there is away around it. Since you are allowed to completely remove a dash and put in one from a different car as long as you tell them during the registration process there is alternate vin numbers I am pretty sure you can move it a few inches to a preapproved location.

 

Not saying there isn't a way but I don't know of one. I definitely wouldn't touch it until I knew for sure I had an exception because you can and most likely will go to jail and be out several hundred dollars to a bondsman not to mention looking at a MINIMUM of one year in jail (again, Georgia law). All it takes is one traffic stop where the cop checks your VIN or you roll thru a sobriety checkpoint and the cop noticed the VIN in the wrong place.

 

Vin is still intact and still visible through windshield I highly doubt any popo will give a damn about it being 4 inches closer to the center of WS.

 

Lot of doomsday advice here. There is a big difference between: "destroying" "removing" "altering" and "moving." And unless you have actually read the case law and/or administrative decisions dealing with the various definitions of these terms in the context of VINs, then your opinions are just that.

 

The facts: At least here

It is against the law to possess a motor vehicle or any part of a motor vehicle that has a vehicle identification number that is

destroyed
altered
defaced
concealed
removed
Law enforcement will seize (or confiscate) any motor vehicle or motor vehicle part that is determined to have an altered or missing identification number. The municipality where the ‘unidentifiable’ motor vehicle or part is seized can sell the vehicle or part at a public auction.

Penal

§ 170.70 Illegal possession of a vehicle identification number.
A person is guilty of illegal possession of a vehicle identification
number when:
(1) He knowingly possesses a vehicle identification number label,
sticker or plate which has been removed from the vehicle or vehicle part
to which such label, sticker or plate was affixed by the manufacturer in
accordance with 49 U.S.C. section 32101, et seq. and regulations
promulgated thereunder or in accordance with the provisions of the
vehicle and traffic law; or
(2) He knowingly possesses a vehicle or vehicle part to which is
attached a vehicle identification number label, sticker or plate or on
which is stamped or embossed a vehicle identification number which has
been destroyed, covered, defaced, altered or otherwise changed, or a
vehicle or vehicle part from which a vehicle identification number
label, sticker or plate has been removed, which label, sticker or plate
was affixed in accordance with 49 U.S.C. section 32101, et seq. or
regulations promulgated thereunder, except when he has complied with the
provisions of the vehicle and traffic law and regulations promulgated
thereunder; or
(3) He knowingly possesses a vehicle, or part of a vehicle to which by
law or regulation must be attached a vehicle identification number,
either (a) with a vehicle identification number label, sticker, or plate
which was not affixed by the manufacturer in accordance with 49 U.S.C.
section 32101, et seq. or regulations promulgated thereunder, or in
accordance with the provisions of the vehicle and traffic law or
regulations promulgated thereunder, or (b) on which is affixed, stamped
or embossed a vehicle identification number which was not affixed,
stamped or embossed by the manufacturer, or in accordance with 49 U.S.C.
section 32101, et seq. or regulations promulgated thereunder or in
accordance with the provisions of the vehicle and traffic law or
regulations promulgated thereunder.
Illegal possession of a vehicle identification number is a class E felony

Says nothing about moving vin numbers to another visible location on the same part.

 

Yeah chances are you could easily convince a cop of the situation because you have a speaker pod there and it would match the VIN on your door and engine block and he could check the registration and if all 3 came back to the same car you wouldn't get locked up. However if you get a fanatic or some 22 year old hotshot fresh out of the academy looking to change the world you could have a problem. The Georgia state patrol are fanatics. They got thru nearly a year long military style academy and all they do is traffic. They will give you a lot less slack.

I checked my code book and the felony is if you alter your plate with "intent to misrepresent". If you just remove or alter it, it's a misdemeanor. The hangup is the term "alter". Is moving the VIN plate "altering" it?

I also looked at mine and my wife's car. The VIN plate is positioned to where it shows thru a small window in the blacked out bottom of the windshield. If I moved it a couple inches, there would be no way to see it. Not sure how the OP's car is set up tho.

Either way I just would not do it. Even if you won in court, a VIN plate that has been moved would be probable cause for me to arrest you and impound your car. It would all depend on how inflexible the cop was and there are a lot of inflexible cops out there.

 

This is in NO Way a shot across the bow, of the OP, but directed more towards the conversation as a whole.

How anyone with a family/dependents, could begin to rationalize the pros and cons of possibly breaking Federal law, for something as fickle as speaker placement, is beyond me.

 

:laugh::laugh:what a bunch of pussies here......
Altering vin mean changing numbers/letters, moving it few inches does not mean squat. anyone ever bought salvage title one?
it`s a piece of cake to get vin verification from DMV all they do is looking for the readable vin that match registration papers.
once it match they stamp the papers and send you on your way.

I`d do it and that will not break any law. don`t believe me- consult your attorney.
I used to have a motorcycle with salvage title, there was empty place on the frame where vin plate was located.DMV issued a sticker with Vin printed on metal like plastic, affixed it to the frame and that`s it. was stopped many times without single problem and cops around here love to check motorcycles.

 

From what I read, in 2006 the law changed for 2 wheeled vehicles.

 

changed how?

 

How they were classified. Would have to go and find the stuff again...but not tonight.

 

Every bike i registered since 2005 they checked very carefully unlike cars. salvage was nightmare to get all paperwork in order. I have no knowledge about any changes in classification of 2wheeled vehicles but some of them cost more than average car and some salvage was recovered stolen bikes. I only was able to get liability insurance on them.
vin sticker they issued was same kind they do for home build trailers- metalised plastic label.

 

It all depends on your luck. You may never get caught. You also may never get caught by someone who cares. But it is illegal to move it, and it could be very very bad if you did get that one that cares. It's even illegal to sell the rivets that the highway patrol and dmv use to affix the vin plate to anyone else. I did a lot of research before scrapping my last project. I drive for a living and couldn't risk it.

Case in point. I had a 97 dodge neon with the 3 speed auto. Got 28 mpg on the freeway. 5 speed manual swaps are simple, and hundreds if not over a thousand people have done them. I did one. I'm priced my gas mileage to more than 40 mpg. But, my car was a tlev, which was made to California standards. Basically, if you have a sohc 5 speed, dohc auto, or dohc 5 speed neon, you can mix and match any engine and transmission combo that came in your year neon or newer. You could even swap in the turbo engine from the srt-4.

But if you have a sohc auto, made for california, you can't change anything. Of course, this depends on the vin being ran and someone noticing that it was a tlev, and then noticing that it had been changed.

Long story short, I got caught. Went through a few smog inspections with no issues, then the place hired a new tech, and he red flagged it. Instant registration suspension. Dmv tells me either put the stock tranny back in, or never drive it on the road again. Car got junked.